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 Post subject: Dist hold down
PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 10:06 am 
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Turbo Slant 6

Joined: Sun Aug 25, 2013 2:14 pm
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Both of these deals were attached to slant dist I have, why the difference? My engine is 1986 and am assuming I should be using the smaller version since my hold down clamp bolt wont even pass thru the slot in the larger version.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 10:33 am 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 12763
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model*: 76 D100
The bracket on the left is the older style that offered a limited range of adjustment. There were two slots for adjustment- the one on the block that you commonly use and a much harder to get at one under the body of the distributor.

The one on the right is the "modern" hold down that came into use in the late 70s/early 80s. The part you are holding is the "ring" that was bolts onto the bottom of the distributor body. There was also a "claw" that bolted to the block and put pressure on the "ring" and held the distributor in place. The "claw" hold down offered near 360 degrees of adjustability and was must easier to work with if you were timing an engine from scratch. Plus, it is nearly identical to the v-8 distributor hold downs so the uninformed v-8 guys wouldn't get confused when they tried to work on a slant six.

The claw version is much more desirable, provided you have the matching ring. The ring is a slant six distributor only piece. Either system can be used on any slant six, provided you have the complete system. THe older system has the virtue of being a single piece and much more common. The newer system is easier to use and is more adjustable, but has two pieces and is harder to find complete.

Someone should make a pattern of the ring and claw and sell some reproduction pieces.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 11:49 am 
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Turbo Slant 6

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Hey thanks, anytime you want a pattern just ask


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 12:50 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 12763
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model*: 76 D100
Nah, I've already got at least one extra set. Thanks for the offer though.


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 Post subject: Update...
PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 1:14 pm 
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Board Sponsor
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Joined: Tue Oct 29, 2002 8:27 pm
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Location: Salem, OR
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Quote:
The bracket on the left is the older style that offered a limited range of adjustment. There were two slots for adjustment- the one on the block that you commonly use and a much harder to get at one under the body of the distributor.


The bracket on the left is common from 1960-1978 model years...it also came in some variations of stampings with more or less slot for the block adjustment...the Ring and Clamp can be found from the 1979 model year up to the end in 1987...

As Reed stated the claw and ring are much more desired as you don't have to use a distributor wrench to get more adjustment when dialing more initial timing...With the advent of 80's van's and trucks being more common now in junkyards and the junk monkey pulling the dizzy and tossing the claw...it makes getting the claw the harder peice to find (it is not the same as the small block or big block claws...so they can't be modified to get them to clamp right or fit the ring...)...

I have about 20 rings and no claws...the problem with making the pattern is the claw is made of stamped and tempered steel...so even though we could laser cut a set of 12 gauge claws...the cost for that and getting them heated and quenched kind of kills the deal for most do it youselfers...the softer steel will just wear away on the ring until you loose your timing one day....

-D.Idiot


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 4:14 am 
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Personally, I don't like the Claw type on the early engine. There is no boss on the block for the back end of the claw to seat against.

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65 Valiant 100 2dr post 170 turbo
66 Valiant Signet 225 nitrous
64 Valiant Signet
64 Valiant 4dr 170


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 Post subject: Interesting...
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 5:31 am 
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Location: Salem, OR
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Quote:
Personally, I don't like the Claw type on the early engine. There is no boss on the block for the back end of the claw to seat against.



Good to know, how early is early? One of my hi-comp blocks is a 1963 truck block and it worked with the claw just like my 67 and 70's blocks.

-D.Idiot


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 Post subject: Re: Interesting...
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 7:09 am 
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SL6 Racer & Moderator
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DusterIdiot wrote:
Quote:
Personally, I don't like the Claw type on the early engine. There is no boss on the block for the back end of the claw to seat against.



Good to know, how early is early? One of my hi-comp blocks is a 1963 truck block and it worked with the claw just like my 67 and 70's blocks.

-D.Idiot


Oh, it might work, but I was concerned it would not clamp tight enough, without that "boss", to support the rear of the clamp. Running nitrous, I don't need the distributer turning on its own. I don't know what year all my blocks are, but of 12 of them, none have the boss. I should have a cast crank block somewhere, I will try to find it, and look.

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Charrlie_S
65 Valiant 100 2dr post 170 turbo
66 Valiant Signet 225 nitrous
64 Valiant Signet
64 Valiant 4dr 170


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:49 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Joined: Wed Mar 25, 2009 5:56 pm
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Location: TEXAS
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Quote:
I have about 20 rings and no claws..


D.I.- PM me if you are able to part with one of those rings? I could use one! -Thanks Dan

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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 4:16 pm 
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1 BBL (New)

Joined: Thu May 09, 2019 5:39 pm
Posts: 3
Car Model*: 1964 valiant 225
Reed wrote:
The bracket on the left is the older style that offered a limited range of adjustment. There were two slots for adjustment- the one on the block that you commonly use and a much harder to get at one under the body of the distributor.

The one on the right is the "modern" hold down that came into use in the late 70s/early 80s. The part you are holding is the "ring" that was bolts onto the bottom of the distributor body. There was also a "claw" that bolted to the block and put pressure on the "ring" and held the distributor in place. The "claw" hold down offered near 360 degrees of adjustability and was must easier to work with if you were timing an engine from scratch. Plus, it is nearly identical to the v-8 distributor hold downs so the uninformed v-8 guys wouldn't get confused when they tried to work on a slant six.

The claw version is much more desirable, provided you have the matching ring. The ring is a slant six distributor only piece. Either system can be used on any slant six, provided you have the complete system. THe older system has the virtue of being a single piece and much more common. The newer system is easier to use and is more adjustable, but has two pieces and is harder to find complete.

Someone should make a pattern of the ring and claw and sell some reproduction pieces.


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 Post subject: Re: Dist hold down
PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 6:16 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2015 5:55 am
Posts: 1052
Location: Brightwood, VA
Car Model*: 1965 Plymouth Belvedere I
The "older" style works on any slant block. The "newer" style really only works on blocks cast specifically for the claw style. Also, the slant six distributor claw is unique to the slant six, nothing else really works. I have two engines, one of each style. It might be possible to make some other clamp style work on earlier blocks, but it won't be anything that directly bolts on. I prefer the claw style mount and would like to make something 'claw like' work on the earlier blocks.

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-MattMan
Strive for Excellence, not Perfection.
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 Post subject: Re: Dist hold down
PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 6:33 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 12763
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model*: 76 D100
Badvert65 wrote:
The "older" style works on any slant block. The "newer" style really only works on blocks cast specifically for the claw style.



I dispute this. I have used the "claw" on pre-76 engines with zero problems. I have a 76 engine, an 83 engine, and an unknown year engine in my garage. I will look at the distributor mounting area and see if there is any difference. I don't think there is.


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 Post subject: Re: Dist hold down
PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 7:03 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2015 5:55 am
Posts: 1052
Location: Brightwood, VA
Car Model*: 1965 Plymouth Belvedere I
This pic (1979 block) shows the "ledge" that gives the claw leverage for clamping. Without something for the lip of the claw to lever against, it just bolts flat down onto the flat machined block surface (earlier style blocks) and the lip just hangs over the edge without pushing against anything. It will still give some clamping action on earlier blocks, but not nearly as much as on the later blocks. This pic shows an aluminum claw I made from a piece of aluminum angle. It does the job quite well, but was a pain to make.
Attachment:
IMG_1284a.jpg
IMG_1284a.jpg [ 62.46 KiB | Viewed 3322 times ]


This pic is of the factory claw from my 1979 block (I drilled the extra holes in it).
Attachment:
IMG_0595.jpg
IMG_0595.jpg [ 29.27 KiB | Viewed 3322 times ]
Attachment:
web_0597.jpg
web_0597.jpg [ 17.31 KiB | Viewed 3317 times ]

_________________
-MattMan
Strive for Excellence, not Perfection.
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 Post subject: Re: Dist hold down
PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2019 7:36 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 12763
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model*: 76 D100
Hmmmm. I have a hard time believing the block was modified just for the hold down, but those are good pictures. I will investigate further.


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 Post subject: Re: Dist hold down
PostPosted: Thu May 30, 2019 4:39 am 
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Turbo EFI
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Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2015 5:55 am
Posts: 1052
Location: Brightwood, VA
Car Model*: 1965 Plymouth Belvedere I
I am just showing pics of what I have found out. I have no idea when the claw style mount started, but I believe it was mid to late 70's. The block is indeed different for the claw mount, but I am not saying the claw will not work on earlier blocks, I am saying it doesn't work nearly as well on the blocks without the cast in ledge (or at least a wide enough machined area for the lip of the claw to get leverage). I can post pics later of the claw on a 73 block (without the ledge).
jus sayin

_________________
-MattMan
Strive for Excellence, not Perfection.
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