Oil slinger orientation question:

Here is a nice picture of an oil slinger, timing chain slipped off of crank sprocket during cam sprocket removal (don’t ask, just chalked it up to retching up PIA factor), and I got a good look at oil slinger and wonder if it is installed correctly.

Currently slinger is positioned as one in Mancinii photo with cam sprocket in foreground, and slinger’s backside up against crankshaft shoulder at face of block's casting with a small space between sprocket and slinger snout. Is this right?

I don’t recall how it was assembled during engine tear-down three months ago, and can’t find a clear explanation and or exploded engine view of crank snout.

FSM states: Slide the crankshaft oil slinger over the shaft and up against sprocket (flange away from sprocket). FSM photo of crank sprocket shown in figs. 22 & 23 is 10th generation photo copy showing nothing

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

The crank sprocket goes on first, then the slinger. The side (face) of the slinger that is showing in the photo, goes against the sprocket

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Charrlie_S
65 Valiant 100 2dr post 170 turbo
66 Valiant Signet 170 nitrous
64 Valiant Signet
64 Valiant 4dr 170
64 Valiant 4dr 225

Thanks Charles,

I took another look, tapped with small screwdriver on what I thought was miss-positioned slinger, it sounded & felt very solid and dense, most likely it's end of crank. So it looks as if there is no slinger, and probably why I didn't recall removing it.

Is slinger absolutely necessary? Or can I avoid another few days awaiting part to be delivered, and just put this thing back together now?

Bill

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

Some later slants did not have a slinger, so I would say it is not absolutely necessary. However, it does help to oil the chain, and also keep excessive oil off the front seal. Less chance of a oil leak from the seal. I always run one. I think it is cheap insurance.

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Charrlie_S
65 Valiant 100 2dr post 170 turbo
66 Valiant Signet 170 nitrous
64 Valiant Signet
64 Valiant 4dr 170
64 Valiant 4dr 225

Order a slinger.

Put it back together and get it running.

If you need to take it apart to add a slinger later you will know soon enough.

Careful you don't run out of time and patience before you get to your goal line.

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Yeah....Im the one who destroyed this rare, vintage automobile.....

This has been a wasted week with all the frigging with this stupid cam timing adjustment.

Around noon my internet provider decided to take the tower down for whatever reason for eight hours.

I'm getting close to my limit.

I now hate the wheel of pain.

When I first took timing cover off after locating TDC with the wheel, "o" mark on cam cog was at 11:00 o'clock 180 degrees away from and in line with center bolt and corresponding timing "o" on crank's cog. I ran valve intake timing readings twice after I reassembled chain and cam cog such that I though it was advanced per Josh's instructions keeping cam cog "o" at that 11 o'clock position. I got hog-wash for numbers:

@ .050" intake opening 6* second time 4* looking for 18*

@ .050" intake closing 50* second time 50* looking for 31*

I had made a black mark on chain link that aligned with cam cog's "o" when that mark, cam center bolt and "o" on crank all lined up, than advanced cam cog one tooth such that "o" was one tooth counter clock ways and now one link away from black marked link. After a few turns of the crank trying get to some consistent readings, I noticed the "o" on cam cog which was one link from black mark is now three links away. What's with that?

I though I had counted 50 teeth on cam cog, and 25 teeth on crank cog which lead one to think "o" would keep the same spacing in relation to my black marked link.

To get readings I have been starting when piston is at BDC lifters both at zero lift, then rolling crank clock ways picking off intake angle readings @ 0.050" lift, riding to crown of cam than back down to .050" lift angle reading on intake closing.

Should I follow FSM instructions to line up both "o" marks nose to nose on both cogs, than advance per Josh's instructions, and run the wheel to see where I'm at?

I'm so confused with this.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

How many links on the chain?

Unless it's a multiple of 50, every time you roll the engine over the marked link will shift a little...............

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Ed
64 Valiant 225 / 904 / 42:1 manual steering / 9" drum brakes

Unfortunately, unless you do this a lot, it's not fun without a person standing there helping out and one of the reasons I just suggested moving the tooth, checking and buttoning it up...


I'll get vilified for suggesting this method...but it's a dirty way to rough the cam back in when you get lost....(or centerline it close enough when time matters)...

Put timing chain on crank sprocket and let dangle.

Install timing wheel, set for #1 Piston TDC and lock it in.

Roll the crank in normal rotation until you get the desired centerline reading on the degree wheel for #1, stop and leave it there.

Drill cam sprocket, install cam sprocket with zero degree bushing, do not install chain...

Using your dial indicator look for .050 before max lift and .050 after max lift on the intake lobe... look and see where max lift occurs...

Try to "eyeball" the max lift centerline while rotating through the event... (note: max lift can last 3-7 crank degrees on the degree wheel depending on the profile of the lobe, you may put a mark on the block and a cam gear tooth to check the ends at .050 max lift before and after and rough in the middle)

Once you have what you think is the 'middle' of the max lift window...try not to move the cam, remove the cam sprocket and install the chain and sprocket without a bushing, set sprocket on cam nose by tightening the bolt...remove bolt install cam bushing that is close to the phasing of the peg in the hole...once you get one close, install cam bolt..

Check the setting on your degree wheel by rotating the crank through the intake and see where your centerline now shows.. you will probably be off a handful of degrees...

Put crank back to desired intake centerline and install correct bushing needed to phase the cam per the last reading... recheck again by rotating the cam....reinstall new
bushing as desired, or torque cam bolt and move on to timing chain cover and slinger install if it's on or close enough for your patience...

I took a few days off of this timing project, and let my buddies 2CV kick my backside as we rebuild the braking system on that strange contraption. It was a refreshing change.

My son the ME came over today to help the old man out of the weeds. He also struggled to get his head wrapped around the wheel...

Thinking my first numbers were crap, we started over, installed zero bushing, set/lined up "o"s with center of crank & cam cogs just as engine builder put it together. That benchmark setting gave:

intake opening @ .050" = 23* BTDC
intake closing @ .050" = 31 ABDC

Intake Center line method .050" from top of cam crown each side gave 85* This cam has very steep closing side.

Cam card called for intake open @ 13* closing @ 41* intake center 104*


After several attempts moving chain and various bushings the closest I could get was:
intake open @ .050" =23*
intake close @ .050" = 31*

Using the feel & watch the dial indicator method by rolling back & forth to locate intake center I get 99*

The intake & close side @ .050" off crown of cam gave average of 93* intake center line.

Is it time to button this thing up?

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

So using the intake center line you are 5* advanced at 99*,but your at .050 readings are 10* advanced?

By the way I never look at any of the other numbers other than my intake center. 99 -100 is what I shoot for in my race car motors.

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2 Mopars come with Spark plug tubes. One is a world class, racing machine. The other is a 426 CI. boat anchor!

12.70 @ 104.6

I would go back and make sure I had TDC.located correctly and had my degree wheel and pointer zeroed accurately at that point. Ten degrees is a long way off.

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“Buy the ticket, take the ride.”
― Hunter S. Thompson

I assume you guys are doing all measurements in the same direction of rotation, so all the backlash is taken up while measuring angles? 5 deg discrepancy seems like quite a bit, but maybe for that cam? I've only ever done CL method and I have assumed (and usually observed) that my cam lobes are pretty symmetric, especially near the top.

Lou

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Home of Slant6-powered fun machines since 1988

That calcs at being a 94 degree centerline if accurate....I would pull the bushing and put in the 5 degree bushing to retard it...
If it already has the 5 degree bushing in it, pull it and reverse the eccentric...and check again...

Fingers crossed...

I'm at 100.5* center line method +/- .050" off front & back of cam crown moving engine in same direction; clock ways

98.5* is my next and only closest to 99* target by changing installed bushing 1*

Should I keep at 100.5* or land on 98.5*?

At this point I have clear understanding of manipulating center line method to hit a target which was 99*

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

Never fails, one last kick in the ass, last adjustment chain slipped a crank tooth, didn't quite see which way it went, put it back to where I thought it was... (Hum Jeopardy tune here while I spin the wheel for another set of values) Oh yeah, wrong direction, Thanks Murphy, got chain back where it belonged, and with careful attention to landing on and reading degrees and lift I ended up with 99* intake center line both calculated and on wheel.

Happy, happy, happy.

Now to get it back together, and started.

Thanks for the help everyone.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC