Hey All,
Found THIS:

http://www.batterystuff.com/kb/articles ... asics.html

The article referenced above says that Lorrie's Battery is at 25%.

It MAY be that the problem all along has been the Battery.

It is a:
NAPA Legend 75
NAPA Number 7565
BCI = 65
CA@32F = 1040
CCA@0F = 880

Went out this afternoon and checked the Battery. It had 12.12 Volts. With the Temperatures near 70 degrees, gave the Carburetor a one second shot of Start Fluid. Lorrie didn't even cough when the Starter was cranked.

So have the Battery Charger back on the Battery set at 6 Amps.

Will go out in a couple of hours and see if Lorrie will start. If she does, am going to STRONGLY suspect that the problem is the Battery.

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor

Hey All,
Thursday Afternoon Update:

REAL PROGRESS!!!

Charged Lorrie's Battery for three hours on the Charger's 6 Amp Setting. With the Charger charging, checked the Battery. Got a reading of 13.31 Volts. Turned the Charger off, and checked the Battery. Got a reading of 12.84 Volts.

Gave the Carburetor a shot of Start Fluid, and keyed the Start Switch. Lorrie's MIGHTY 225 Slant Six STARTED RIGHT UP!

With the Engine running, checked the Battery. Got a reading of 15.74 Volts.

Revved the Engine up and got a reading as high as 15.96 Volts.

Kept the Engine revved up and the reading fell to 14.90 and stayed there.

Shut the Engine down and checked the Battery and got a reading of 12.60

So what does this tell us?

Got a reading of 12.84 Volts after being charged with 13.31 Volts for three hours.

Started the Engine and brought it up to operating temperature. Alternator was charging at 15.74 Volts at idle, 15.96 Volts revved up, dropping to 14.90 where it went steady. Shut the Engine down and checked the Battery and it is at 12.60 Volts. We sustained a loss of .14 Volts during the time that Lorrie's Engine was running.

Am going to check the Voltage tomorrow morning at 4:00 a.m. when it's cold. Am going to bet that it WON'T still be at 12.60 Volts. Whether or not it is, will hook up the Charger at the 6 Amp setting and let it charge till 7:00 a.m. and will then see if the 225 will start. If it will, we'll know that the temperature has nothing to do with it.

Am concluding that the problem all along has been the Battery.

QUESTION: What about the Battery would make it have a charging rate of up to 15.96 Volts? Is that an indication that there might be a short in one of the cells?

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor

You may want to consider that a bad regulator has caused the battery to overcharge, damaging it in the process.
A high internal battery resistance or open charging circuit will cause the over voltage as well.
Put a new battery in and check the charge voltage again. You should not see it above about 14 to 14.5 max.

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Mattelderca
78 NYB (gone now), two S series, three old Snow Cruisers and a Doo.

Hey Mr. M,
Actually, the present Voltage Regulator is BRAND NEW. It is a replacement for ANOTHER brand NEW Voltage Regulator that was causing the Battery to see over 18 Volts. It was most likely THAT Voltage Regulator that over charged, and damaged the Battery. Still have the offending Voltage Regulator.

The Battery was acquired from NAPA. And BOTH Voltage Regulators were ALSO acquired from NAPA.
"High internal battery resistance"? "Open charging circuit"? Will have to research these terms.
Yesterday with Lorrie's Engine revved up, the Multi-Tester settled to a 14.90 Voltage charging rate.

After shutting the Engine down, and checking the Voltage, got a reading of 12.61 Volts. Re-checked the Battery two hours later, and it was down to 12.51 Volts. Am going to go out this morning and re-check the Voltage. Am betting that it will be even LOWER than 12.51.

Am going to be calling NAPA this morning to find out what their protocol is in a situation such as this.

Will post the results of THAT call.

Anyway, thanks for the comment. Hope you are well.

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor

Hey All,
Early Friday Morning Update:

Just checked Lorrie's Battery at 6:25 a.m. It's 34 Degrees outside. Yesterday after running, Lorrie's Battery was at 12.61 Volts. Two hours later it was at 12.51 Volts. This morning it is down to 12.39 Volts.

Have the Battery charging at 6 Amps.

Will be going out at 8:00 a.m. to see what Voltage has been reached.

Will attempt to start the Engine.

Will be calling NAPA later this morning to see what their protocol is in this situation.

Will keep you all updated.

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor

Hey All,
Friday Morning Update

Overnight the Battery went from 12.51 Volts to 12.39 volts.

Put the Charger on Lorrie Battery at 6:25 a.m. going at 6 Amps. Went out at 8:30 a.m. and the temperature is 40 degrees. Checked the Battery. It was being charged at 14.94 Volts.

Shut the Charger off, and checked the Battery. It had 13.36 Volts without the Charger going. Am thinking that 13.36 Volts was probably just a surface charge. When the Charger was put on this morning, the Battery had 12.39 Volts. After two hours of charging, it had 13.36 Volts, a .97 Volt increase.

Tried to start the engine without Starting Fluid. Wouldn’t start.

Tried it WITH Starting Fluid. Wouldn’t start.

Checked the Battery after trying to start. It was down to 12.94 Volts.

Lorrie just will not start when she’s cold.

Just went out and unhooked the Ground Cable from the Battery. Checked the Battery. it was down from 12.94 to 12.58 Volts. It had lost .36 Volt in a matter of 20 minutes.

Will check it again in an hour or so. If it is STILL at 12.58 THAT will indicate that the Voltage has been going somewhere. If it is lower than 12.58 it will have lost voltage without access to a short which will mean that there is something wrong with the Battery.

Will keep you all updated.

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor

Hey All
Second Afternoon Update:

Just removed Lorrie's Battery and installed Ms. American's Battery. Checked the 3.14's Battery and it was at 12.33 Volts.

Started the Engine, and checked the 3.14's Battery. It was getting 14.90 Volts at idle. Revved the Engine up and the Voltage went up to 15.11.

Shut the Engine down and checked the 3.14's Battery. It had 12.97 Volts, much of that is probably surface charge.

Checked on Lorrie Battery, and it had 12.67 Volts.

Took the 3.14's Battery out and reinstalled it back into Ms. American. Checked it immediately and it had 12.76 Volts.

Reinstalled Lorrie's Battery, and checked it. It has 12.67 Volts, and the "-" Cable is not hooked up.

Then checked Ms. American's Battery and it is down to 12.54 Volts.

Does any of this make any sense?

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor

With the other battery and your charge voltage still climbing over 15 I still think you have regulator issues.
Have the battery load tested to see if it is indeed good or not.

_________________
Mattelderca
78 NYB (gone now), two S series, three old Snow Cruisers and a Doo.

Hey Mr. M,
This is the second Voltage Regulator that has been put in recently. The first one was supplying over 18 Volts to the Battery. Changed it out for this one, and this one did better, but it still isn't right.
Am going to do that next time I go to Livingston, Texas. I live in a very small town thirteen miles from Livingston, and don't get out that much.

Anyway, thanks for the response.

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor

You could have a voltage drop in the regulator sense wire. Or a drop in the alternator ignition feed. These are basically the same feed on most Mopars. Most harnesses split this feed somewhere near the ballast resistor. If the regulator does not see exactly the same voltage as the battery, you can overvoltage the system.
I do not think that your charging issues are the cause of your starting problems though. I think they are just a symptom of all that's going on.

_________________
Mattelderca
78 NYB (gone now), two S series, three old Snow Cruisers and a Doo.

Hey Mr. M,
This vehicle (Lorrie Van Haul) has been completely rewired and also has Daniel's HEI modification, so it isn't like "most Mopars".
Lorrie doesn't have a Wiring Harness, nor does she have a Ballast Resistor.
Alright.
Nor do I. It's just that in chasing the culprit that is causing the intermittent start/non-start situation, have run across this OTHER Voltage Regulator/Battery problem.
Have to agree.

Could the size of the wires used in the Charging Circuit have anything to do with the Voltage Regulator seeing a different amount of voltage than does the Battery?

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor

It could, where does you regulator get it's ignition feed from? Just take a voltage reading at the regulator to know for sure. Do it with the engine running and compare it to the battery voltage. They should be as close as possible.

_________________
Mattelderca
78 NYB (gone now), two S series, three old Snow Cruisers and a Doo.

Hey Mr. M,
It gets it from a Mil-Spec "Run Switch".
Just went out and took the Wire TO the Voltage Regulator "Ign" Terminal off of Terminal. Hooked up the Battery. Turned the Run Switch ON. Used a Multi-Tester to read the Voltage on that Wire. Compared it to the Voltage of the Battery.

The Voltage at the Fitting that goes onto the "Ign" Terminal of the Voltage Regulator was 12.49 Volts.

The Voltage across the Battery's "+" and "-" Posts was 12.50.

Am losing .01 Volts THROUGH the Wiring FROM the Battery TO the Fuse Panel, THROUGH the Fuse, then FROM the Fuse TO the Switch, THROUGH the Switch, then THROUGH the Wire FROM the Switch TO the Voltage Regulator Fitting.
Am apprehensive about doing this with the Engine running as the Wire would have to be connected to the Voltage Regulator and there is a warning on the Voltage Regulator to NOT short any VR Terminal to Ground.

But it appears that the amount of loss FROM the Battery to the Voltage Regulator is minimal.

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor

Hey All,
Saturday Afternoon Update:

Temperature was 29 Degrees at 6:30 a.m. Went out and checked the Voltage in the Batteries. Lorrie’s was down from last night's 12.67 Volts to this morning's 12.50 Volts.

Ms. American’s was down from last night's 12.54 Volts to this morning's 12.34 Volts. The temperature was also down to 28 Degrees earlier this morning.

Temperature was 40 Degrees at 8:00 a.m. Tried to start Lorrie up. She wouldn’t start. Checked the battery afterwards and it was down to 12.30 Volts.

Temperature outside is above 70 degrees at 3:30 p.m. Went out and checked the Battery. It was up from this morning's 12.30 Volts to this afternoon's 12.45 Volts.

Connected the Battery and turned on the Run Switch, and without giving any Throttle, keyed the Start Switch and THE ENGINE STARTED RIGHT UP!

Checked the Battery with the Engine running it was charging at 14.90 Volts.

Revved the Engine up and the Voltage went up to 16.02 Volts.

Shut the Engine down after about five minutes, and checked the Battery. It was at 12.79 Volts.

Disconnected the Battery, locked Lorrie up, and came in.

The only difference between the Engine starting and not starting is the ambient temperature.

Am going to try an experiment tomorrow morning. Am going to take a small amount of gasoline in a glass container and put it in a bowl of hot water to warm it up. Am then going to prime Lorrie's MIGHTY 225 Slant Six with warm gasoline and see if she will start.

Will let you know how it goes.

JC

_________________
Lorrie Van Haul - 1967 Dodge - P200 Post Office Vehicle - 225 Slant Six - Torqueflite A727 Automatic Transmission - Right Hand Drive Steering - Big Three HEI System - Frantz Oil Cleaner System - Bendix Stromberg Model W Carburetor