This is Nice, Too bad I cant contrubite much Since I havt done this yet, But It will help out many!
Greg
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| T-5 conversion. https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42988 |
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| Author: | raPoM [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 1:47 am ] |
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Thanks Sandy. Any pictures of where the shifter ends up in the car? |
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| Author: | Sam Powell [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 6:32 am ] |
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I should say a word about leveling out the bell housing. You use a magnetic mount surface gauge on the flywheel that sticks out through the hole in the bell to you see if the hole is concentric, and if the trans mount is flat. I had to level mine with shim brass under the upper right hand corner of the bell. This brought the hole to the center, and leveled the surface sufficiently. There is a tolerance of .004". You rotate the crank and watch the readings of the surface gauge bearing on the inside surface of the bearing retainer hole. They showa photo of this set up in the Factory Service manual. The service manual does not mention shims between the the bell housing and block. That was my solution. In fact the do not mention the level of the trans mount surface at all. Instead their solution is to put offset pins in the block that shift the bell off to one side or the other. However, when I measured the level of the trans mount surface, I found that it was off in a way that shimming would level it, and center the hole as well. So that is what I did. I think I ended up with a .030 shim that started about the upper center of the block and wraps down around the right hand side to the bottom. Shimming the right hand side of the bell moved the hole over to the left, which was what was needed to get it into spec. This may seem excessive to some, but there has never been a hint of vibration from the drive train. Sam |
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| Author: | Greg Ondayko [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 6:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | This is good |
This is Nice, Too bad I cant contrubite much Since I havt done this yet, But It will help out many! Greg |
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| Author: | Sam Powell [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 7:53 am ] |
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Greg, I will trade you t-5 help for EFI help. Sam |
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| Author: | Sam Powell [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 8:42 am ] |
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I tracked down the specs I recorded for both the rear and transmission ratios of my application. The rear is 3.21:1. The OD ratio on this tranny is .794, which makes the final drive 2.55 First gear... 4.1:1 final drive 13.1 2nd gear.... 2.35 final drive 7.54 3rd gear....1.46 final drive 4.7 4th gear 1:1 final drive, 3.21 The calculated RPM at 60 in 4th is 2590 and in 5th is 2051. As stated earlier, I would prefer a lower ratio 1st gear. I think there is a t-5 with a first gear ratio of around 3.21 or 2.97 which I think would work a little better for street use. This winds out pretty fast, and you find yourself shifting pretty early in daily driving. One of the ideals that is out there in the slant tech world is for the final drive to be around 10:1 in first gear. I don't have any reason to argue with that. I think I read it first in an article in the old Slant Six News, most likely by Doug. SAm |
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| Author: | sandy in BC [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 9:20 am ] |
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Quote: Any pictures of where the shifter ends up in the car?
no...........
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| Author: | Greg Ondayko [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 11:02 am ] |
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Quote: Greg, I will trade you t-5 help for EFI help.
Cool, I'm In
Sam |
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| Author: | Greg Ondayko [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 11:06 am ] |
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Quote: As stated earlier, I would prefer a lower ratio 1st gear. I think there is a t-5 with a first gear ratio of around 3.21 or 2.97 which I think would work a little better for street use. This winds out pretty fast, and you find yourself shifting pretty early in daily driving. One of the ideals that is out there in the slant tech world is for the final drive to be around 10:1 in first gear. I don't have any reason to argue with that. I think I read it first in an article in the old Slant Six News, most likely by Doug. SAm Sam, I think You mean Higher 1st gear - (lower Numerically) Right? Yes the 4.XX ist gear is for 4 cylinder cars. The duster Has a 3.09 in the 833/OD with a 3.21 Rear Which is just about right... I might even perfer a 3.0 or a 2.97 But with the hills here the 3.09 is definitely Livable. Greg |
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| Author: | raPoM [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 11:56 am ] |
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Quote: Quote: Any pictures of where the shifter ends up in the car?
no........... Thanks Sandy. Looks like the perfect spot!
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| Author: | Sam Powell [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 7:16 pm ] |
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Right. Lower ratio numerical ratio. That is always a point of confusion when discussing both tranny and rear end ratios. The point is to get the final drive in first closer to 10:1. I promise clutch info tomorrow. And, if I can remember how to do it, I will post the photo of the tranny and engine together outside the car. Sam |
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| Author: | Dart270 [ Sat Dec 25, 2010 9:04 pm ] |
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Sorry to join this late... been on the road with limited time. See these pics: http://www.flickr.com/photos/16910097@N ... 013976355/ Includes pics of upper and lower X member, shifter location in center of hole behind upper X in one pic, Wilwood master cyl mounting, group buy bellhousing with 3/8" steel adapter plate... Mustang T5 new from Ford Racing in 2002. Ratios: 2.95 1.94 1.34 1.00 0.63 Very dependable setup. Easy cruising at 100 MPH, drag raced into the mid 14s on autoX tires, lots of road course laps (thousand or so?). Top recorded speed = 130 MPH with 3.91 rear gear and still pulling. I will have it out again in a few weeks to put in a new engine and can take pics of clutch/TOB setup (McLeod Hydro w/Wilwood master). I am hoping to have this car back together by March and possibly make MATS and/or Spring Fling in CA in April. Happy to give rides on street or track. Cheers, Lou |
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| Author: | Sam Powell [ Sun Dec 26, 2010 6:16 am ] |
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Welcome Lou, and thanks for the photos. I took the liberty of multiplying out the final drive ratios in each of your gears, and compared them to mine. This is what I came up with final drive ratios..Lou's 64......Sam's '69 first................... 11.53.......... 13.1 second................7.58..............7.54 3rd.....................5.23 ..............4.7 4th......................3.91..............3.21 5th......................2.46..............2.55 It is interesting to note that the final drive is not that different. And second is almost identical. The biggest difference is first gear, and Lou's is closer to 10, but further from it than I thought it would be. If memory serves me, Lou's slant turns close to 6k RPM. I don't know his tire size, but if it is close to the typical 25" tall, this combo should carry him to about 38 MPH in first gear. Where as mine is topped out at 30 reving to the 5K I use as red line. So you can see that his lower numerical ratio first gear is better in many ways. SAm |
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| Author: | 65 dartman [ Sun Dec 26, 2010 6:33 am ] |
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Interesting thread - subscribed! |
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| Author: | Sam Powell [ Sun Dec 26, 2010 6:34 am ] |
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Clutch. The simplest clutch set up with the T-5 requires a magic part number. McCleod part number 16061-M is the throwout bearing that fits the T-5 and the Mopar carrier. With this part you can use all the stock Mopar linkage and just bolt it up with no modifications. When I bought mine, I purchased two, just to have a back up. It is still in the drawer for if and when I need it. I think this bearing is just a tad thinner than the Mopar one, and as a result it does shorten the usefull throw just a bit, but does work. If you push the clutch linkage in too far, the tabs on the carrier will engage the springs on the clutch face and keep it spinning, thus failing to release fully. When I first set it up, I could put it in gear and start it, but could not shift into gear after starting it up. Close inspection revealed what was happening, and I just backed off on the adjustment some, and it worked fine. You could build a stop of some kind into the fork if you wanted to do so. Also, perhaps if you wanted to do so you could put a spacer on the carrier before installing the bearing to make it set out just bit further forward. It has worked quite reliably for ten years now. There are many clutch disks that will work. The key is to know the size and spline count. I got mine from Shelby Parts Restoration, 225 O'Conner Rd, Green bay Wisconsin, 54314. I got that supplier from Red at McCleod. If I recall correctly the clutch I first used was a disk that fit many Fords from the mid 50's all the way through to today. I remember passing a part number along to Lou some time back but have since lost track of it myself. Sam |
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| Author: | Sam Powell [ Sun Dec 26, 2010 7:27 am ] |
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In my previous post there was one omission and one error. Omission. I did not mention the flywheel and pressure plate. I used the flywheel and pressure plate from a stock late model Volare/Aspen. I don't remember the last year they were produced, but I think mine was from an '80. I bought the flywheel from a junk yard. The pressure plate came from Napa. Error. Thinking back on the previous post, I now think the problem I had with the clutch not disengaging fully was related to this flywheel/pressure plate combo, and not from the McCleod throwout bearing. I seem to recall having to go through that diagnosis while the 833 OD was in there, long before I switched to the T-5. So, take my comments about the 16061-M throwout bearing and uh....throw them out. I think it is pretty much a bolt in replacement. At least that is my current memory. Sam |
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