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 Post subject: Re: cross-flow slant?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 4:42 pm 
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Board Sponsor & SL6 Racer

Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2002 7:57 pm
Posts: 8283
Location: Waynesboro, Pa.
Car Model: 65 Valiant 2Dr Post
Quote:
As for the 2 piece timing cover, I made a few prototypes for people to try out and endorse but then.....crickets! They take the goods, but never follow through with their end of the deal.


I think there would be nothing wrong with asking them to return your prototype so it can be tested by someone else.

Quote:
I would happily test a 2-piece cover and report back in gory detail with pics.


I too would be happy to test this for you if someone else cant. I pulled a motor, put a new camshaft and lifters in, installed Doc's new oil pump & gear, just so we could test it. Yes it failed but we got the testing done. I have a back up motor on the stand now getting rebuilt over the winter. So it is here also.

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 Post subject: Re: cross-flow slant?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2022 7:36 pm 
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Turbo Slant 6

Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 11:11 pm
Posts: 654
Location: Cincinnati
Car Model:
On that 2 piece timing cover...is it possible to integrate a turbo drain back port? just thinking out loud....


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 Post subject: Re: cross-flow slant?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2022 4:47 pm 
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Turbo EFI

Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:23 am
Posts: 1321
Location: N. Ga.
Car Model: 64 Valiant
Ok, I looked back at my original post when I began making the patterns for this timing cover. It's been almost 5 years now. A lot has happened and I've become heavily involved in other interests and in non-car related year round competitions, and this stuff has taken a back seat and become less prioritized since then. I'll need to bring some of my other non-car related products and projects to a pause as soon as I'm able, and drag this timing cover project back out into the daylight.

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 Post subject: Re: cross-flow slant?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2022 7:48 pm 
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Board Sponsor
User avatar

Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2002 7:52 pm
Posts: 1486
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Car Model: 1964 Valiant
Dart270 wrote:
Considering no one has wanted to go to the trouble and expense to build (or agree to buy) an alum cyl head that would bolt up all the stock parts, I cannot see enough people wanting a cross-flow head. From my studies involving real-world head flows on Slant 6 racecars and street cars, a stock design cylinder head could easily flow 30-40% more than a stocker, which would be a HUGE gain in HP for anyone who would want to bolt one on.

Lou
I'd like to see a one-off cross flow head, but I'm sure I couldn't afford one. If a stock type "Sputnik era head" design could be improved to flow 35 percent more and have material for the race mods that would be a winner. The costs are rising so rapidly these day. By raising the intake ports that might improve cooling around the exhaust ports and help cool the exhaust valves. I don't know design, but it might reduce pre-ignition with higher compression, the alloy would help with that as well. I surely don't know much about head design , The "I like Ike" era head can be improved - that's for sure. A question: use the oem below the deck pistons or zero deck pistons? And if zero deck, what source for the alternate pistons?

Again the costs are crazy. Motor oil was $30 today at Walmart, not enough to drive me to a Tesla, but reminds me that I'm not getting old - I am old.

I think we might see a rise in the nostalgia aftermarket because the end of the V8 era is approaching. I hope Mopar warehouses thousands of new Hemis for the aftermarket.


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 Post subject: Re: cross-flow slant?
PostPosted: Fri Dec 09, 2022 10:31 am 
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Supercharged

Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:48 pm
Posts: 3805
Location: Indianapolis
Car Model:
Stopped by the Hoosier Pattern booth today at the PRI show. Just for the fun of it I enquired on pricing to 3D print a set of cores to cast an inline six cylinder head in aluminum.
Working under the premise that a comprehensive and complete and mature electronic CAD file would be provided the cost of printing the set of cores was approximated at $1500
The core set would include: intake and exhaust cores, water jacket core, cover and bottom cores and include the gating necessary to flow the molten metal into the cored cavity. Hoosier Pattern said they would work with the foundry that was selected by the person ordering the cores to make the core set compatible with the foundry casting process.
The cost to 3D print the cores is not where the big money is spent on producing a casting, the real money and expertise is in developing the math data that allows one to do the 3D printing.

Contact info for Hoosier Pattern is below.
The other photo is the core set needed to cast a V8 cylinder block: front and rear cores, left and right water jacket cores, the body core. There would also be an upper core to make the lifter chamber and a lower core to make the oil pan rail.
For those not familiar with foundry casting processes, the cores are solid shapes that the molten metal flows around. The cores then break down and become the hollow areas inside a casting and the detailed surfaces that make up the outside of a casting.


Attachments:
3D printed cores.jpg
3D printed cores.jpg [ 80.7 KiB | Viewed 535 times ]
Hoosier Pattern.jpg
Hoosier Pattern.jpg [ 95.94 KiB | Viewed 535 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: cross-flow slant?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2022 8:14 am 
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Turbo EFI

Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:23 am
Posts: 1321
Location: N. Ga.
Car Model: 64 Valiant
Correct, the bulk of developmental costs goes to the creating of the 3D models with software like Solidworks or Inventor. My Soludworks package back in about 2005 cost over $20K. But its capabilities allow you to create full working models with unlimited parts and components as well as doing flow simulations to create the absolute best flowing ports, for instance and chamber shapes all in conjunction the first time around. So you don't have to do costly redesign time a second time. 3D printing has more disadvantages than advantages compared to CNC milling, I've had a large format 3D printer myself. Bottom line is its expensive regardless of the method you use to get the end result.

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