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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 15, 2017 6:54 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:37 pm
Posts: 54
Location: North Carolina
Car Model: 1971 Valiant
I see, thanks. Though I'd definitely have to change rear axle: that 0.73 OD with 2.76 rear would have it only pulling 1700rpm at 60mph!

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 15, 2017 7:14 pm 
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Location: Salem, OR
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that 0.73 OD with 2.76 rear would have it only pulling 1700rpm at 60mph!


With a Holley 8007 4 barrel that can be achieved to be in the mains by plugging the high speed mains so they come on sooner than the 2000 rpm they are calibrated for....if the engine is pepped up with 9:1 compression and an RV-10 cam advanced for best low end torque that would be no problem at all...

That being said, I had run an A-230 with 2.76 gearing in my '74 for a short while (3.21 had bad bearings, but was daily driver, put 2.94 in and it developed a bad bearing... used my last 7 1/4" rear with 2.76 gears...), and you really have to slip the clutch to get it motivated in 1st (and that was a 3.18 ratio 1st gear)... highway cruise was pretty nice though in "direct"...

Technically you could make the "swap", then upgrade your rear after that, then upgrade the engine... (If you could get a 3.91 SBP rear, the leaving ratio will be very kind for even a 1 barrel engine, and the OD ratio is 2.85 which is between 2.76 and 2.94 which both make good high way mileage and the 2.94 is a little easier passing than the 2.76...so you have a nice compromise until the front suspension upgrade and the hi-po "Lou" build engine upgrade after that...

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 15, 2017 7:47 pm 
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Z-bars can't get confusing year to year, body to body and even engine to engine


I think that you meant "can get confusing".


The real issue actually is a K-member/ engine mount shift in the '67-72 A-body to the '73-76 A body...the earlier sandwich mount K and engine mounts shoves the engine and transmission assembly to the rear compared to the '73 up spool mount K... everything else in the car isn't totally affected, but the Z-bar driver's side mount will be different between the Dante Ball stud mount vs. the stud though the fender mount on '73 and up... oddly when I did the A-230 conversion for my '67 using a the power train from the '74 the '67 valiant fender had the hole for the through ballstud like the '73 up, but no reinforcement plate since it was an automatic and pre-73....

The fun part to note here as well.... because the 10 1/2" clutch and associated flywheel in the small block V-8, the small block Z-bar is a bit shorter and would require a bit of "adaptation" to make it work... on the same note... a number of places sell the small block clutch "adjustment" rod as being universal to the slant six one... make sure to check the length... the only time I got duped by this I got a 4-5" rod instead of the 6-7" rod...make sure you get the right length rod for the application....


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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 15, 2017 8:20 pm 
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TBI Slant 6
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DusterIdiot wrote:
Quote:
Z-bars can't get confusing year to year, body to body and even engine to engine


I think that you meant "can get confusing".


Ooops, yeah I did mean "can".

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:01 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:37 pm
Posts: 54
Location: North Carolina
Car Model: 1971 Valiant
So what, the car will take both, but the transmissions will only take that one range? Got any decent photos?

If I do go through with this, should I go ahead and change the 2.76 geared 7.25 axle? The car doesn't accelerate all that well as it is (though the lower geared 1st and 2nd on the A-833OD would help a bit), so I'm not sure how much use it'd get out of 4th without a lower geared rear. So, should I go ahead and replace it with, say, an 8.25, or should I leave the 7.25 and just change the axles (so I'm not running two different bolt patterns; the front disc conversion is 5x4.5 while rear is still 5x4) and change it's gears?

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 9:12 am 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Location: North Carolina
Car Model: 1971 Valiant
One other thing...the A-833 OD listing I posted earlier also lists a "225 steel crank slant 6 engine $250." Should I get that as well, or just use existing one? He says that one was mated to the transmission he's selling, however....and it would mean less downtime on the car without having to wait for engine.

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 10:08 am 
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Location: Salem, OR
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Should I get that as well, or just use existing one?


That's up to you. Having a spare engine would be good if you are going to build another up... Your existing engine being early 70's should have the pilot hole in it for the manual transmission and would need the pilot bushing (oddly my'67 was all original and it was an automatic and was drilled for the manual transmission and the bushing...), Mopar got "spotty" on finishing the hole or even drilling it in the crank about the mid-70's...forged cranks are most likely to be finshed, late cast cranks are a gamble if they have to hole it may not be finished, some don't have the hole...

As with any used engine, hearing it run, getting a compression test, checking plugs while on a test drive, checking for timing chain slop are all factors to determine if the engine is a core or worth the $$$ to buy it.


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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 10:14 am 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Location: North Carolina
Car Model: 1971 Valiant
Well the engine is the one that came with the trans, and listing says it's a forged/steel crank--according to this site's Stroking article, 76 was the last year for those.

Then again, presumably it's out of the car, since its transmission is...I'll ask info.

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:14 pm 
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Location: Salem, OR
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listing says it's a forged/steel crank-


1976 is a split year... you could get either the steel cast crank or the steel forged crank (most guys call forged crank "steel"... but it applies to both when they get sold for scrap)... All the plymouth A-bodies I have had eyes and hands on all have been forged crank... the 1976 F-bodies I have seen seem to be an either/or...

Either way, it would allow you to plug and play the combination... and then allow you to build up your original block in the meantime if you have room to store it... then once you swap the other direction, you have a spare for later...

I would ask for pictures of the machined and stamped pad at the block deck just below the #1 spark plug (may need cleaned up to read)... a picture of the block casting numbers on the driver's side of the block, and a picture of the "gusset" behind the water pump housing on the drivers side of the block.

That would ensure you know what it is.


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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:24 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Location: North Carolina
Car Model: 1971 Valiant
I see, thanks. Someone may or may not try to get the trans tonight though; I'll know tomorrow, I guess. If they do get it, then the engine won't matter any more.

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 6:18 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Posts: 54
Location: North Carolina
Car Model: 1971 Valiant
Right, that trans has been sold, I'll have to look elsewhere. Do you think I should use that other site linked in a previous post (expensive, but has everything and it's all good condition), or should I look for a cheaper used thing like the craiglist ad?

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:44 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Posts: 54
Location: North Carolina
Car Model: 1971 Valiant
Does this look like a decent one to go for? It's only one state over.

(There's also This one, but there's no info about condition or if it's even a regular vs OD. Though going by the date I'm leaning OD)

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:41 pm 
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If the rebuild wasn't hammered on 10 years is nothing to one of these boxes... the pad shows it's from a 1976 A-body.


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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:34 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:37 pm
Posts: 54
Location: North Carolina
Car Model: 1971 Valiant
Right then. Since it's a 4 hours drive, would it be worth going over there to check it, or shold I just have it shipped? If former, what should I look for?

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 Post subject: Re: A904 to A833?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:56 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:37 pm
Posts: 54
Location: North Carolina
Car Model: 1971 Valiant
As noted in gallery thread, I got the transmission.

Now what about this bellhousing I just found? Is it worth the price, or would preparing it end up costing too much more?

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