I had the 67 Dart lined up last year by an ASE super duper tech. Complant was pulling to the right, wearing inside of front tires, and darting in and out of the ruts on I-95 and other roads. He was unable to bring both sides into spec, and refused to print out before and after adjustments. Claimed he printer was not working. He flooded the engine trying to start it, and had to get it running for him. He said there was a lot of sloop in the steering gear, I agreed. Not impressed at all.

I had set the ride height before arriving, he had to set the the other three adjustments. If I remember correctly he was not able to bring caster into spec on the right side. I said get it to stop wearing tires.

He had a flunky test drive around the building, and they proclaimed the job was done. As I drove off the steering wheel was cocked 3 inches off center, and later in the ruts on I- 95 the car was darting left and right as badly as before.

I made adjustments two time to remove some of the slop from the box which improved rut driving a little bit. I haven't driven the car enough to know if it is still wearing front tires. My suspicion it is toed out, as when changing lanes and crown on two lane road she tend to lurch to the left.

All the front end parts have less than 5000 miles on them except the power steering gear that was rebuilt to firm-feel level by 'Steer and Gear' about 25,000 miles ago. I'm beginning to think they put in new seals and perhaps a bushing or two, but did not address any wear in the recirculating ball mechanism perhaps the reason for the needed adjustment.

Now I have about had it with this front end and steering box. No one can line it up. I installed Q1A upper control arms around 5000 miles ago when up grading to large bolt pattern disk brakes.

My next step is to get a toe adjustment kit and check the toe, also I need that tool for my 1953 Fregerson tractor, and see if that helps.

Another thought is where I installed B Body disk brakes from Dr Diff, I'm wonder if these parts have caused a bump steer problem, which would cause darting. On flat smooth roads the car tracks nicely.

Sorry about the long diatribe.

I'm considering installing a Burgeson box, and be done with frigging around with the old factory unit. Has anyone installed a Burgeson box, and how much of a difference did it make in handling.

As for the inability to bring caster on the right into spec, would a Q1A upper control arm accept a set of eccentric bushings which may provide enough correction to bring the caster in spec?

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

Your car is darting around because of a bad alignment. The ASE certified super duper tech, has probably never aligned a 1967 Dart before and set the alignment to "factory" specs which were meant for 6.50 13" bias ply tires. FABO in the "suspension and handling" section has a sticky with suggested alignments for big, wide, modern radial tires.

You need to find an alignment shop that deals with old cars. Have a proper alignment done before buying a supposedly better steering box. Or you can buy the tools and try it yourself. YouTube makes it look easy.

I agree with kesteb that you should get a good alignment before doing a steering box. Steer and Gear has a good reputation in general. It might be hard to find a shop that knows what to do, but if you can find one it'll make all the difference. The cam adjustments are not common in anything recent, apparently.

Here are my favorite alignment specs for our 60s tbar Mopars with radial tires, street driven:

Camber: -0.4 to -0.8 deg
Caster: +1.5 to +4.5 deg
Toe: 0.02 to 0.1 deg toe IN

Exact values are not super important for caster and camber, but it's best to match side to side within 0.1-0.2 degree. I try to hit the range of camber (-0.4 to -0.8 deg), then go for +1.5 to +4.5 deg caster. Caster can be off by more side-to-side if you need to (up to about 0.5 deg). If you do a lot of spirited driving on twisty roads, shoot more for -1 deg camber. Most people do not want/need this.

If you have toe out, then just adjusting that should make a substantial difference in wandering on the road.

I have run specs all over the map on my Darts and Valiants and these will work well.

If you drive it to my garage, we do camber and toe ourselves. Caster is the harder one to measure as you need turn plates to use a simple gauge like I have.

Happy to talk more,
Lou

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Home of Slant6-powered fun machines

We had an old guy in these parts, a bit younger than me, that knew how to align old Mopars. He was a bit of a PIA grumpy type, and has retired. The rest the local alignment shops are maned with young punks born after the late nineties known for their toe & go skills. When I got this car in 2008, I asked a small independent garage with an alignment rack that had a few old cars cluttering up the yard if they could align the Dart. Their response was; "we do old Mustangs and Corvettes all the time". I shook my head and walked out.

I guess I need to order up a DIY wheel alignment kit, and spend some quality time on the floor with it living the dream.

In the 30K miles I put on the rebuilt box, I expected it to not become so loose so soon.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.

82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp

07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

I would ask the little indep shop if they'll set up the rack on your car and then YOU do the alignment. I have done this a couple of times and it worked great. I can give pointers on how to proceed...

Lou

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Home of Slant6-powered fun machines

I have ordered a Tenhulzen Toe Plates alignment tool TNH-3300 capable of setting toe, camber, and caster. It should arrive in a few days.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.

82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp

07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

Big brown just dropped off the Tenhulzen Alignment kit. Now the equipment is assembled, and I have viewed the various instructional videos provided. Also reviewed Lou's front end settings. Now to get to it. I'm going to check toe first, and straighten the steering wheel as it is cocked to the right about at 7 & 1 o'clock.

I discovered my power steering box is leaking from the adjustment screw. I've about had it with that thing.

More later.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.

82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp

07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

Toe project finished for now. It was toed out 3/8". Now it in toed in 1/8", still jumping out of the ruts... a little bit less though. It drives down the road much better with a lot less corrective steering. However there is still about 1 1/2" of dead steering motion before any change of direction is felt while driving. That is as tight as I can get it without feeling like it is starting to bind or stiff when turning the wheel more than a few inches off center.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.

82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp

07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

I did install a Borgenson kit on my sons 65 Valiant.

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2 Mopars come with Spark plug tubes. One is a world class, racing machine. The other is a 426 CI. boat anchor!

12.70 @ 104.6

Rick:


And?

What difference did it make in steering?

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.

82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp

07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

OK, if the toe was that far out and it still has a big dead spot, you may have box problems. There is a bearing adjustment too (at least on factory power boxes) in addition to the backlash on top of the unit, so it might be worth checking that.

Personally, I hate factory Mopar power steering and will not use it again. I LOVE manual boxes in a Dart or Valiant. I bet the Borgeson will be good, but personally I'll go with electric power before I do that. The factory manual steering is so good, I hate to change it, and it seems the electric will let you dial it all the way out if you want.

Lou

_________________
Home of Slant6-powered fun machines

I mounted the unit and did a bunch of other work on the car and never really drove the car. ( Other than just moving it around at the shop) My son took it on one trip to NC and I honestly don't know how it worked. I will ask him tomorrow at work. He really only drove it a handful of times over the last year.

The Install was fine except for one special fitting we had to get for the PS pump that came with the kit. I can't remember what was the problem, but I know the one line leaked at the pump. After we installed the new fitting it was fine.

_________________
2 Mopars come with Spark plug tubes. One is a world class, racing machine. The other is a 426 CI. boat anchor!

12.70 @ 104.6

My first car was a 67 Dart 270 two door 'without the post', 273V8, three on the tree, and manual steering. Aside from just under a thousand turns lock to lock it worked well for the 132K miles I drove it. I recall being able to one finger the steering wheel if the car was moving. In those days I was not a fan of power steering or automatic transmissions. Those views have changed in the last 52 years.

Steer and Gear's rebuild should not be worn out after 30K miles. For the dough it took to ship it out to Ohio and rebuilt it's looking like it may have been a fools errand hindsight. Was Borgeson manufacturing Mopar boxes in 2008?

I was at a car show a few weeks ago, and found a very nice 69 Cuda small block powered with a Borgeson box, and utilizing their Mopar look-alike steering shaft connector. I never did see its owner, as I would have liked to have ask him about it.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.

82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp

07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

Some additional thoughts.

Check the steering box to k frame bolts, I had one (box, meaning 3 of the mounting bolts) loosen on me and would cause the car to would wander 1-1.5" of steering wheel travel before the wheels started to turn / change direction.

Idler arm - Check that too.


If it just wanders in the center, then it would be the Steering box, that's my guess.

Greg

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http://www.youtube.com/hyperpack

I asked Ryan about how his power steering worked on the car and he said it worked good. He actually drove it yesterday for the first time in a long while. And he said it worked fine.

_________________
2 Mopars come with Spark plug tubes. One is a world class, racing machine. The other is a 426 CI. boat anchor!

12.70 @ 104.6