Hmmm,

Then it would have to be something like a go cart slip, or centrifugal clutch. Electrcially operated of course.

There must be some way to do this !!!

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-76 Cordoba, 360 4bbl
-68 Valiant, 273 2bbl
-67 Dart /6 4bbl, Leaning Tower of Power!!!

The engine needs coolant circulated constantly.

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Joshua

A slip clutch could do that.

It would only take a portion of the energy being povided by the belt when the engine was cool.

Thus the pump would spin at a slow speed.

At higher temps the clutch could engage more, causing more friction and turning the pump faster for more coolant flow.

As I said, there has to be a way to do this. I'm not saying it would be easy! And it would take a lot of fab and experimenting. Sure is a neat idea though



Chris

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-76 Cordoba, 360 4bbl
-68 Valiant, 273 2bbl
-67 Dart /6 4bbl, Leaning Tower of Power!!!

The cold engine is not cold for very long. The cylinder head around the combustion chambers and exhaust ports gets hot very quickly and will boil the coolant. Go take the fan belt off your car and see how many laps around the block you can do before the steam show starts.

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Joshua

I would spend my time figuring-out a way to do a reverse flow cooling system on the SL6... putting the cooled radiator water into the head instead of the block.

All the newer engines make it a point to keep the head temps as uniform as possible, knowing the the hottest cylinder will detonate first, all else being equal.
DD

Doug,

I feel that dry decking the block and cooling the head separately could be of benefit. I envision the block cooling water going in the front as it does now and exiting the back of the block after it's circulated around the cylinders. I would use a 195-205° thermostat on the cylinder cooling loop. The head cooling would require a coolant inlet manifold on one side of the head and and outlet manifold on the other side (may be completely impractical with a slant). Instead of the coolant being forced down the head in a series of 6 chambers it would be like 6 parallel chambers in a cross flow arrangement. The head cooling loop I would run about 170° maybe less. This level of complexity would only be necessary on very high output engines used in longer duration events. Reverse flow cooling with improved water distribution throughout the head and then block would accomplish most of the benefits with less complexity, but requires very good exclusion of air from the cooling system.

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Joshua

No, that would not solve the problem of the engine needing constant coolant circulation.

With the low RPMs we generally turn, water pump losses are minimal. There are much more profitable places to focus for improved efficiency.

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一期一会
Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.

Perhaps it's worth looking at waterless coolant as a relatively cheap and easy way to get much of the ping-suppression benefits of reverse-flow cooling.

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一期一会
Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.

[quote="SlantSixDan
No, that would not solve the problem of the engine needing constant coolant circulation.quote]

Ummm. Yes it would. That is exactly what it would do.

_________________
-76 Cordoba, 360 4bbl
-68 Valiant, 273 2bbl
-67 Dart /6 4bbl, Leaning Tower of Power!!!

Even a mini torque converter could work.

It could be a fluid filled disc with an impeller that would allow slippage.

Then an electromagnetic lock up could fully engage it when the engine temp got right.

Bunch of naysayers

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-76 Cordoba, 360 4bbl
-68 Valiant, 273 2bbl
-67 Dart /6 4bbl, Leaning Tower of Power!!!

A variable speed electric water pump would most likely get you the same results but we already reviewed that option.
DD

Psst: Guess what? Square wheels are a bad idea, too.

Nobody here will actively prevent you spending/investing/wasting (depending on one's point of view) your money on whatever idea you think has merit. But when you suggest a bad idea, and it gets called a bad idea, it's best to say thank you for the heads-up and move on to the next idea rather than complaining at those who are trying to warn you that you're headed down a blind alley.

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一期一会
Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.

Double

Thanks for the heads up.

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-76 Cordoba, 360 4bbl
-68 Valiant, 273 2bbl
-67 Dart /6 4bbl, Leaning Tower of Power!!!

Seems to me that the "big" idea here is to relieve the engine of auxillary tasks it has to do, so it can make more power and/or return better gas mileage. I think the way to do this is eliminate the belt altogether. The easiest thing I can think of is to add a dippy electric motor that turns the stock belt, and leave the crank pulley bare. And, of course, eliminate the alternator in the process.

Seems to me that the electric water pumps I've seen are designed to replace a mech pump, and thus are expensive and comparatively complicated. There's already a belt, all we need do is spin it.

The cost of an electric fan conversion would probably more than cover the cost of said 12v motor. We already have a fan, why buy twice? All that's left is to make a bracket and buy different sized belts.

If you want to get fancy, said 12v motor can spin at different speeds for different conditions. Then you carry as many fully charged batteries as you need for the duration of your use, and plug 'em in when you are done using the car. Not great for a cross country trip, maybe great for someone with a 50 mile daily commute.

Sure, it's all academic at this point. Someone out there needs to try it to see if it's even worth it. I'll be that guy, but I've got a few more things to do to get my Valiant roadworthy. But in the next couple months or so, I'd be willing to take a stab at it. It seems to me it can't NOT work. The question is how well will it work. Plug in hybrid slants - welcome to the new world order.

Kip on Truckin'

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1965 Valiant wagon Turbo slant (work in progress)
2000 Chevy 155" cargo van - The Abductor
1970 Newport convertible
1996 Buick Roadmaster Wagon
1966 CruiseAire motor home
1990 Toyota 1 ton box truck TURBO slant (scraped)

This proposal would require creating energy out of thin air, which cannot be done. Where are we going to get the electricity to run the motor to turn the belt? It has to come from an alternator. Lugging around charged-up batteries is a net loss; you still have to charge them (whether in the car with an alternator or at home by plugging into house current, which also costs money) and they are heavy, so as you carry more and more of them to gain longer and longer range for your car without an alternator, you're having to drag more and more and more weight around. This is like the old story problem in school math: Water is flowing into the bath tub from the faucet at 3 gallons per minute and flowing out of the bath tub via the drain at 3.8 gallons per minute. How long will it take to drain the bath tub? Answer: Close the freakin' drain and stop wasting water.

Also keep in mind that ignition systems operate more effectively at the ~14v line voltage of a car with an operating alternator than at the ~12.3v line voltage of a car without an operating alternator. Poorer spark = lower fuel economy. So here again, by eliminating the alternator we're spending a dollar to save a nickel and it just doesn't make sense.
Not really...someone just needs to do all the math and consider all the costs and factors to see very easily that it will not give a net gain. Go see here for example.

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一期一会
Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.