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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 3:43 pm 
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Turbo Slant 6
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Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2008 1:11 pm
Posts: 538
Location: Las Vegas/Henderson, NV
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install a fish carb

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 3:46 pm 
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Turbo Slant 6
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Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:29 pm
Posts: 681
Location: Seattle, WA
Car Model: 75 Dart SE (2),75 Swinger, 74 Dart Sport,91 Ram RV
a sail... with tailfins added..... hmmmmm........

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"Louise", a 1976 Dart Custom project, (now sadly reverted to being just an "organ donor" to our other project Darts.)


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:12 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2005 8:32 pm
Posts: 7834
Location: Portland-ish
Car Model: Fiat 500e
Quote:
Go downhill! Attach a sail! Strip the car completely bare of everything but the essentials! Draft behind semis! Attach strong magnets to your front bumper to be pulled by the car in front of you!
I think a remote controlled tow bar that could clamp onto a semi-trailer 'bumper' would be the way to go. Gotta have some way to lube the trans though. A single stage rear axle/trans pump like the NASCAR boys and girls use would do. Push-button auto guys already have a rear pump so they would be fine. 8)

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 4:33 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 1:25 pm
Posts: 5611
Location: Downeast Maine
Car Model:
Levity department:
Geo Metro

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 6:59 pm 
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Turbo Slant 6
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Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2008 1:11 pm
Posts: 538
Location: Las Vegas/Henderson, NV
Car Model:
bmw isetta

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 2:06 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 5:35 pm
Posts: 1044
Location: Maine
Car Model:
My dad always got 25 MPG out of his Valiant. His method: "Drive like you had an egg under the gas pedal".

Google "Hypermiling" I think my Dad invented it! :lol:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 5:59 pm 
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EFI Slant 6
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Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 5:19 pm
Posts: 310
Location: New Hampshire
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Really after you hyper tune the engine, remove as much weight as you can, aerodynamics is the next step. Air dams all around except the rear. An under body pan. Also in the days of the Mobil economy runs they use to run the car with the thinest fluids they could get by with in the engine/tranny/wheel bearings/rearend/suspension and the narrowest tire inflated to the highest pressure. Not great for long life but it was great for gas milage...
Lynn


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 Post subject: Dyno run
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 9:52 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 4:57 am
Posts: 1566
Location: Oslo, Norway
Car Model:
Hi guys, here are some real world dyno figures of how to make your engine more efficient, and by that you save fuel. This is the result of a test done with the purpose to get as much power for least amount of money spent as possible. I present this just to show what can be accomplished, regardless of car make. The car is a Nissan Micra, with a four cylinder 1 litre injected engine, manual 4 speed, 130000 km on the odometer. They were given access to a chassis dyno, so all runs are made on the same Dynapack, at least 3 runs after each change.
Starting point: 39.6 Ps @ 5547 rpm / 62.2 Nm @ 4098 rpm
Made a compression test and cylinder leakdown test, and found that all cylinders were in the same range.
1) New air filter + 1.5 Ps
Modification of air intake to filter, removal of restrictions + 1.8-2 Ps

2) Spark plugs: Original plugs NGK. Changed to new NGK - only tiny increase, less than 1 Ps.
The brand matters! Worst spark plug (Beru) DOWN 3 Ps!
Best spark plug: Bosch Super 4 (4 electrode type, better over 3500 rpm) + 1.5 Ps
Result so far: + 4.7 Ps and + 7.1 Nm

3) Old carbon high resistance spark plug wires measured 3 K ohm resistance in the worst (the longest) wire.
Change to copper core spark plug wires, done 20 test runs + 1.9 Ps
Comparison to brand new OEM carbon wires: DOWN 2.6 Ps, actually worse than the old originals!

4) Motor oil changed from 10W40 mineral oil to Red Line 5W20 synthetic
Gave oil pressure right away, rattling noises disappeared and did not return since + 1.6 Ps
Gear oil changed to Red Line MT-90 , after 6 runs + 0.5 Ps
Just for fun, a test of snake oil: Pro-Long motor oil additive, after 9 runs, and to everybodys big surprise, + 1.8 Ps

After 3 additional runs: 49.3 Ps @ 5699 rpm, 75.5 Nm @ 3216 rpm
Test after driving ~300 Km (~190 miles): 50.0 Ps @ 5787 rpm and 75.8 Nm @ 3225 rpm
That is up 10.4 Hp and 13.6 Nm from start, a massive increase of power ~26% and torque ~23% for this tiny engine for a very low cost.
All these things can ANYONE do!

Additional tuning of injection system, modifying exhaust manifold, and camshaft from a 1.3 litre engine with app. 2 mm higher lift, gave:
62.3 Ps, that is 22.7 Ps up from starting point 39.6 Ps, and 81.8 Nm, up 19.6 Nm form starting point 62.2 Nm, but this is not relevant here.

More than 300 runs were made in total, some were gadget tests, and unless they delivered - not mentioned.
I guess most of you don’t read norwegian, after all that is why I translated this test, but here’s a link with plenty graphs from the Dynapack if you want the figures: Micro Micra. Oh, and Ps is a european norm, short for 'Pferdestärke' which is 'Horsepower' in german.
Ok, so this is a tiny engine not related to slantsix, but this is one of the few multi-run dyno tests I have seen that very carefully presents all the data in public. For example, the results for synthetic oil should be better in a bigger engine, and the other results coinside with the suggested mods for the slantsix in general, the biggest gains for the slant can probably be made from valve adjustment and distributor recurving. Re. air filters: Testing has shown that the average stock air cleaner assembly with a new filter drops the typical 700 CFM carburetor to 480 CFM. Adding a second snorkel got it up to 550 CFM. A 14 inch in diameter, 2 inch tall open element air cleaner gave 675 CFM. Two such air filters stacked gave the full 700 CFM. And remember: a 7.2 degree change in air temperature causes a 1% horsepower change. Efficiency = fuel economy.
BTW, one of the best suggestions earlier in this thread: Get rid of unnecessary weight! See this link from dippy.org that gives some weight losses for the Dodge Diplomat.
Olaf

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Last edited by olafla on Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 10:04 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 13105
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model: 76 D100
Lighter weight, synthetic oils are good, less weight in the vehicle is good, lower rolling resistance by inflating tires to the max listed on the sidewall (don't assume it is 35 PSI!), economaster carb, distributor tuning, aerodynamics, free flowing exhaust, cold air intake, keep the carb base heat,etc...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 1:29 pm 
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Turbo Slant 6
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Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:29 pm
Posts: 681
Location: Seattle, WA
Car Model: 75 Dart SE (2),75 Swinger, 74 Dart Sport,91 Ram RV
Thanks to Olaf for the super info on the subject! Thanks also to Chuck and Doug for giving us this site to communicate like this. The original question sure opened a quality thread of ideas from everyone in the discussions! I'm sure there are magazine articles addressing the MPG subject, but what a broad variety of responses have shown up here. Awsome. Thanks to all. Pat

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"Louise", a 1976 Dart Custom project, (now sadly reverted to being just an "organ donor" to our other project Darts.)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 2:42 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2002 5:39 pm
Posts: 24513
Location: North America
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VERY good point on the oil selection, Reed; that should've been brought up earlier in this thread. Many of us are running oil far thicker than we ought to, based on outdated and incorrect notions of what is needed for optimal engine protection. Fact is, the only reason to run a heavy grade of oil is to squeeze a last few miles out of a whipped (worn out) engine, to buy time before rebuild or replacement. I'm running 0w30 synthetic in my '73 Dart right now. Oil pressure comes up much faster on first startup than it did with heavier grades, and there's zero indication of any inadequacy in engine protection at speed and under load. Pumping drag is much lower than with heavier-weight oils. The same goes for other lubes, too; the rear axle will be considerably easier to spin, particularly when cold, if it is filled with an appropriate grade of synthetic rather than conventional oil.

Note you needn't waste money on exotic (RedLine) or hype-marketed (scAmsoil) boutique oils. "Ordinary" Mobil-1 or Castrol Syntec or anything of that type from the parts store shelf will be much better than adequate. And likewise you shouldn't waste money on engine or oil additives or "treatments".

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:21 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 4:57 am
Posts: 1566
Location: Oslo, Norway
Car Model:
A little comment to Dan's remarks. As I understand, the snake-oil test was done just for fun, and because there have been endless debates pro and con in a lot of forums everywhere, it was probably done to make someone shut up and stop nagging! The testers do NOT recommend any kind of additive, one spray can with some carb+injectioncleaner/power-adder stuff they tested caused a teardown and cleaning of the entire injection system and the purchase of a new lambda sensor! The company that have the Dynapack also distributes Red Line oils, thats the reason for testing that brand, I am sure any synthetic oil for winter use would have given a positive result. The price for Mobil1 and RedLine here in Norway are on the same level - just above horrendous!
Olaf

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