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budget turboing my valiant
https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=54407		 Page 9 of 22
Author:  Junior [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 8:06 am ]
Post subject: 
its closer to 35-40*. more straight up and down. the return that i put in the pan has an angle to it so it worked out well.
Author:  Serj22 [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 10:40 pm ]
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One thing I did not notice before was that the mount was notched in your build. That totally went right over my head. Since I'm moving my battery to the trunk tomorrow, I am going to stick with my 6" radius pipe that will put the turbo pretty much near where the battery was. Then branch a support off the P/S bolt holes.

I just get too many ideas. I really did try to leave the battery where it was... it just wouldn't work.

How's the reg/pump working?
Author:  Junior [ Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:12 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
One thing I did not notice before was that the mount was notched in your build. That totally went right over my head. Since I'm moving my battery to the trunk tomorrow, I am going to stick with my 6" radius pipe that will put the turbo pretty much near where the battery was. Then branch a support off the P/S bolt holes.

I just get too many ideas. I really did try to leave the battery where it was... it just wouldn't work.

How's the reg/pump working?
it really is the way to go as far as the layout. its up and out of the way. so far so good. it starts right up and idles. before i would have to keep it running until it got warm. gonna get some tuning in tomorrow and try and lock in the afr. im gonna try the vent tube extensions first and see if they put me back where i was with the other carb hat. havent changed anything on the cold side or the carb since i changed the carb hat. ill jet up if need be. i hope not though.
Author:  Junior [ Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:46 pm ]
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took it to a show tonight. wanted to get it out and test drive it a little. started with the vent tube extensions in and it was pig rich stuck on 10 on the gauge any time i hit the gas. took the vte out of the primaries and it leaned out a little. so now it is time for a jet change. i think im going to put the vte back in the primary and jet down a bunch and see where i sit. it was running crazy rich, breaking up in the higher rpm. the lower half of the range was nice. pushing 8psi now. apparently the mechanical pump was far weaker than previously thought. with the tune i have now it would run lean with the mechanical pump. now it just goes rich and stays there. 4psi of fuel pressure at idle. ill play with the jetting and throw some new plugs in and see what happens. ill report back when i have some info.
Author:  Serj22 [ Wed Aug 27, 2014 6:02 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
took it to a show tonight. wanted to get it out and test drive it a little. started with the vent tube extensions in and it was pig rich stuck on 10 on the gauge any time i hit the gas. took the vte out of the primaries and it leaned out a little. so now it is time for a jet change. i think im going to put the vte back in the primary and jet down a bunch and see where i sit. it was running crazy rich, breaking up in the higher rpm. the lower half of the range was nice. pushing 8psi now. apparently the mechanical pump was far weaker than previously thought. with the tune i have now it would run lean with the mechanical pump. now it just goes rich and stays there. 4psi of fuel pressure at idle. ill play with the jetting and throw some new plugs in and see what happens. ill report back when i have some info.
What is VTE? I have my 350 sitting in front of me waiting to get the rest of the hanger 18 stuff on. What were you running at before vent tube extensions? I'm curious what effect it has. I'm planning to run one anyway but just trying to figure out where to go with everything.
Author:  Junior [ Wed Aug 27, 2014 7:47 pm ]
Post subject: 
vte=vent tube extension. they basically take the incoming stream of air and jam it into the fuel bowls to help push the fuel out under boost. i didnt run them initially but did make up a set. got it done with jetting the first time. im looking for a little more drive ability with it now so im gonna find a balance of both. (had a race coming up in a couple weeks the first time i tuned so i was only looking at wot afr's) dont drill your pvcr until you know you need to. honestly, just put the foam floats in block off the choke hole and cut the horn off and try it out. you may be surprised. if you need it richer then start with the vte because they are easy and do work. from there go to the jets. if the jet that gets you the right afr under boost is to much for normal cruising then start taking out the pvcr's slowly. once you do that take the jets down a couple sizes and find a happy medium.

im also thinking about putting my brpv back in and giving it another shot. may drill the main body and reference the exhaust pipe from the manifold to the turbo. its a proven setup. back pressure is usually much more then boost pressure so it will kick in as soon as the turbo starts to spool.
Author:  Junior [ Sun Sep 07, 2014 7:50 pm ]
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tuning 1.2. so if you have been keeping up you will know that changing my carb hat turned my afr's to crap. even when they were good the cruise was super rich. all bets are off now im gonna get thing thing to cruise with a good afr and maintain 11.5 under boost. gotta get it done. like before i have a race coming up in october and i would like to get some good times out of it this time out.

i took my carb apart the other day, things popped up didnt get to finish what i wanted to get done. i got a numbered drill bit set a while ago for this but was reluctant to drill into my carb. i was also lacking a pin vice. got the vice and finally got some time tonight to do something with it.

for starters i drilled out the pvcr's with what ever #55 is in the harbor freight set is. (coulda swore there was a list on the box that i saved but i cant find it.) my micrometer only reads down to .00 so the closest measurement i can get is .04 for actual size. im planning on putting a really conservative jet in for the cruise and partial throttle driving and letting the power valve make up the difference when it needs to.

<img src="http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p79/weesers1/Mobile%20Uploads/20140907_213752_zps0nqrdetn.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 20140907_213752_zps0nqrdetn.jpg"/>

you should be able to see the holes i drilled out, they are the two shiny ones at 3&9 o'clock of the big one. i used a smaller drill bit that fit them before i drilled to check the depth, used a sharpie to mark that on the #55 and drilled it out. pretty easy. used a larger bit to bevel the edge to help the fuel find its way into the passages. if any of this turns out to be a bad idea i have a couple extra metering blocks so im not really sweating not taking it step by step.

now that that was out of the way i turned my focus back to the power valve (pv) itself. i had made a boost referenced power valve (brpv) a while ago and it was only good for .5 of an afr point. wound up taking it out and getting where i needed to with bigger jets. as im trying to make this more streetable i obviously cant keep the huge jet in there anymore and the brpv will need to pick up the slack. i kept the original design i had, i liked it it flowed as far as i could tell and i didnt have to notch my float to get it to fit in there. that was a plus for me. now while it did work before brpv's like the one i am using tend to get finicky when they see higher boost levels. i would like to take that out of the equation. if i have to i will drill the main body of my carb into the power valve chamber and run a reference from my j-pipe to use the back pressure to open it. my original setup had a spring from a 6.5 and it worked, didnt take much to open it and it seated when it needed to. i cant leave well enough alone though.

<img src="http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p79/weesers1/Mobile%20Uploads/20140907_222849_zpsq3425pc0.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 20140907_222849_zpsq3425pc0.jpg"/>

from right to left. standard 6.5 spring, the standard 6.5 spring i cut down to reduce the effort needed to open the pv, the new 6.5 spring i heated up in some pliars to soften and shorten to fit better. now i think i got it. the effort needed is next to nothing but there is still enough pressure to keep the valve seated. heated it up while keeping it squished down in some vice grips until it was glowing orange and let it cool. its much easier now. cant wait to try it.

<img src="http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p79/weesers1/Mobile%20Uploads/20140907_215430_zpsrobnnl6b.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 20140907_215430_zpsrobnnl6b.jpg"/>

sits in there nice dont it. now on to the next part. the jets. i dont have any sets smaller than 76 aside from one pair of 51's. so now that i have the numbered drill bit set, to save myself some money im just gonna progressively drill out the 51's. ive always heard not to drill your own jets blah blah blah. thats nice when you have all the possible sets you will need already laying around but thats just not the case with me this time. im gonna drill them to what i need. if i really wanna do something down the road ill look up the measurements and buy a set of the final size. given the 51's were pin holes and the 80's i have are close to 1/8" i think ill start somewhere in the middle.

almost forgot to mention, i am going to use vent tube extensions from the start of this tune, they have proven to help richen up the mix by quite a lot i also unhooked my secondaries and wired them shut. just focusing on the primaries for right now. once i have them dialed in i will open up the back two and get them in line. same thing i did the first time and it worked out well enough.

gonna get it all together tomorrow and take it for a test run. ill update when i have more info. any questions dont be afraid to ask.
Author:  Serj22 [ Sun Sep 07, 2014 10:08 pm ]
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I'm really tempted to pay the $70 for a percy's metering block, and then never change jets. You'd need two for your setup, but I'm willing to experiment with that and see where I can get, and you seem to be chugging away with the brpv research. I'm really interested to see what happens. I was going to run with a standard power valve for starters and then go from there. I'm also surprised no one really sells modified valves. I'm likely going to go the dime route if I do it. I've got three power valves to experiment with.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/php-15001/overview/
Someone can correct me if need be, but I believe it allows you to keep your metering block, and all you're doing is removing the jets, and having this sandwiched on. Might be a good plan...
Author:  emsvitil [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 1:54 am ]
Post subject: 
gauge in mm

107 0.0019 0.048
106 0.0023 0.058
105 0.0027 0.069
104 0.0031 0.079
103 0.0035 0.089
102 0.0039 0.099
101 0.0043 0.109
100 0.0047 0.119
99 0.0051 0.130
98 0.0055 0.140
97 0.0059 0.150
96 0.0063 0.160
95 0.0067 0.170
94 0.0071 0.180
93 0.0075 0.191
92 0.0079 0.201
91 0.0083 0.211
90 0.0087 0.221
89 0.0091 0.231
88 0.0095 0.241
87 0.010 0.254
86 0.0105 0.267
85 0.011 0.279
84 0.0115 0.292
83 0.012 0.305
82 0.0125 0.318
81 0.013 0.330
80 0.0135 0.343
79 0.0145 0.368
78 0.016 0.406
77 0.018 0.457
76 0.020 0.508
75 0.021 0.533
74 0.0225 0.572
73 0.024 0.610
72 0.025 0.635
71 0.026 0.660
70 0.028 0.711
69 0.0292 0.742
68 0.031 0.787
67 0.032 0.813
66 0.033 0.838
65 0.035 0.889
64 0.036 0.914
63 0.037 0.940
62 0.038 0.965
61 0.039 0.991
60 0.040 1.016
59 0.041 1.041
58 0.042 1.067
57 0.043 1.092
56 0.0465 1.181
55 0.052 1.321
54 0.055 1.397
53 0.0595 1.511
52 0.0635 1.613
51 0.067 1.702
50 0.070 1.778
49 0.073 1.854
48 0.076 1.930
47 0.0785 1.994
46 0.081 2.057
45 0.082 2.083
44 0.086 2.184
43 0.089 2.261
42 0.0935 2.375
41 0.096 2.438
40 0.098 2.489
39 0.0995 2.527
38 0.1015 2.578
37 0.104 2.642
36 0.1065 2.705
35 0.110 2.794
34 0.111 2.819
33 0.113 2.870
32 0.116 2.946
31 0.120 3.048
30 0.1285 3.264
29 0.136 3.454
28 0.1405 3.569
27 0.144 3.658
26 0.147 3.734
25 0.1495 3.797
24 0.152 3.861
23 0.154 3.912
22 0.157 3.988
21 0.159 4.039
20 0.161 4.089
19 0.166 4.216
18 0.1695 4.305
17 0.173 4.394
16 0.177 4.496
15 0.180 4.572
14 0.182 4.623
13 0.185 4.699
12 0.189 4.801
11 0.191 4.851
10 0.1935 4.915
9 0.196 4.978
8 0.199 5.055
7 0.201 5.105
6 0.204 5.182
5 0.2055 5.220
4 0.209 5.309
3 0.213 5.410
2 0.221 5.613
1 0.228 5.791
A 0.234 5.944
B 0.238 6.045
C 0.242 6.147
D 0.246 6.248
E 0.250 6.350
F 0.257 6.528
G 0.261 6.629
H 0.266 6.756
I 0.272 6.909
J 0.277 7.036
K 0.281 7.137
L 0.290 7.366
M 0.295 7.493
N 0.302 7.671
O 0.316 8.026
P 0.323 8.204
Q 0.332 8.433
R 0.339 8.611
S 0.348 8.839
T 0.358 9.093
U 0.368 9.347
V 0.377 9.576
W 0.386 9.804
X 0.397 10.08
Y 0.404 10.26
Z 0.413 10.49
Author:  Junior [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 10:03 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
I'm really tempted to pay the $70 for a percy's metering block, and then never change jets. You'd need two for your setup, but I'm willing to experiment with that and see where I can get, and you seem to be chugging away with the brpv research. I'm really interested to see what happens. I was going to run with a standard power valve for starters and then go from there. I'm also surprised no one really sells modified valves. I'm likely going to go the dime route if I do it. I've got three power valves to experiment with.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/php-15001/overview/
Someone can correct me if need be, but I believe it allows you to keep your metering block, and all you're doing is removing the jets, and having this sandwiched on. Might be a good plan...
the only thing i dont really like about the percy's is that they are plastic. not sure if it would hold up to boost. in one of the reviews it says something came apart on it after a year. boost is a lot harder on a carb than normal operation. if you do try them out let me know. im getting pretty tired of dumping gas on my hot pipes. if they make one out of aluminum or some other kind of metal i might go that route in the future.

the standard power valve worked fine at 5 psi, the extra 3 psi i added made it flutter so its not an option for me anymore. there is a joke on theturbofurms about buying a brpv. one company sells them (cant remember which) but you have to buy the carb to get it. if i can figure it out and get it down to a science i may start making them. if and when that ever happens will remain to be seen.
Author:  Junior [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 10:05 am ]
Post subject: 
thank you emsvitil, that will surely come in handy.
Author:  Junior [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 1:38 pm ]
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you wouldnt happen to have jet sizes vs measurements would you?
Author:  Junior [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:24 pm ]
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put some time into the valiant today. started with the 51's and it would barely run, hit the gas and it would backfire through the carb and stall. fun. drilled them out a couple times, got progressively better. wound up drilling to a final size of #49 in my numbered drill bit set. without the vte it gets me a cruise of 14.5-15 and under boost it drops to dead lean. obviously i didnt stay in the gas long just wanted to see what it would do. with the vte i get a cruise of 13.5-14 which i can live with, under boost it drops to 11.5 pretty quick and stays there until 4800rpm where it drops down to 11.3. again i can live with that i shift at 5k. now keep in mind this is only with the primaries and 8lbs of boost. hopefully i can get some time in on the secondaries tomorrow before or after the rain and get them dialed in.
Author:  emsvitil [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 7:13 pm ]
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http://promaxcarbs.bizland.com/HolleyJetSize.pdf
Author:  Junior [ Mon Sep 08, 2014 7:54 pm ]
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you da man. thank you.
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