Hey guys hope someone can help here. Here goes.

I got a brand new rebuilt engine never ran but more than 30 seconds. Engine has 0 vac when starting but engine never starts but tries to. Completely sucks a battery dry every time which I assume is from the engine still being tight since it's never ran long enough to loosen it up. I've got spark and fuel and I'm getting good compression within spec (125-135).

Leak down test was done and it didn't leak so I can assume the valves and rings are doing their job. Here's another odd thing is that every once in a blue moon the car will fire right up. The first time it ran for a few seconds and then acted like someone just turned the key off. Last time it ran and idled perfect for 30 seconds or so and as soon as the throttle was touched it quit and hasn't started since.

I recently took the manifold off and replaced the stock gaskets with REMFLEX gaskets to ensure a leak proof seal to the head, between the manifold and to seal the exhaust flange. Didn't help still no vac at starting. When it ran the last time it was checked for vac leaks and the only leak was from the egr which was fixed other than that none were found. The valves have been done and redone several times.

Engine is 225 with peanut plug head with 40 over pistons and a comp cams 264s. All manifold are ported and head was gasket matched. Has super six setup also with hei setup. I'm at a loss here since everything seems fine. Voltage drops once you try to start it a few times but I've ran a jumper to the coil from the battery to try and ensure full voltage and didn't help. All parts are new except the distributor which is reman. We got number 1 cylinder up and pointed the rotor at it and distributor is has been turned every way it can be but still doesn't start. Anyone got any ideas??

If engine just cuts out, I would suspect an electrical problem in ignition circuit, or one of its components not fuel. Get out your volt ohm meter, it’s test time.

Check continuity of bulkhead resister, it either passes current = OK, or when resistance coil is broken it will infinite resistance. Check resistance of pick-up coil in distributor should be in 200 to 400 ohms range, and an air gap .008â€￾ measured with nonmagnetic feeler gage. Check ground at voltage regulator and orange box be sure that there is no voltage drop back to battery (-) from their screw mounting plates or chassis, if there is V drop it can be corrected by cleaning installing star lock washer under metal at one of the fastening screws, and or running a #14 gage wire that also connects to one of voltage regulator base screws back to negative battery terminal. I call this a grounding loop.

It is possible that orange box’s operation is intermittent, the only test shade tree mechanic can perform is to swap out with known good unit. A coil can be intermittent if it is on its way out. Test resistances of both primary (look for 0.8 ohms), and secondary (circuits 8K to 12,000 ohms) with all wired detached; if possible swap it out with known good unit.

Lastly check all conductors connecting all the previously listed devices as well as, ignition switch, and clean their connections at bulkhead connector. Don’t forget to test reverse lockout circuit controlled by linkage adjustment of shifter, making sure it only kills ignition circuit in “Parkâ€￾ & “Neutralâ€￾; look for brown wire from starter relay, follow it back to transmission, newer cars have three wires at switch two controlling back-up lights, and one brown locking out ignition.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

Well I've had the hei conversion done for years now so how would I check things with it instead of the original orange ecu box? Lots of good info you gave and I intend to test all u mentioned. Even if they come out fine I'm just glad there's ideas I haven't tried yet with it. Apparently my bulkhead connector needs to be cleaned but what should I clean it with? The connections are kinda cruddy looking but I have no idea what to clean it with. I've used a Lil rubbing alcohol on circuit board connections and it cleaned it well but don't think I can/should do that here.

Turbocuda:
[quote]Well I've had the hei conversion done for years now so how would I check things with it instead of the original orange ecu box?[/quote]

Hey I took a stab at your ignition setup and got it half right being non points. Check the ground of HEI, as for testing how well it performs ditto the orange box swap-out with a known good unit.

Bulkhead connector corrodes from moisture and heat, the more corrosion builds up the higher the resistance which equals more heat. To correct the problem one can remove each individual brass male and female spade connector, one at a time so not to mix’em up, from the bulkhead connector housings (one inside, three engine side) and scrape the green & white crud off of them, tighten the female side so it grabs the male spade tightly and run the two together in & out to make a good connection, or get a 100 count box each male & female Packard brass spade connectors and replace all the old connectors reusing the backer lite housing.

I got a box of 100 each M&F from ‘Ron Francis Wiringâ€￾ and replaced all the connectors in my car.[url=http://www.ronfrancis.com/prodinfo.asp?number=FM%2D100]Male, FM100[/url], & [url=http://www.ronfrancis.com/prodinfo.asp?number=BM%2D100]Female, BM100[/url] Ron has smaller quantities, but much more expensive.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

Ok well the pickup in the distributor was checked and if I'm reading it right it's between 300 and 400 so it's within spec I guess. The module has been tested as good. The bulkhead was cleaned as best I could get to. The engine was retimed in case I did have a vacuum leak before the new gaskets. Tried to fire it again this morning and nothing. No change at all. Pulled the plugs and there was no gas on the plugs so I'm either getting plenty of spark or not enough gas to I added more gas and it soaked the plugs so I know for sure I'm getting plenty of gas now. The air gap was set long ago so I know that's right. The coil is new so there shouldn't be a problem there. I'm just at wits end here this engine started fine before the rebuild and now it refuses it doesn't make sense. All parts are new except the distributor which was reman but I've tried putting the original electronic one back in it and it made no difference. I tried the old coil, nothing. There's not much more to be done. Any other ideas will be appreciated.

If you can prove your getting good spark and getting plenty of fuel, then timing is left.
1. Did you install a new timing chain?
2. Are you sure the dots are lined up correctly?
3. How are the dots aligned?
4. Have you tried starting it in neutral? That would rule out the neutral safety switch.

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Aggressive Ted

http://cid-32f1e50ddb40a03c.photos.live ... %20Swinger


74 Swinger, 9.5 comp 254/.435 lift cam, 904, ram air, electric fans, 2.5" HP2 & FM70 ex, 1920 Holley#56jet, 2.76 8 3/4 Sure-Grip, 26" tires, 25+MPG

OK the timing set is new and they dots are lined up but the can wasn't degreed since we didn't find out until later that offset bushings where needed to degree it right. Thing is if we were really out of time why would car almost start and why would it have randomly started 2 times? I also figure we can't be to far off since the compression is good and there's no leak in the cylinders. I've thought about going back and getting those bushings or just drilling out the cam gear and degreeing it right but the evidence at least to me says that we can't be to far off on timing because of the aforementioned things so it should start, the power band might be either higher or lower than if it was degreed right but it should still start even if it ran a little rough. The last time it started it roared to life and idled perfectly, no missing no nothing. We unplugged the number 1 spark plug to test the spark and while it was blue I would think that it should have been bigger or had more of a "snap" to it since the coil is rated for 40k and it having the hei setup on it and all. It also has accel wires on it as well however they are for universal v8 application and not a 6 cylinder application. The wired are quite long and I was worried about them creating resistance but I don't know if they are or not. Could it be that simple as the wires are too long? And no I haven't tried starting it in neutral just in park.

Ok been a while since I've been in here but I thought I'd give an update. So part of the problem last time with it jot starting was that the two wires from the module to the distributor were criss crossed so I set them right. Weird thing about that is, is those wires have been checked and rechecked dozens of times so I'm not sure how they weren't right but. Anyway now the car will fire off now however it will not stay running. We figured out that if we start it and get it to fire off and then "pedal the carb" it will stay alive and run as long as we keep hitting the pedal to give it shots of gas. Eventually when warmed up the car will idle high on its own but once the rpms come down the car will quit. She refuses to
run at anything lower than fast idle. Also trying to put it in gear will immediately shut the engine off unless of course you keep her alive by the aforementioned method. It seems like the carb just isn't giving it enough gas at lower rpms. Friend of mine said the carb needs a rebuild and that it's not feeding the engine gas from the bottom of the carb which I assume is how it gets gas at idle. Does this make sense to anyone else? I'm just a Lil carb stupid and only know a few things about them. Finally was able to start adjusting the distributor to see if it would make a difference and it did. However we have ran out of adjustment to advance the distributor. Also with a timing light it looks as if she's 8–10 degrees off on timing. Also the engine has been running hot and we couldn't figure out why. I read that running an engine retarded will make it run hotter which companies have done to get more mileage out of their cars but I'm wondering with 8–10 degrees off is this what's making her run too hot?

I have found that the thing one knows is correct is the best place to look for a problem. It is tunnel vision, a brain fart, Feb 2 senior moment, Budweiser Engineering, wet gremlins, or something, but I have suffered this condition for days at a time over and over again… Welcome to the club.




How do you know it is running hot, did you shoot it with laser temperature reading device, or did it just feel hot? A lean mixture will make her run hot, excessively retarded timing can cause exhaust manifold to glow red. You won't be able to set base timing with engine running above idle rpm, as governor weights will be deployed advancing timing.


A lean mixture at idle will cause engine not to idle and just die out, in other words look for a large vacuum leak, and or incorrect float level, and or plugged idle passages. Quick test: close choke butterfly by hand while engine is running and try to get it to idle down. If it does you’re getting too much air from a vacuum leak or faulty idle circuit in carb.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

bingo on the vacuum leak. they won't idle down without dying. also need to get that timing advanced. mine likes quite a bit of initial advance. 10-12*

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Most of the stuff people worry about ain't never gonna happen anyway!!!
chuck Anglemyer
chucks' rod garage

What is the valve lash set at?
Try .018 Intake and .022 on the exhust.

I also think there may-be a intake leak somewhere...

Bottomline... there could be a number of problems, all working against you.
DD

Doc- the lash is set to whatever that cam calls for which I believe is stock lash. We've set and reset the lash several times. We used those aftermarket gaskets I mentioned earlier so I can't imagine there being a leak anywhere we used those gaskets which is intake - exhaust to head gasket and intake to exhaust manifold gasket we put a new carb gasket under the carb so I know that's in good shape. Timing was attempted to be set one of the times the engine would run by itself albeit at high rpm. It was advanced as far as the distributor would allow and the engine seemed to like it as the rpms increased and it starts easier but still won't idle. The engine was around 18 degrees retarded with a timing light on it. Which is where I mentioned we attempted to advance it with the distributor but doesn't seem like there's enough advance in the distributor. I can't help but feel that this would be completely fixed if the cam would get degreed properly but we just couldn't get enough adjustment for it to degree properly. The engine definatly seems to over heat after a few mins running at cold idle rpms. Top radiator hose bulges some but I know it's got good oil pressure. At cold idle rpm it's at around 50 or 60 psi. I'm lost on this thing. I'm not sure the car will ever leave the garage again.

18 degrees sounds like distributor is off by 1 tooth.

Richard

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Part of Tyrde-Browne Racing

Are the leads swapped on the HEI?

CJ

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Part of Tyrde-Browne Racing

I concur.

From the previous post running the #1 up to TDC is fine but you have to check the rocker arms to make sure that the cam is on the base circle (i.e. both rocker arms will 'wobble' at finger touch because they have no tension), that puts the cylinder at compression and ready to fire...so at that the rotor points to the #1 tower on the distributor. (TDC to start but make sure you have enough room to advance it more later if desired).

Comp Cam 264 is not "stock lash" comp typically asks for a .012/.012 lash on both intake and exhaust and that is still too tight I would set your cold lash at .018/.018 and adjust when hot and broken in using a vacc. guage to determine best setting.


See if you can get the distributor reclocked and the lash set loose and see if you can run it longer this time (you may need to pull the cover and check the degree of the cam as the comp is typically 110 degrees centerline and the dots can be off a bit even with the OEM cam centerline at 108...typical roller chain cam gears are like 7.4 degrees per tooth so if it's really retarded it may want to rev to the moon to make any power.

2 cents.

-D.Idiot