Hi,

I pulled the engine for a rebuild on my 63 about a week ago, and when I brought it into the shop, all of the guys working there were a little surprised (or perhaps freaked out!) that the torque converter was still on the engine.

I realize now I should have taken that off first, but the converter didn't make a "snap" or any kind of odd sound or crunch when we pulled the engine, so I assumed it just slipped off the input shaft. Am I wrong? Did I blow this one?

They are telling me I'll definitely want to put the Torque Converter back on BEFORE I reinstall the engine. They tell me it will be far easier to install and there won't be risk of transmission damage.

They say I will likely need a new front seal. Is this what I am seeing at the Autozone site as the "front pump seal"?

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63 Plymouth Valiant V200 Convertible.
225, HEI, Super Six with 38/38 Weber, Electric Fans, Scarebird discs, FirmFeel front swaybar.

That is the front seal for the transmission, if you didn't bend the flex plate you should be good to go.

Richard

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Part of Tyrde-Browne Racing

Be sure to carefully inspect the drive "blocks" on the ID of the front pump's impeller, those can get damaged if the converter put a lot of side load on them.
DD

Thanks for the ideas. I'll probably pick up the converter on Monday and reinstall it.

I guess I'll have a better idea of what the "blocks" look like when I actually see the converter.

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63 Plymouth Valiant V200 Convertible.
225, HEI, Super Six with 38/38 Weber, Electric Fans, Scarebird discs, FirmFeel front swaybar.

Doc means look into the transmission and don't forget to lube the seal (the rubber) or you will run it dry and ruin it running it dry.

Richard

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Part of Tyrde-Browne Racing

Below is a view of a front pump assembly, with the back half removed.

Note the center impeller with two small square "blocks" hanging into the center ID... the converter has slots that accept the drive blocks and turns the impeller.

As you can see, there is not much material there so these block can get cracked or broken, if abused.

You can inspect the blocks with the front seal removed.
DD

This is what I'm looking at:



Not really sure about the whole "replace the front seal" scene, now. This thing looks complex. And I really would prefer not to have to dismantle the transmission if I don't have to.

What should I do from here?

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63 Plymouth Valiant V200 Convertible.
225, HEI, Super Six with 38/38 Weber, Electric Fans, Scarebird discs, FirmFeel front swaybar.

Look at the front seal, it has a metal lip. You need to pry or get a small metal chisel under that lip to remove it. Then using a pipe fitting or section of pipe that will fit on the metal part of the seal, gently tap on the pipe/fitting until the seal is on.


Richard

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Part of Tyrde-Browne Racing

Thanks, Richard. You made it sound quite easy. I guess now that it's accessible, I should just do the replacement.

I must try not to fear the unknown here.

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63 Plymouth Valiant V200 Convertible.
225, HEI, Super Six with 38/38 Weber, Electric Fans, Scarebird discs, FirmFeel front swaybar.

With the seal out look at the two square lugs inside the hole (those were the ones Doc showed the picture of) should be able to get a good look with the seal out.

Richard

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Part of Tyrde-Browne Racing

Tried prying it out, and no go. I don't really want to break something when it actually looks like there isn't a problem with the seal at all.

Any tricks on doing this?

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63 Plymouth Valiant V200 Convertible.
225, HEI, Super Six with 38/38 Weber, Electric Fans, Scarebird discs, FirmFeel front swaybar.

I especially don't want to mess anything up because my shop put in a new complete seal kit 3 months ago.

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63 Plymouth Valiant V200 Convertible.
225, HEI, Super Six with 38/38 Weber, Electric Fans, Scarebird discs, FirmFeel front swaybar.

Go back to the shop and get them to look at it.....then reseal it for you. If they do it for free consider yerself " Sponserd ".

If the lugs are busted they can fix it for you....and reseal it.

If they do that for free you really are sponsored......

If they give you a free high stall Verter....and reseal it.... you may need to put a decal in your window.

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Yeah....Im the one who destroyed this rare, vintage automobile.....

Alright. If I could word it this way (sorry to beat this already weary thread to death): if the torque converter is pulled off a 904, does that mean the seal MUST be replaced?

Last question, because the seal looks fine to me. Again, apologies here.

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63 Plymouth Valiant V200 Convertible.
225, HEI, Super Six with 38/38 Weber, Electric Fans, Scarebird discs, FirmFeel front swaybar.

For the price of the seal I would replace it, I also would be worried about the bushing in the front pump that the converter hub rides on, have seen them get damaged, if the engine slipped away from the trans and you had the trans supported every thing should be OK, if you had to wrestle it out I would definitely replace seal and check bushing & lugs