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| Removing the Head with the manifolds attached? https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=50021 |
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| Author: | valiant200kid [ Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:12 am ] |
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Quote:
63gtcv wrote:
Best mechanic I ever known told me that a Holley 4bbl was good for standing on to work on a real engine. Stand on that. What about a Holley 1945 1 barrel under each foot?    i think that would kinda hurt
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| Author: | cw6er [ Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:08 pm ] |
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Wow, thanks for all of the great replies! The camps seem to be divided, except to agree that a hoist is highly recommended either way, and I agree. I'm 5'-11" and figured I'd have to be 8' to bend at the waist and reach the back studs. I did crawl into the the bay with the front of my thighs almost to my knees on the fender and supporting myself with one hand on the frame to spray some penetrating oil, but figured it would be a bit futile to try to remove/replace them one-handed. And I still haven't seen the nut under the choke box, even with an inspection mirror! As far as removing the hood, the huge hinges keep you from sliding back along the fender to the firewall to get a straight angle to access the rear bolts between the runners, so I thought I would remove the hood and close the hinges to get them out of the way. I thought about climbing into the engine bay like I used to on an old Military Deuce and a Half 6X6 truck I used to have for plowing snow at the airport, but i don't have my youthful figure anymore and the bones and joints don't fold up like they used to, so I'm not sure I would fit! In keeping with my two basic tenets of the "KISS" system (Keep It Simple Stupid) and "If It A'int Broke, Don't Fix It", I decided to look at pulling the head with the manifolds attached since they weren't leaking, or cracked and seemed perfectly happy with the way they were bolted on. Especially after reading about how particular the manifolds need to bolt up so that they move and the religious wars on which gasket to use, etc. And this is not an engine rebuild, just a quick and dirty head gasket replacement (the leak-down test had air leaking between Cyls 3 and 4). As to an engine hoist, I haven't had one in years. I left mine at the airport I used to run. My previous house had a Come-a-Long hanging from some reinforced rafters in the garage, but I don't have one in the current house. Hmmm ...... I wonder if the neighbor would miss their swing set !?! Ah .... Er .... I mean "Hoist 'A' Frame".  I'm going to see if I can pull it this afternoon, More to come. Thanks Chris |
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| Author: | Reed [ Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:33 pm ] |
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If you have a garage or a carport where you can span a couple rafters/joist with a 2 or 4x4, you could use a chainfall and a strap to lift just the head and manifolds. Remember, the head and manifolds weighs about as much as the average adult. I bet you could put a simple hoist together for under $100. I am 6'4" 300 pounds and I even I balk at pull the head and manifolds as a unit. I've done it when I had to, but it really is a PITA. |
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| Author: | ESP47 [ Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:49 pm ] |
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Put a socket on a long extension and just move it around under that choke pocket blindly until you feel it grab the nut. It confused me when I first did it as well. Now I can find it without looking in 2 seconds. Don't even waste your time trying to see in there. |
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| Author: | Jeb [ Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:25 am ] |
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Use a 1/4 drive socket and extensions, they are a lot easier to get in those tight places with. Just use caution before putting mucho grande torque on them. Hope you have already started soaking the nuts in penetrating oil. PB Blaster works good. What I do is reach up under the manifold and put my finger on the nut, then guide the socket toward my finger. Lot faster than just stabbing around blindly. |
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| Author: | mcnoople [ Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:31 am ] |
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The best advice there is for leaning over the fender of something like a truck is cheap and easy. Deflate the front tires until the top of the fender is at a comfortable working height. You can lower the fender line by 6 inches and that makes all the difference in the world when trying to reach things. You might find you don't even need a milk crate anymore. |
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| Author: | Danarchy [ Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:15 am ] |
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Quote: Deflate the front tires
The simplest ideas are usually the Best!Great Idea mcnoople! Sorry, but I can't even imagine taking the head off with the manifolds attached. |
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| Author: | cw6er [ Sun Oct 14, 2012 9:05 pm ] |
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Well, the head's off. I pulled it with the manifolds attached and the fact that they were attached did not present a single issue. All I had to do was break loose two rusted nuts on the manifold to down pipe studs using a 1/2" breaker bar, with plenty of access, while comfortably standing on a step stool. It was so easy, no muss, no fuss, I just can't imagine doing it any other way. I don't see any gain what-so-ever in messing with 13 rusted nuts of various degrees of inaccessibility while precariously sprawled over a fender or actually balled-up inside the engine bay. The only issue I had was due to the fact I didn't have a proper cherry-picker engine hoist (I was going to rent one until I realized I didn't have a truck to pick it up with!! ) I had to use a Hoist 'A' Frame that was too short. (Hmm ... the neighbor kids are in their back yard crying .... I guess they did miss their swing set!  ). And to get the 'A' frame back far enough to be centered over the head, I had to remove the hood, but that was an issue with the hoist I was using, not that the manifolds were attached.The "A" Frame is too sort, the Come-a-long takes up most of the space between the frame and the head: <img src="http://bigcoupe.com/ims/pic.php?u=21GvpX2&i=418"> The Come-a-long repositioned using the pulley to maximize the lift. <img src="http://bigcoupe.com/ims/pic.php?u=21GvpX2&i=419"> The head off, no issues with the manifold. Just pushed the truck back and lowered the head onto a dolly. <img src="http://bigcoupe.com/ims/pic.php?u=21GvpX2&i=420"> |
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| Author: | cw6er [ Tue Oct 16, 2012 8:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | Checking head for warping |
What thickness feeler gauge should be used under a straight edge to check for warping in the head? The manual I have says it should be a max of 0.00075" times the span length of the deck, (but doesn't spec. the units, so i assume in inches?). Now I have a 24" straight edge, so that would be 0.00075" x 24 or 0.018" - or should I use the entire length of the head approx. 26")? That would be 0.00075" x 26" or 0.0195". I guess if it passes at 0.018" the point is moot. I got interrupted, hope to have the surfaces cleaned off today. |
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| Author: | Jeb [ Tue Oct 16, 2012 8:28 am ] |
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I would recommend taking the head to a machine shop and getting it resurfaced. Straight six heads have a tendency to warp due to their length, plus all of the years of heat cycling. Some bow in the middle, while others actually twist slightly (like mine). If resurfacing is not in your budget, then I would check it for warping from corner to corner, and then from end to end. The corner to corner will help you tell if it has twisted or not. End from end will help you spot a bow in the middle. |
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| Author: | tlrol [ Fri Oct 19, 2012 6:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Removal/Install of head with manifolds attached |
Glad to see that the removal worked out. I recently did the same thing. Let me point out that removal is quite easy...re-installing the head is a bit more of a struggle with the manifolds on. The difficult part, if it is just you, is getting the cylinder head to SLANT just right. Damn difficult. I had to get the help of my 16 year and 14 year daughters which was worth every minute (read hours) spent doing it. If I was doing this again I would consider getting perhaps two very long threaded rods in order to guide the head onto the block. I really did spend about two hours fiddling in order to get the head to engage the dowels properly for the re-install. I would state, for the record, that if you have a hoist you should always remove the head and manifolds as a unit. It would be damn silly to waste your time and back on removing the manifolds while in the car. It is much easier to remove the manifolds when the head is free of the engine/car/truck/whatever. For the re-install, choose your poison...if you put it all back as a single unit you will need to to sort out how to get the head to slant in a direction opposite of where all the manifold weight is. Honestly, without some extra hands or perhaps guide rods threaded into the head I would suggest you re-install the head first, and then the manifolds. Your setup might be a bit easier since your hood is removed. I left the hood on my truck which limited my ability to climb inside the engine bay. |
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| Author: | Rust collector [ Fri Oct 19, 2012 7:08 am ] |
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And don't get a finger stuck between the block and head, while the head gets stuck on the dowel pin. 
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| Author: | PiD v4.0 [ Sun Oct 21, 2012 9:42 pm ] |
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I've done it both ways. Doing a head swap without a hoist/crane/block&tackle is just plain stupid. The Alloy head on my Renault 16 is a one handed lift, the slant doesn't even budge,... There's no way I'm ever doing it sans-manifolds ever again - the weight of the manifolds balances the weight of the head, when measuring from a balance point of the two threaded holes in the top surface that are meant to be used as pick-up points, same as they were used as at the factory for installation. Fitting with manifolds is very easy with engine crane IMHO, all you have to do is take it slowly! I've done the head swap from a car body with hyperpak and tuned headers coming off, and stock manifolds going on, and done the fitting of the whole engine with the hyperpak and headers - it is much much much easier to get the manifolds torqued up on the engine out of the vehicle, then it is leaning over the guards, and I had no clearance issues getting the whole lot in on an early a-body, so later A's and trucks should be easier due to the extra space. PiD v4.0 |
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