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Question for Dan on Evans coolant.
https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=47066		 Page 2 of 2
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Wed Nov 23, 2011 8:55 pm ]
Post subject: 
Just in routine handling of it (between the fingers) it's about as slippery as ethylene glycol. However, it is not ethylene glycol. It's propylene glycol. If the rulebook says "no ethylene glycol", then you could technically be in compliance with Evans. :twisted:
Author:  Guido [ Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:30 pm ]
Post subject: 
Pure Propylene Glycol boils at 371° F. That shouldn't be a problem.

Flash point is 210°F

Autoignition is 700° F

LEL is 2.6%
UEL is 12.5%
That's pretty wide.

I have an idea the track is not going to have a sense of humor about this stuff.
Thermal expansion is higher than that of Ethylene Glycol, so have a larger expansion tank.

Cleanup would entail much the same method used for Ethylene Glycol.

Sounds like good stuff, but dealing with an NHRA fee might not be worth it. Many tracks now allow street cars to run anti-freeze coolant. They may be less forgiving for a race only vehicle.

2¢

Guido
Author:  Old6rodder [ Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
Rats. I'd hoped for better, but given the particulars that's about what I expected.

While I don't care much for NHRA, or their paranoia of late, I do care about my fellow racers.
So, water & wetter (& rust) it still is for now.
Where's a "resigned to" icon when you need one? :lol:

Thank you.
Author:  Dart270 [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 4:02 am ]
Post subject: 
Personally, I've been at enough events that have been severely delayed by oil or coolant spills on the track. I support fines or other "encouragements" to keep people from track spills. I don't know how NHRA is implementing this, but anything is better than nothing, which is what most tracks do now.

Lou
Author:  Sam Powell [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 5:02 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Pure Propylene Glycol boils at 371° F. That shouldn't be a problem.

Flash point is 210°F

Autoignition is 700° F

LEL is 2.6%
UEL is 12.5%
That's pretty wide.

I have an idea the track is not going to have a sense of humor about this stuff.
Thermal expansion is higher than that of Ethylene Glycol, so have a larger expansion tank.

Cleanup would entail much the same method used for Ethylene Glycol.

Sounds like good stuff, but dealing with an NHRA fee might not be worth it. Many tracks now allow street cars to run anti-freeze coolant. They may be less forgiving for a race only vehicle.

2¢

Guido
Guido, would you, or someone else explain the abbreviations above. What is LEL and UEL? And for us real dummies what is the difference between flash point and autoignition? Does this stuff really light off at 210 degrees? That does not seem possible. Obviously I do not understand.

Sam
Author:  Charrlie_S [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 5:08 am ]
Post subject: 
Going from memory on the rule book, I think it states "water only as a coolant". However I don't think they enforce this rule for "street driven" cars. A couple of years ago Gainesville raceway, checked the cooling system of every "race car" coming through tech.
PS: you were not allowed to "dump" the coolant in the pits, to replace with plain water.
Author:  Guido [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 7:37 am ]
Post subject: 
Flash point is where vapors become igniteable in air.
Autoignition, the substance will spontaneously ignite in normal air without an ignition source.
LEL, lower explosive limit.
UEL, upper explosive limit.

:D

Guido
Author:  Sam Powell [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 8:09 am ]
Post subject: 
Thanks. What's an explosive limit. I know, I could look it up, but this way you get tease me a bit. :wink: Interesting that the flash point would be lower than the boiling point. I guess the moment vaporization happens, it is flammable. If it is hot enough to boil, you wonder why it does not ignite then, since the flash point is 161 degrees lower than the boiling point.

Sam
Author:  Guido [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 8:17 am ]
Post subject: 
The limits indicate how rich or lean the mixture can be to create a flash of fire, given an ignition source.

Just like the mixture of gasoline has to be between two limits to work in your engine. The upper and lower explosive limits. Though we don't like to think of it as an explosion, in effect that's what happens each time your spark plug fires.

Guido
Author:  slantzilla [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 9:42 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Going from memory on the rule book, I think it states "water only as a coolant". However I don't think they enforce this rule for "street driven" cars. A couple of years ago Gainesville raceway, checked the cooling system of every "race car" coming through tech.
PS: you were not allowed to "dump" the coolant in the pits, to replace with plain water.
The last time I was down at 41 with the red car the tech guy asked what was in the radiator, but never opened the cap to look. 41 is an outlaw track, so even they are getting tired of cleaning up the stuff.
Author:  Old6rodder [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:30 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Personally, I've been at enough events that have been severely delayed by oil or coolant spills on the track. I support fines or other "encouragements" to keep people from track spills. I don't know how NHRA is implementing this, but anything is better than nothing, which is what most tracks do now.

Lou
Yeah, they're working toward pans and/or diapers as mandatory out here.

Can't say as I disagree with this one. Blown engines, gearboxes, rear ends, are part & parcel of racing, but considerations that help the clean-up crew get the racing back up sooner are desirable to all of us. I've sat out back to back oildowns in the lanes at Famoso in the summer heat. Too well strapped in to want to cause another delay waiting for me to strap back in whenever the line moves again, I sit, broiling in my (admittedly stupid, but oh, so "cool" :twisted:) black suit.

Also, oildowns add up to cost us runs. Last year we seldom got three quals in on Saturdays at the ANRA meets.
That makes for but three runs at a two day meet when you go out in the first round as I often do in Open Wheel (I'm not much of a bracket racer :oops:).

Anyone ever build a dragster with A/C? :roll:
Author:  Charrlie_S [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:38 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Anyone ever build a dragster with A/C? :roll:
Not yet, but sent it to my shop to be number one. :shock: :roll:
Author:  Old6rodder [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:44 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Quote:
Anyone ever build a dragster with A/C? :roll:
Not yet, but sent it to my shop to be number one. :shock: :roll:
You got it. Soon as I can afford the shipping, cost, and weight penalty. :lol:
Author:  Rick Covalt [ Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Lel
Quote:
What's an explosive limit.
Sam I work with natural gas, and the LEL is the point at which the mixture of gas in air is too lean to explode (not enough gas in the mixture). The UEL is at the opposite end of the scale where the mixture is too rich to burn (too much gas in the mixture) I'm sure this is similar to what he's talking about.


Rick
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