With the second oil pump gear failure in 12000 miles we are considering installing an external oil pump on my sons dart. My question is this: Are the external pumps rated to be run for 10-12,000 miles a year or are they pretty much race only? And does anyone have an estimated cost on a system? I know there will be brackets to make and hoses to have made, but what else am I going to need and a guess on the costs. I really have no idea. Any recommendations of where to start would be appreciated.

Rick

PS. 2 cams, 2 sets of lifters, 2 engine pulls and replacements & and one more of each of these to go!! We will already have spent $600 + when we get it back together this time. Plus a good dose of frustration.

I don't intend to be 'slick', but it almost sounds like you really want a dry sump setup. An external belt driven oil pump... the only other major part you would need is an external tank.

Mitch

I guess I would seriously start to suspect the block of being bored wrong for the pump or cam. Personally, I won't use anything besides a factory used pump or a NOS pump after all this crap. I can understand your frustration!

Lou

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Going over the roller cam question a few weeks back, I looked to see if I could head off gear failure by just running an external pump, and going to a dry sump setup is a real investment (I could buy a nice duster for the same cost....).


ouch,

-D.Idiot

I'm going to do a external pump wet sump system on my new engine. Found a used chevy circle track set up at a swap meet for $40. Will use a homemade deep pan and pickup. Big block Mopar SFI damper with chevy bolt pattern. That way I can use the chevy pump drive arbor, and a chevy 6 cyl crank trigger, if I wish. Will need to fab pump mout brackets, and oil lines.

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Charrlie_S
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I understand Lou, but this engine block is the original engine that ran for 130,000 miles with absolutely no problems. I doubt that it is the block or it would have showed up before??

Rick

Fair enough - I thought you might say that...

Good luck,

Lou

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Did you install a cam button by any chance?

I had to replace my bushing on my timing set and put a second dowel in the cam and weld in one of Doc's famous cam buttons to keep the cam from walking in my block and the tolerances when rebuilt were well within spec...I can hear the cam bolt to cam stop 'whistle' occasionally at idle telling me the cam wants to move forward again... maybe it walked enough to cause some problems with your gear 'meshing' (one tooth off changed the pattern)?

anybody else have a rabbit to put back into the hat?

-D.Idiot

Yes when we had our first failure, I welded in one of the cam stops as Doug recommended. I guess my frustration is that we tried to do everything right and it still failed?? I have a hard time thinking that we as a Slant 6 community ,have come to the place of building a new engine, and having to go to the junk yard and rob an oil pump from a junk engine, to get one that will last. Something is just not right with that picture.


Rick

I'm reading this old thread re: oil pump gear failure and I'm wondering, now after 10 years, is the cam button the answer? Is it cam walk that was the problem all along or is it also pump gear? I used a DD pump with hardened gear this last time and my cam gear got shredded, so I'm thinking this points to cam walk. Has the cam button pretty much quieted this failure issue?

brian

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Rick, the biggest issue I would have with an external on the street is losing a belt. You guys already know what happens next.

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This is 10 years old and we installed a used cam and the matching used oil pump gear. It has ran 50,000+ very hard miles and a multitude of Drag strip runs at 62-6400 RPM. It will be tore down soon so I will let you all know what it looks like.

Rick

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12.70 @ 104.6

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It is sad to say that after a lot time & smart people working on the SL6 oil pump gear failure issue... we still see the problem.

Like others... I have done everything I could to prevent gear failure and still get a failure every now & then. ( my last one was on my race car, at the end of the 2013 season)

I already have a design for a custom oil pump drive gear, with an increased tooth count (1 tooth added) & made out of engineered plastic but it's too expensive to produce. ($250 to 300.00 each, in low quantities)

So for now, I do all I can with the stock set-up and hope... every time I build a SL6 engine.
DD

I will point out that I have never removed a pump gear from the shaft. So far I have had no failures, but I am usually (tho not always) a pretty lucky guy.

Lou

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