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MFI or Tbi with Turbo
http://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=64438
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Author:  Tim Keith [ Tue Jan 28, 2020 9:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

Reed wrote:
MadScientistMatt wrote:
Reed wrote:
From what I have found, the Microsquirt system looks to be about the simplest and cheapest system to get MPFI. Batch fired, wasted spark, but true MPFI. I don't know if it is compatible with forced induction.


It is - just pick a MAP sensor that reads up to your intended boost level.


Cool. Once I start the project in earnest I will get more into the Microsquirt options.
Has anyone used the 2 x 1 Offenhauser with TBI ?

Author:  OGLeanDart270 [ Wed Jan 29, 2020 9:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

Not any slanty's I know of but some guys at Binder Planet did.

http://www.binderplanet.com/forums/inde ... lt.120966/

Pretty easy with the GM computer setup because you just tell it to run a 2bbl tbi. The 2bbl units have two injectors so you just run the harness to each injector on both tb's.

Author:  Tim Keith [ Fri Jan 31, 2020 4:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

thanks for positing that

Author:  Tim Keith [ Sat Feb 01, 2020 5:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

Dart270 wrote:
I would spring for MPFI. You can also have an aluminum 4bbl intake modified for injectors. Gill can do that for about $450. Maybe with low boost (4-8 psi), you would be OK with a manually tuneable TBI system, but I would avoid it for higher boost.

My turbo Dart gets the same MPG as before the turbo, yes, as long as I keep my foot out of it. Turbo is rather large, so it doesn't spool up unless you mean it. That helps with the MPG, I am pretty sure. I have a port-EFI-modified Offy 4V on that, and will likely go to a larger port manifold like a Clifford later.

Lou
It would be "cool" if a water to air intercooler could be placed inside the plenum of the Gill intake manifold and a bucket of ice used to cool the water for a race. The newer BMWs are turbo charged and place the water to air intercooler inside of the plastic intake manifold. It reduces turbo lag and is less clutter than ducting of air. Slant sixes have lots of space for this type of system. He could called it the "Gill Chill". We could use the auxiliary electric water pumps of late model vehicles that have start/stop features, the electric pump is required so that the heater still works. Many SUVs with third row seating also use these pumps.

Author:  Tim Keith [ Sun Feb 02, 2020 6:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

I read about the downsides of water to air intercoolers, besides costs these heat soak when the motor is shut off on a warm day, not a problem when the vehicle rests for a few hours. Otherwise you should avoid much boost in that scenario, which would be common in South Texas

Author:  Reed [ Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

Wy not put an AC evaporator in the intake tract and use it to chill the incoming air?

Author:  ProCycle [ Mon Feb 03, 2020 8:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

I think it would take a really BIG air conditioning system to have any hope of keeping up with the mass of hot boosted air coming out of the turbo.
The horsepower cost would be way more than the benefit.

Author:  Reed [ Mon Feb 03, 2020 9:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

ProCycle wrote:
I think it would take a really BIG air conditioning system to have any hope of keeping up with the mass of hot boosted air coming out of the turbo.
The horsepower cost would be way more than the benefit.


Hmm, good point

Author:  Dart270 [ Mon Feb 03, 2020 11:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

I think you use the AC to build up a reservoir of cold water, then that gets heated when you do a WOT blast, then the AC generates more cold water while you are not at WOT. The Hellcat and Demon Challengers have this system in use. Would not work on a road course, but fine for drag racing or occasional throttle hits on the street.

Lou

Author:  Tim Keith [ Mon Feb 03, 2020 2:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: MFI or Tbi with Turbo

The BMW intake with water-to-air inter-cooler inside is plastic and doesn't have a problem with heat soak. Nearly all under hood plastic used today is thermoplastic which you *could* re-melt and reuse, if you can build the molds. Typically for an intake manifold with inter-cooler inside you would use a hot plate to join the two plastic shells - no adhesives. Plastics made from resin and hardeners, eg. fiberglass can also be used but is used less in engines because of costs and recycling requirements. Plastic parts such as thermostat housings are made of nylon - a thermoplastic.

The issue is although thermoplastic maintains a shape very well, but upon reaching it's melt point has a short melt interval. With the intake and exhaust on the same side of a slant six, the life of the plastic could be reduced ( warping,cracking). However with use a heat shields and aluminum runner stubs a plastic plenum with inter-cooler can probably be dependable on the slant six.

BASF has even made prototypes of plastic crankshafts. BMW motors can last 500,000 miles when carefully maintained but the plastic parts are considered consumables which should be replaced on scheduled service intervals, or a careful owner would weekly check for oil and coolant leaks on a high mileage car. BMW gets the most talk for its use of plastics but all manufacturers do this today to various degrees ( pun intended ). The runners of a plastic intake can be as smooth as if polished. Plastic oil pans and fuel tanks can contort to shapes not practical with metal. Those with the Offenhauser slant six valve cover know that these metal parts can also warp.

Scotty Kilmer is right about BMW and plastic but Toyota is also in that game too.

Fiberglass is better for DIY than thermoplastic

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