Slant *        6        Forum
Home Home Home
The Place to Go for Slant Six Info!
Click here to help support the Slant Six Forum!
It is currently Fri Mar 29, 2024 3:38 am

All times are UTC-07:00




Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 12 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2001 10:20 am 
I want to build a Stock Eliminator car for the two national events here in Canada. I know of a low mileage 4 door scamp with a slant six.

I need to get the car to run under the 15.80 index in the 1/4 mile.

I'm not allowed to touch the head (except for cc and plaining to NHRA specs..., I'm only allowed .430 lift...unlimited duration, I can not modify the carb or intake.

I can run any rear axle as long as it is made by Mopar. I think I'll throw in a B-body 8 3/4.

I was thinking I'd need about 3000-4000 stall, and 5.13 gear with a 29 inch tire.

Any suggestions on getting this engine to make the index.



Jason's Aspen/Volare Club
indychamp@hotmail.com


Top
   
PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2001 6:42 pm 
(User Above) wrote:
: I want to build a Stock Eliminator car for the
: two national events here in Canada. I know
: of a low mileage 4 door scamp with a slant
: six.
:
: I need to get the car to run under the 15.80
: index in the 1/4 mile.
:
: I'm not allowed to touch the head (except for
: cc and plaining to NHRA specs..., I'm only
: allowed .430 lift...unlimited duration, I
: can not modify the carb or intake.
:
: I can run any rear axle as long as it is made
: by Mopar. I think I'll throw in a B-body 8
: 3/4.
:
: I was thinking I'd need about 3000-4000 stall,
: and 5.13 gear with a 29 inch tire.
:
: Any suggestions on getting this engine to make
: the index.


Unless at least the BBD carb/intake are allowed, I think you might be sunk. Making the car as light as possible will be priority one - you can probably get it to 26-2700 lbs if you completely gut the car and maybe do some creative cutting. Lexan windows and 'glass bumpers and front end are probably in order too, so maybe you can hit 2500lbs or less? If it's OK to mill the head beyond factory (??), then you can have any comp ratio you choose up to at least 11.5:1. I've heard Hughes Engines and Ultradyne can make custom cams so you might call them for a 250 or 260 deg @0.050" cam, 0.430" lift. Make sure the lash is taken into account. I would run a 904 with a light axle, like the 7.25" and some short tires (24" max) and very light rims for less rotating mass. I think you can still get 4.50 gears for the 7.25 axle - try Randy's Ring&Pinion. Traction will probably not be a problem. You could weld up the spider gears for a spool if you need traction, or maybe you can still find one.

have fun,

Lou

madsenl@caltech.edu


Top
   
PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2001 10:13 pm 
(User Above) wrote:
: Unless at least the BBD carb/intake are
: allowed, I think you might be sunk. Making
: the car as light as possible will be
: priority one - you can probably get it to
: 26-2700 lbs if you completely gut the car
: and maybe do some creative cutting. Lexan
: windows and 'glass bumpers and front end are
: probably in order too, so maybe you can hit
: 2500lbs or less? If it's OK to mill the head
: beyond factory (??), then you can have any
: comp ratio you choose up to at least 11.5:1.
: I've heard Hughes Engines and Ultradyne can
: make custom cams so you might call them for
: a 250 or 260 deg @0.050" cam,
: 0.430" lift. Make sure the lash is
: taken into account. I would run a 904 with a
: light axle, like the 7.25" and some
: short tires (24" max) and very light
: rims for less rotating mass. I think you can
: still get 4.50 gears for the 7.25 axle - try
: Randy's Ring&Pinion. Traction will probably
: not be a problem. You could weld up the
: spider gears for a spool if you need
: traction, or maybe you can still find one.
:
: have fun,
:
: Lou


Unfortunately, lightening is not allowed in Stock Eliminator. The car will have to weigh whatever the factory shipping weight was for the base model. (Probably around 3200#) Sounds like an awful tough row to hoe. Dennis


aschumers@aol.com


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2001 5:41 am 
(User Above) wrote:
: Unfortunately, lightening is not allowed in
: Stock Eliminator. The car will have to weigh
: whatever the factory shipping weight was for
: the base model. (Probably around 3200#)
: Sounds like an awful tough row to hoe.
: Dennis


With a 22.24 lbs per hp the car must weigh 2780lbs.

Also all the factory interior must remain and all of the dash be in place. The controls need not be functional.

I will need more gear then a 4.50. I will only be going maybe 90 MPH in the 1/4 so a high numerical gear would be needed. probably 5.13 to 5.20. with a 26 inch tire. That should put me in the 6200-6400 range.

Keep the suggestions comming.

Jason's Aspen/Volare Club
indychamp@hotmail.com


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2001 9:30 am 
(User Above) wrote:
: With a 22.24 lbs per hp the car must weigh
: 2780lbs.
:
: Also all the factory interior must remain and
: all of the dash be in place. The controls
: need not be functional.
:
: I will need more gear then a 4.50. I will only
: be going maybe 90 MPH in the 1/4 so a high
: numerical gear would be needed. probably
: 5.13 to 5.20. with a 26 inch tire. That
: should put me in the 6200-6400 range.


I think you can get this to work, Lou and Dennis have you on the right track. The "factory induction" and "no head work" are the "killer issues" to overcome. You *will* be doing some headwork, a majore "blueprint job" to put it right on the rulebook numbers so know what those limits are. (especially about how you can regrind the stock valve and seat, any "back-cuts" or multi-angle work allowed?

Stock car and set-up, have you thought about Building an "early car"? (60-62) If you had an eary car, could you run a Hyperpak? How about the Aluminum block? I have a pretty good 62 Valiant "core" I would sell cheap, this would be easer to get into the weight you noted. (does year and shipweight matter or is it a pure weight ratio calculation as you noted.?)

So a 2700 lb car, supersix 2 bbl, stock exhaust manifold(?)"bluprinted" head, unlimited cam and gear ratio.(4.88 is my bet)
What about compression? Can you run more squeeze to off-set the duration of the cam?
(I'm thinking a "long rod" 225 would be nice)
I have to go run a search, I think is question has already come-up once before.
DD


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2001 12:03 pm 
I can only run a stock replacement piston.....NHRA lists the piston number inn National dragster. With the heads blueprinted to minum CC allowed and the .021 head gasket, and the replacement piston the comp ratio would be 8.9 when assembled.

As for the valve job...I'm only allowed a specific head casting, the valve can only measure +.250 maximum above stock as listed, the top cut can be any angle, stock valve seat angle any width, bottom cut may not exceed 70 Deg. Total cuts maybe not exceed .250" in length.

I'm allowed to run a header.

The one part that scares me is that I'm only allowed the 1 barrel carb.



indychamp@hotmail.com


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2001 12:42 pm 
(User Above) wrote:
: I can only run a stock replacement
: piston.....NHRA lists the piston number inn
: National dragster. With the heads
: blueprinted to minum CC allowed and the .021
: head gasket, and the replacement piston the
: comp ratio would be 8.9 when assembled.
:
: As for the valve job...I'm only allowed a
: specific head casting, the valve can only
: measure +.250 maximum above stock as listed,
: the top cut can be any angle, stock valve
: seat angle any width, bottom cut may not
: exceed 70 Deg. Total cuts maybe not exceed
: .250" in length.
:
: I'm allowed to run a header.
:
: The one part that scares me is that I'm only
: allowed the 1 barrel carb.


I'm pretty sure that you won't be able to make weight for V. I think you can only alter the weight 200# to go up or down a class and I'm pretty sure advertised weight will be around 3200 + 160# for driver weight. I could be wrong on the advertised weight, but I'm sure 2700# is out of the question. They are also very picky about what you do to lighten. All in all, it is still a very tough deal.


aschumers@aol.com


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2001 1:06 pm 
The factor for the 1971 Valiant Scamp 4 dr. is 22.24 lb per factored horsepower which is 125.

V/S = 22 to 23.99

22.24 * 125 = 2780 plus minimum driver weight of 170 = 2950 lbs.

Even at Total weight then the car would have a factor of 23.6...well under to 23.99 limit. I could add 150 lbs maximum and run at the top of W/S which has an index of 16.60. I actually would only have to add 50 lbs to meet the 24.00 lbs per factored horspower rating.

I'm allowed to remove the wiper motor, heater motor, all duct work in the dash. All the controls must remain.
(User Above) wrote:
:
: I'm pretty sure that you won't be able to make
: weight for V. I think you can only alter the
: weight 200# to go up or down a class and I'm
: pretty sure advertised weight will be around
: 3200 + 160# for driver weight. I could be
: wrong on the advertised weight, but I'm sure
: 2700# is out of the question. They are also
: very picky about what you do to lighten. All
: in all, it is still a very tough deal.



indychamp@hotmail.com


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2001 3:36 pm 
(User Above) wrote:
: The factor for the 1971 Valiant Scamp 4 dr. is
: 22.24 lb per factored horsepower which is
: 125.
:
: V/S = 22 to 23.99
:
: 22.24 * 125 = 2780 plus minimum driver weight
: of 170 = 2950 lbs.
:
: Even at Total weight then the car would have a
: factor of 23.6...well under to 23.99 limit.
: I could add 150 lbs maximum and run at the
: top of W/S which has an index of 16.60. I
: actually would only have to add 50 lbs to
: meet the 24.00 lbs per factored horspower
: rating.
:
: I'm allowed to remove the wiper motor, heater
: motor, all duct work in the dash. All the
: controls must remain.


22.24 is for a 2 door car with a 198ci motor. The 4 door/225 combo is 145X19.20=2784+170 for driver=2954. W is 4 cylinder only, no help there. Don't know if IHRA factors would be a little softer or not. Slants used to compete in Z and X Stock, but those classes were dropped due to lack of interest. Maybe you can convince Uncle Wally to bring them back and get a softer index?


aschumers@aol.com


Top
   
PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2001 4:44 pm 
My mistake on the rating. The car is a 198 car so it would still be a 22.58 factor. It would think be considered a Valiant 4 dr.

It would be 22.58 x 125 (factored horsepower x factored weight per horspower)=2822.50 + 170 =2992.50 lbs

That still puts me in V/S.

This car is an original 4 dr 1971 car with 50 000 miles on it. I think it would be a fun car.

Uncle Wally is not playing very fair lately (no more pro stock truck) so I'm thinking of IHRA.
(User Above) wrote:
:
: 22.24 is for a 2 door car with a 198ci motor.
: The 4 door/225 combo is 145X19.20=2784+170
: for driver=2954. W is 4 cylinder only, no
: help there. Don't know if IHRA factors would
: be a little softer or not. Slants used to
: compete in Z and X Stock, but those classes
: were dropped due to lack of interest. Maybe
: you can convince Uncle Wally to bring them
: back and get a softer index?



indychamp@hotmail.com


Top
   
PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2001 8:10 pm 
(User Above) wrote:
: I want to build a Stock Eliminator car for the
: two national events here in Canada. I know
: of a low mileage 4 door scamp with a slant
: six.
:
: I need to get the car to run under the 15.80
: index in the 1/4 mile.
:
: I'm not allowed to touch the head (except for
: cc and plaining to NHRA specs..., I'm only
: allowed .430 lift...unlimited duration, I
: can not modify the carb or intake.
:
: I can run any rear axle as long as it is made
: by Mopar. I think I'll throw in a B-body 8
: 3/4.
:
: I was thinking I'd need about 3000-4000 stall,
: and 5.13 gear with a 29 inch tire.
:
: Any suggestions on getting this engine to make
: the index.


I use the search and "plugged-in" t/sa and found one string I remembered, also try: stock, racing, class (search all) to find some stuff.
DD


Top
   
 Post subject: Re: Carb mods necessary!
PostPosted: Sun Oct 21, 2001 9:56 am 
Maybe some carb modifications are in order. Try the carb free diet to reduce total weight.
(Just kidding!, couldn't resist)
Dan

reptylkrib@aol.com


Top
   
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 12 posts ] 

All times are UTC-07:00


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited