Hooked up the tach that was in Scooter's trunk when I bought it. Put the Garmin GPS V in the dash and went for a drive. In the recent past an ex co-worker gear-head & I couldn't audibly tell any difference in RPM between 4th and 5th. So I did some rpm vs. mph studies on the fwy. With the GPS V showing 65 mph in 4th the tach showed ~3300 rpm. With the GPS reporting 65 in 5th the tach showed ~3300 rpm. The tach is small enough and the needle is stepped off the face far enough that parallax is an issue. I attempted to offset this by leaning over to be more square on the tach, but there is no way that I'm confusing 3300 with ~2850 (spreadsheet predicted rpm in 5th @ 65).

My spreadsheet, based on it being a V6 F-car T5, predicts 65.2 mph at 3300 rpm in 4th and 75.9 at 3300 rpm in 5th. The closest to 1:1 listed on this page is .86:1, which is quite possibly what is in the car. But 75 mph is not 65 mph.....

I hate to pull it just to find out exactly what it is. Thinking that maybe I need to find another one. Seems exceedingly odd that this trans could have a 1:1 4th AND a 1:1 5th, but that is the results thus far.

The $1000 partial cure: http://www.jegs.com/i/Ford+Racing/397/M ... R/10002/-1, but I'm just not seeing that happening.

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Thom

Cross-threaded is tighter than Lock-tite

Jack & block the rear wheels on your car- put the trans in 4th gear & put a paint mark on the bottom of the driveshaft. Turn the engine over by hand- exactly one turn- confirm that the driveshaft moved 1 turn. Put shifter in 5th & turn engine exactly 1 turn- see how far driveshaft rotates. I've found many "small" aftermarket tachs to be mostly useless- not completely, just mostly.

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63 Valiant Wagon
225 - 4 bbl

I might just have to do that to confirm, but 800 rpm is a long ways for a tach to be off when audibly there is no difference in engine speed. Be a couple of days before I can get it to where I can put it on stands, other project in the way already started.

According to the '87 vintage and V6 F-car application info this trans should be a 0.76:1 OD ratio. The results in 4th match my spreadsheet's prediction of 65 mph & 3300 rpm. 65 in 5th should be 2500 rpm, but in reality it is no different from 4th.

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Thom

Cross-threaded is tighter than Lock-tite

A quick google search revealed a few issues that could lead a T5 to not actually go into 5th. One suggestion was to shift directly from reverse, engine off of course, into 5th. then count revolutions to confirm it is in 5th. Apparently there is a roll pin failure, a plastic bushing, or even the oem plastic shift guides that can cause this. There was also some info on clutch adjustments. Are you sure it's actually going into 5th? Just a thought.

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Mattelderca
78 NYB (gone now), two S series, three old Snow Cruisers and a Doo.

The shifter does actually go into the 5th gear position. It's not in 3rd, it's in 5th. It's just that the speed vs. RPM indicate that it is 1:1 like in fourth. I need to finish the camper's solar panel bracket & install and then I'll be able to move the Valiant to where I can put it up on stands.

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Thom

Cross-threaded is tighter than Lock-tite

There was no doubt when my t-5 went into od. Everything changed. The exhaust note, engine sound, intake noise, vibration, etc. i cannot imagine what, but something is amiss for sure.

Keep us posted.

Sam

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The shifter may be in fifth gear but the trans is not. The problem is inside the trans its self. A common problem in T-5s with some age or heavy abuse from previous owner( maybe why it was pulled). I would just drive with 4 speeds untill your ready to pull it and open the housing up. Expect a rebuild how ever it could be very simple as reinstalling a roll pin correctly. A couple ford friends have had it happen some cheap fixes others complete rebuilds where chosen to be done.

Thank you Mike!

If I'm going to open it up I may as well R&R the main wear items. Any good sources for rebuild kits? As best as I know this is a non-WC, V6 F-car trans if that makes any difference.

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Thom

Cross-threaded is tighter than Lock-tite

I'm kinda curious, what does it do if you shift from 3rd directly to 5th? I can imagine any number of glitches that could prevent 5th from engaging, but I don't see how that would leave it in 4th. AFAIK, the T5 is like most manual trans- input, main, & counter shafts. You have the 1st-2nd shift collar/fork, the 3rd-4th collar/fork; then 5th (and reverse) are in the tailhousing.

So normal 3-4 shifting is 3/4 collar goes to N, then the same collar locks the input shaft to the mainshaft for 4th or direct gear. The next shift has the 3/4 collar go to N, then the shifter SHOULD engage the lugs on the 5/R shaft, & move the 5 collar to lock the mainshaft to the 5th gear.

I don't doubt that something's wack in your T5, I just can't wrap my head around pushing the shifter forward (4-N), moving over then pushing again (N-5) and still ending up back in 4th gear.

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63 Valiant Wagon
225 - 4 bbl

The mystery is solved. It was not getting 4th when shifted into 5th, it was getting 5th. How can that be? Turns out that this trans is what 1100ez calls a "Bitsa", meaning bits of this and bits of that. The OD gears in this trans can not be those that it started life with. B-W would not have set up a trans with an effective OD ratio of 0.993:1 Without datalogging the difference between it and the 1:1 4th is so small that is appeared to be the same gear ratio.
The much hoped for tag on the cover is also gone. It would have told me what the original gear ratios might have been and given a hint about what the donor was.

The next step is either to find a donor trans with an acceptable OD ratio to swap in, or to find what this trans is supposed to be and install it instead.

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Thom

Cross-threaded is tighter than Lock-tite

My friend and the Valiant's PO, Matt, found a complete Camaro 3.4L V6 and T5 on CL. By the time that I reached the guy the engine was gone, but he still had the trans. Judging by the dust and grime it had never been opened up. the metal tag confirmed that it is a -210 version T5, so it is a wide ratio 3.75 first and a 0.72 5th.
Of course it was the "narrow" bell-housing bolt pattern and Matt had modified the Valiant's b/h for the "wide" or "T-10" bolt pattern. Easiest solution was to swap the main cases. That is done, the remaining pile of parts have been put together into something that looks like a trans but isn't to make selling or recycling it easier. Waiting on clutch parts.

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Thom

Cross-threaded is tighter than Lock-tite