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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 10:18 pm 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''
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Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:30 am
Posts: 32
Location: Houston
Car Model*: 1980 Chrysler lebaron 3.7l 225ci
So I purchased this beauty because I have never seen this car until I was searching on the web and it appeared and it seem like a rare find to me seeing that I see classics all the time but nothing like this one. Yes it has patina but I like it. It was parked at a mechanic shop/storage and was owned by a older lady that let it sit but paid for where it was stored.She had a couple other cars there, said it ran before it sat but don't know how reliable that is cause it was 5 years ago but I tried to to jump it nothing. Put anew battery crank slow nothing then drained.So I jumped it off still draining so I bought alternator fix the problem for drain but no start. And then I moved to the distributor not turning at all but engine cranks.

So I looked at the gear 5 teeth gone and distributor seized so I rebuilt the distributor but I did not mess with the new pickup coil just put it together 9/10 the problem. Put it together set the engine on tdc with vallve cover off and realized had two stuck valves. I unstuck the valves with fresh oil, lil tapping and then everything moved freely. I pointed rotor to the number one cylinder. Replaced coil, plug ,wires, fuel pump ,filter ,and carb bowl gas was bad but carb was clean and looked new. So I dropped the tank bad gas and a lil rust inside so I cleaned it ,and drained oil 2 gallons of water and a slow drip of sludge. So I then knew it experience Harvey sad :( I know but it won't and still hasn't stop me.

I gave it a super flush 5 times with cheap supertechoil and la totally awesome mixed together and no more slug or milky looking substance at at all. I put fresh oil and let it sit a few weeks all was good so I thought maybe it was parked cause a head gasket problem so I checked radiator full to the top. So I drained it 5 years old coolant no good and topped it off with new coolant no leaks any wear. So now everything together but I haven't put the gas tank. Idk if I'm getting spark acts like it wants to crank up with gas then nothing. Pour gas in the carb acts like it wants to start up then just cranks, if you go out the next day and just turn the key it will act like it wants to crank up then it just cranks

Need help will really appreciate it. Thanks


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 11:03 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 12342
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model*: 82 Ramcharger, 76 D100
MotorHoggGears wrote:
I pointed rotor to the number one cylinder.


Hello and welcome. I believe pointing the rotor at the #1 cylinder is where you went wrong. I don't know where that "point the rotor at the #1 cylinder" trick came form, but it does not apply to slant sixes. On a slant six, the #1 spark plug tower is traditionally the tower at about 4-5 o'clock as you look down at the distributor. It is almost directly above the vacuum advance can.

What you need to do is pull the valve cover and rotate the crank by hand, watching the movement of the valves on the #1 cylinder (the culinder closest to the radiator). Rotate the crank until you see the #1 intake valve open and close. Now watch the timing mark on the damp. Rotate the crank until the timing mark lines up with the ")" mark on the timing tab. Your motor should now be more or less at TDC on the compresison stroke of the #1 cylinder.

Now look at the distributor. The rotor should be pointing roughly at 4-5 o'clock. If it isn't, either rotate the distributor body or realign the distributor drive gear until it does. You may need to pull the distributor, rotate the shaft, and reinstall the distributor to get it where you need it to be.

Try that and see if the engine doesn't start.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 11:13 pm 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''
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Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:30 am
Posts: 32
Location: Houston
Car Model*: 1980 Chrysler lebaron 3.7l 225ci
Reed wrote:
MotorHoggGears wrote:
I pointed rotor to the number one cylinder.


Hello and welcome. I believe pointing the rotor at the #1 cylinder is where you went wrong. I don't know where that "point the rotor at the #1 cylinder" trick came form, but it does not apply to slant sixes. On a slant six, the #1 spark plug tower is traditionally the tower at about 4-5 o'clock as you look down at the distributor. It is almost directly above the vacuum advance can.

What you need to do is pull the valve cover and rotate the crank by hand, watching the movement of the valves on the #1 cylinder (the culinder closest to the radiator). Rotate the crank until you see the #1 intake valve open and close. Now watch the timing mark on the damp. Rotate the crank until the timing mark lines up with the ")" mark on the timing tab. Your motor should now be more or less at TDC on the compresison stroke of the #1 cylinder.

Now look at the distributor. The rotor should be pointing roughly at 4-5 o'clock. If it isn't, either rotate the distributor body or realign the distributor drive gear until it does. You may need to pull the distributor, rotate the shaft, and reinstall the distributor to get it where you need it to be.

Try that and see if the engine doesn't start.


Ok I will first thing tomorrow and what do you mean by intake on #1 will open and close and I set it with both valves closed is that where I went wrong ??


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:18 am 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
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Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model*: 82 Ramcharger, 76 D100
As I said, I think you went wrong pointing the rotor at cylinder number one instead of the spark plug tower on the cap for cylinder number one.

When I say watch the intake valve on cylinder one for it to open and then close, I mean exactly that. The cylinder will be at TDC with the valves closed twice in the four stroke cycle--once at TDC on the compression stroke, and once atTDC on the exhaust stroke. You want to set the base timing with the piston at TDC on the compression stroke. To ensure the piston is at TDC on the compression stroke, you watch the valve movement to make sure it is at TDC immediately after the intake stroke, which would be TDC on compression.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:26 am 
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EFI Slant 6

Joined: Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:29 pm
Posts: 328
Location: Houston
Car Model*:
The fastest and bestest way to establish where #1 is in terms of compression and rotor position is to remove the spark plug (no need to remove the valve cover) then crank the engine with your finger over the spark plug hole. When you feel the compression reach a state of heightened frenzy...that is when the rotor should be at the #1 position on the cap.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:29 am 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''
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Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:30 am
Posts: 32
Location: Houston
Car Model*: 1980 Chrysler lebaron 3.7l 225ci
Ok I understand but I don't have a bolt in the harmonic balancer so I'm doing it with a bump start till I feel the compression with my fingers and couldn't find what size it is.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:34 am 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''
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Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:30 am
Posts: 32
Location: Houston
Car Model*: 1980 Chrysler lebaron 3.7l 225ci
So when the air pushes my finger that tdc on compression, cause I normally try to line it up with the hb to zero is that where I'm going wrong??


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:44 am 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 12342
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model*: 82 Ramcharger, 76 D100
You should be able to rotate the crank using the fan and belts, unless it has a clutch fan.

I don't like the "air comes out the hole" method of finding TDC because air can be pushed out of the spark plug hole on the exhaust stroke, too. Watching the valves is the surest way to know you are on the compression stroke.

But put the #1 piston at tdc and point the distributor rotor at the plug tower around 4-5 o'clock and try again.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 9:21 am 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''
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Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:30 am
Posts: 32
Location: Houston
Car Model*: 1980 Chrysler lebaron 3.7l 225ci
Yea it has a fan clutch just spins
And which one is the intake valve?


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 9:43 am 
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Supercharged
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Posts: 12342
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model*: 82 Ramcharger, 76 D100
The valves are in-line with the manifold runners. The #1 intake valve is the valve that lines up with the first intake runner. Or, the #1 intake valve is the second valve from the front of the engine.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 10:25 am 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''
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Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:30 am
Posts: 32
Location: Houston
Car Model*: 1980 Chrysler lebaron 3.7l 225ci
Reed wrote:
The valves are in-line with the manifold runners. The #1 intake valve is the valve that lines up with the first intake runner. Or, the #1 intake valve is the second valve from the front of the engine.


So right after the exhaust valve closes before the intake valve opens is tdc ,cause I stuck a flathead in the #1 spark hole and the Piston is all the way up but the rotor is pointing at 6 spark tower. So I should just have to move the distributor to the num 1 spark tower and she should run or did I mess up?


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 10:50 am 
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Board Sponsor
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Joined: Fri Feb 29, 2008 10:49 pm
Posts: 1558
Location: Salem, Oregon
Car Model*: 58 Plymouth Plaza 2dr, 63 Valiant Signet 200 2dr
You need to do as Reed said, and watch for the intake valve to close, then continue rotating the engine until the mark on the balancer is aligned with 0 on the timing tab. This will put you at TDC compression. Where you have it is TDC on the exhaust stroke, and that puts you 180 degrees out.

From there, look at your distributor cap, and identify which tower and wire is leading to the number 1 cylinder. Whatever tower that is, the rotor needs to be pointing at it. You may need to remove the distributor and rotate the rotor around such that when you re-seat it, it points at the correct tower for the number 1 cylinder.

Once that is done, it "should" start and be ready for tuning.

~THOR~

_________________
1958 Plymouth Plaza 2 door Club Sedan
1963 Plymouth Valiant Signet 200 HT - "CL4P-TP"
Licensed Auto Appraiser - RevItUp Classic Appraisals
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 9:37 am 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''
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Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:30 am
Posts: 32
Location: Houston
Car Model*: 1980 Chrysler lebaron 3.7l 225ci
So I did what y'all said didn't start?


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:09 am 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 12342
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model*: 82 Ramcharger, 76 D100
MotorHoggGears wrote:
So I did what y'all said didn't start?


Did you verify you have spark?
Did you verify you have fuel?
Was the engine flooded?
Do you have the spark plug wires in the right order?
Did pushrods get bent from the stuck valves?
Did you attempt to adjust the timing as you cranked?
Does your choke work on the carb?
Did you work the accelerator pump once before trying to start the engine?
Have you eliminated vacuum leaks?

????????

Hard to diagnose a no-start condition over the internet with no info.

Try starting it while you slowly turn the distributor counter clockwise. This advances the timing. Don't go farther than about ten degrees, though.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:12 am 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''
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Joined: Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:30 am
Posts: 32
Location: Houston
Car Model*: 1980 Chrysler lebaron 3.7l 225ci
Idk if I have spark but I was getting fuel before I took the fuel tank off and I didn't mess with the pump.


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