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Joshie225
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:06 am 
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I agree with Charlie. Put the rods out there. If you want to get into making pistons that's fine, but you're driving customers away by making them wait for rods.

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k1tom
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 7:09 pm 
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This still make no sense to me. I thought people were useing the 2.2 and/or other "off the shelf pistons" to save money, along with the 198 rods. Wouldn't it be the best of both worlds, to have the rods made in the 198 length, with the stock slant big end, with a smaller dia pin end, with bushing. The reason for a smaller pin size, would be for weight reduction, and the availability of smaller dia "racing" pins. Then you can order any piston confuration from a piston manufacturer. Which do not have to be expensive. From what I have read, the "good" 2.2 pistons are becoming hard to find, just like the 198 rods, for a reasonable price. From what I see an "aftermarket racing piston" can be obtained for $300-$600 depending on options. If someone is going to spend the money for "aftermarket" rods, it doen't make sense to "settle" for an off the shelf piston.
The difference between off the shelf racing pistons and custom pistons is the quantity that is made in a batch. If the manufacturer makes parts in a large enough batch so some can be put "on the shelf" it saves everyone money. If parts are made one set at a time, it drives up the cost. Custom pistons are already available for the slant 6 engine. Very few are sold because they are too expensive. Regarding your question as to why the rods are not being made like the 198 rods and to suit the 2.2 piston, you answered this yourself. The pistons are getting hard to find.
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k1tom
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 7:17 pm 
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I agree with Charlie. Put the rods out there. If you want to get into making pistons that's fine, but you're driving customers away by making them wait for rods.
Which rods would you like made? We can make just about anything you want and have them done in about 6-8 weeks. Making them one set at a time to go along with all of the different combinations of pistons that people are suggesting puts them into the custom category. Custom, one-off K1 Technologies rods will be about $150 to $200 per rod or if you want Carrillo rods, they will be in the $300 to $350 per rod range. If we can settle on one or two different piston / rod combinations the rods can be made in quantity it will bring the cost into the $75 to $80 per rod range.
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Joshie225
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:00 pm 
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Sorry, it's too late to make a customer out of me. I paid $100 for some 6.200" ex-NASCAR rods for the 170. It means a small narrow bearing in the existing journal, but it's been done before.

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Rob Simmons
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 4:02 am 
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Some people are still interested Tom... Still lurking and watching for updates....

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Charrlie_S
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 4:37 am 
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We can make just about any length connecting rod and the price will not change much if any at all.
So where is the problem? This allows for different pistons. Would there be much of a price difference for different pin size?
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Using an aftermarket piston will also give you a lighter piston. Not only will the lighter piston make the engine rev quicker, it will also gain power. The piston stops twice every stroke. It takes power to stop it and it takes power to start it. Besides, the stock pistons were designed to go back and forth to the grocery store not run at higher compression ratios and RPM.
agreed, and there are many sources for piston, but not many for rods.

I am a "cheap" racer, and on a limited budget, but I am going to build one "good" engine. I would like to find a good rod for less then $100 ea. But would probably only get 1 set in my lifetime.

PS: I don't recall seeing anything about projected rod weight. Any estimate on that?

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Dart270
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 10:17 am 
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Hi Tom,

I am still interested.

Just curious, what is the difference between the k1 rods and the Carillo rods?

Thanks,

Lou

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Shaker223
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 11:36 am 
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I'm interested as well. Just need to know final dimensions.
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slantzilla
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 4:08 pm 
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How many people who will be building an engine serious enough to need billet rods will use an off-the-shelf piston anyway? :?

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Dart270
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 4:52 pm 
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Good point, Zilla. I plan on custom slugs...

Lou

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Charrlie_S
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 7:01 pm 
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Good point, Zilla. I plan on custom slugs...

Lou
Me too.

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Shaker223
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Good point, Zilla. I plan on custom slugs...

Lou
Me too.
Ditto.
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CARS
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 8:15 pm 
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Well guys.... Now most of us non-pro builders are getting confused.
At what power level are the factory rods not reliable with polishing and peening?
With custom pistons, are the rods (stroke ratio) that big of a difference?

I've been reading up on combo's too much and am getting confused so pardon the questions if they seem elementary forgive me. (I really wish someone would just post a proven combo and we all just agree on a manufacture to make it :D )

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slantzilla
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 8:54 pm 
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At what power level are the factory rods not reliable with polishing and peening?
It really has more to do with expected RPM than power level. Stock rods are good until 6500 or so.

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With custom pistons, are the rods (stroke ratio) that big of a difference?
No. :D [/quote]

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k1tom
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2008 9:02 pm 
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We can make just about any length connecting rod and the price will not change much if any at all.
So where is the problem? This allows for different pistons. Would there be much of a price difference for different pin size?
Quote:
Using an aftermarket piston will also give you a lighter piston. Not only will the lighter piston make the engine rev quicker, it will also gain power. The piston stops twice every stroke. It takes power to stop it and it takes power to start it. Besides, the stock pistons were designed to go back and forth to the grocery store not run at higher compression ratios and RPM.
agreed, and there are many sources for piston, but not many for rods.

I am a "cheap" racer, and on a limited budget, but I am going to build one "good" engine. I would like to find a good rod for less then $100 ea. But would probably only get 1 set in my lifetime.

PS: I don't recall seeing anything about projected rod weight. Any estimate on that?
Projected rod weight for a 7.000" rod is about 650 grams.
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