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What Master cylinder ???
https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12986		 Page 5 of 6
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Fri Jun 03, 2005 2:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: SA vs. Shimano
Quote:
I checked out the Rohloff Speedhub link, and was amazed. That is the class of the field. The versatility of the Rohloff boggles my mind.
Well, sure, but for $1K, it jolly well ought to be!
Quote:
The Sturmey-Archer equipment is "durable goods", made to last a lifetime, then to be rebuilt and last another, heirloom-style. It has a particular feel and makes a unique sound, and is unlike anything else. Just like the English Roadster it was built to compliment.
Exactly right. I toured the Sturmey-Archer factory in Nottingham in 1995. The machinery was large and very impressive, and they were still hand-assembling AW hubs at workbenches! A few years later, the works was bulldozed after Sturmey-Archer was Enronned to near-death. It did manage to rise from the ashes, though production is now in Taiwan rather than in the UK. Reports are that the last few years of UK production were of very spotty quality and that the Taiwanese production is much more consistently good. Tony Hadland wrote a really excellent book called "The Sturmey-Archer Story"; I highly recommend it. It covers the precursors, beginnings and history of the company and its products up through '87. Hadland's Website gives the rest of the story including the Enronning.

Unique sound, you betchya. Silence = too much oil, clack-clack-clack-clack = not enough oil. Tick-tick-tick-tick = just enough.

Edit: Go to This page on Hadland's website.
Author:  6PIN [ Fri Jun 03, 2005 2:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: SA vs. Shimano
Thanks for the edit;bookmarked.

The downfall of SA is damn near as tragic as that of the Raleigh/Rudge/BSA/Humber etc. company, that sprawling, all-encompassing manufacturing house. You didn't by chance visit there as well? It would've been excruciating to witness the end of that empire, but illuminating.

I don't mean to go from the sublime to the ridiculous, but: What do you think of the Raleigh style of bicycles built in India, and I think, to a lesser degree, China? I'm fascinated by the HUNDREDS of concerns centered around Ludhiana, all making and/or selling interesting bikes and parts. Do you have an insight?
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Fri Jun 03, 2005 3:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
I did indeed walk across the street to Raleigh Industries. In contrast to the brusque, rude, short Sturmey people, the Raleigh people were nothing but nice. One very old gentleman who'd been with Raleigh for many years gave me a huge lot of vintage Raleigh decals of all sorts, a Raleigh necktie, etc. He had this beautiful pinstripe application tool and was very apologetic he couldn't give one to me 'cause it was too expensive. I should've bought one.

The Indian-made copies of the old Raleigh DL-1 are of varying quality, but all of them are better than the Chinese garbage.

I've got a (real) 1950 Raleigh DL-1. 28" rims, rod brakes, full chaincase, top tube quadrant shifter, and front dynohub. Also a '50 Superbe in need of resto (Blue Heron's getting the job, for sure), a '54 Norman that was dad's, a '67 Raleigh Sports w/Weinman alloy rims, a Sturmey front 90mm drum brake and rear alloy Sturmey 5spd + 60mm drum brake. I do not like this rear hub; it's coming out of there and being replaced with something else. I have a Sturmey alloy 7spd + 60mm drum, but they've just released an 8spd version, and I'm kind of tempted to check up on their recent engineering and manufacturing. I also have a box full of assorted Sturmey hubs -- bunch of NOS S5 twin-pole 5spds (the good ones, not the later perversion), numerous AW 3spds, a few dyno and brake hubs, and a 1937 KB 3spd + 100mm drum brake! Used to have more bikes—I miss my '69 short-frame Raleigh in metallic yellow; I had it set up as a real hot rod w/lightweight rims and deep gearing on the AW. Used it every day when I lived in Oregon.

(too many bikes, too many cars...)
Author:  6PIN [ Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:21 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
(too many bikes, too many cars...)
But bikes aren't spacewasters. Own one too many cars and everybody is throwing a hissyfit :roll: Bikes are more easily managed, and a bushel basket of hubs looks pretty, like high-end fishing reels. You could almost put them on the coffee table. Try that with a pile of Torqueflites.

You are seriously hardcore.
That is quite a list of bikes and hubs, and I covet most of it, especially that DL-1. Once you learn about the maker, these seem to become the grail.

If I scrounge up a Raleigh, Dunelt or whatever parts bike this year, I'd like to do a hotrod version, but not necessarily a modern interpretation. I'm thinking more along the lines of cloning the old "clubman" specials.

Thanks for indulging my bicycle jones, Dan. Catch you tomorrow, perhaps? I'm getting ready for my shift at 11:00, gotta sleep eventually :wink:
Author:  NewLancerMan [ Fri Jun 03, 2005 6:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
But bikes aren't spacewasters. Own one too many cars and everybody is throwing a hissyfit :roll:
haha yeah my wife never complains since they all hang nicely up in our garage. The car, well that's another thing entirely.

I will have to disagree with you guys on Shimano parts. I will preface that disagreement with the following--I used VERY high-end shimano parts for most of my competitive cycling times. If any of you remember the first indexing shifters from shimano vs. the crap campy put out, you'll know what I'm talking about. Campy Record is stuff made for a lifetime, but geez, ya hate to ride it! you gotta watch out for dirt and water on the road so you don't put extra wear on those chainrings or rear cassettes!

I did ride a lot of Shimano DuraAce and XT/XTR stuff and found it to be very durable stuff in competition that would take a lot of abuse. When training and racing on the stuff you have to take care of it, but at the same time, crashes and other "events" sometimes put these parts through rather extraordinary forces and sometimes to your amazement, you can keep riding. The body might not be doing so well, but if the wheel didn't collapse or the rear derailleur hanger bend up into the wheel, often I was able to keep riding.

And while Shimano hasn't been as innovative as other small companies (as is always the case) they have actually spent a lot of time sponsoring big and small teams to get a lot of good feedback. When you're not Lance, you're happy to get some prototype parts when all it requires are some extra stickers on your frame, a large placement on the team car and jersey, and some feedback to the engineers. It also doesn't hurt to have a friend who has a friend, who knows someone at some place that helps you get recognized at sponsorship material....

AH and on a completely unrelated note, the BEAUTY of putting in the engine this week has been that my new trailer will now hold bikes instead of the roof of my truck. This means I DONT have to heft those 40 lb monstrosities up onto my 4runner (no small task)....thank goodness for the small things. It takes weeks to chistle all those Kansas bugs off every piece of the bike!

MJ
Author:  steponmebbbboom [ Fri Jun 03, 2005 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Just off-topic bike stuff
Quote:
There isn't a better practical city bike than a three speed, unless this CVT Gazelle gets a wider market. At a stop, I can drop two gears and pedal off in first. When I ride a derailleur bike I really miss that feature!

To me, there's just something not right about drive chains that jump sideways from gear to gear. It rankles, and even though I know they work (and well, in this day of index shifting) it is tough to accept.

I love messing with old bikes, especially single speed and three speed, and keep a parts pile around for building my own brand of hybrids. My best so far is an old Schwinn frame, originally coaster hub, now with sidepulls and a Shimano 3 speed hub. I think the frame angles are just a bit off from a "light roadster" like Raleigh Sports, and makes for a lively combination, even though weight is a bit more.

Sturmey-Archer stuff is harder to come by, in this area at least, but is pretty well supported as far as replacement parts. Shimano is everywhere, and while it lacks a certain something in character, it does perform fairly well. I'd love to build a bike around the Nexus 7-speed hub.
I should stuff one of those hubs on my Kona. Ive only done city driving for the last couple years.
Author:  Andy F. [ Fri Jun 03, 2005 10:13 pm ]
Post subject: 
I see the post isn't about the original question anymore but I need to pop in here to correct a mistake back in the early pages. The adapter does not lower the brake pedal when going from a 4 bolt to a 2 bolt master cylinder. The thickness of the adapter is designed to compensate for the difference in piston location in the 2 bolt MC. So you can use the existing pushrod and everything is correctly located. Not sure where that 2 inch drop number came from but it is totally wrong. The pedal will be in the same exact location when using my adapter.

Andy F.
www.arengineering.com
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Fri Jun 03, 2005 10:25 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
I see the post isn't about the original question anymore but I need to pop in here to correct a mistake back in the early pages. The adapter does not lower the brake pedal when going from a 4 bolt to a 2 bolt master cylinder. The thickness of the adapter is designed to compensate for the difference in piston location in the 2 bolt MC. So you can use the existing pushrod and everything is correctly located. Not sure where that 2 inch drop number came from but it is totally wrong. The pedal will be in the same exact location when using my adapter.

Andy F.
www.arengineering.com
Hi, Andy. I understand you make nice stuff, though I've yet to try any of it. The 2" figure was part of a discussion involving the MP 4-bolt-to-2-bolt master cylinder adaptor, which it sounds like differs from your design.
Author:  6PIN [ Sat Jun 04, 2005 6:39 am ]
Post subject: 
I can't believe there are this many sprocketheads at .org, and that we've all congregated on this post, to create the mother of all tangents :shock:

It is pretty cool, though.

A few clarifications:
When I mentioned Shimano components, I ought to have said, "pricepoint cookinggrade scumlicking department store bike cheapjack Shimano components". High-end parts are certainly not what I meant. And of course, I use the stuff all the time, so it is no indictment.

Steponme: I think the Nexus hub would transform that bike. And the part isn't unobtainable by any means. Soon it may be so common that I can snag a couple for experimenting with different combinations. It might work well in a travel bike, for example.

NewLancerMan: I think I have trailer envy. I just fitted a hitch-mounted Bell two-bike rack to my wagon, and while it seems adequate, I'm not happy with how far it deflects, or how it supports the bikes (the plastic supports and clasps seem cheesy). I may rig up something a bit more stable and secure.

Dan, thanks for your take on the SA and Raleigh factories. Also the Indian and Chinese "Raleighs".
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:19 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
When I mentioned Shimano components, I ought to have said, "pricepoint cookinggrade scumlicking department store bike cheapjack Shimano components".
One of the very good bike shops in Denver (Cycle Analyst in Pearl St, 303-722-3004) has a decal pasted on the edge of one of the workbenches, off around a corner where casual shop visitors can't see. It's made out of three cut-up and stuck-together Shimano Grip Shift decals. Of course, it says "Shimano Shìt Shift".
Quote:
thanks for your take on the SA and Raleigh factories. Also the Indian and Chinese "Raleighs".
Now my next task is to get one or more of those bikes I mentioned out of the lockup and start riding again rather than just talking about them. Much tougher to do safely and enjoyably now that I live in the city (same with car repair!)
Author:  6PIN [ Sat Jun 04, 2005 9:04 am ]
Post subject:  Ride to Nowhere
Quote:
Now my next task is to get one or more of those bikes I mentioned out of the lockup and start riding again rather than just talking about them. Much tougher to do safely and enjoyably now that I live in the city (same with car repair!)
Must be rough to get bike paths set up in an old city.
I guess you've got light rail of some kind to contend with while riding, as well as wheeled traffic? Riding in the suburbs isn't an option?

My town isn't especially conducive to street riding, but certainly not as bad as a city. I manage by biking during off-peak times and keeping a healthy level of paranoia going while in step with car traffic. Aside from dedicated rides, it pleases me to run errands on my bikes, visit the library(I often share the bike rack with a vintage Robin Hood, and I have no idea who owns it), or run to the cafe on my "weekend". All these yield minimal riding time, but I am using and enjoying my bikes, albeit in a limited fashion.

Exploring by bike is the best notion I've had. You see things at 15 mph that you'd miss at 30. Like the rusty Citroen Deese break that I spotted in a tumbledown carport a few years ago, or the "special" shop on a side street where a local collision specialist keeps his secret trove of collector cars. Also, faded "4 SALE" signs on windshields are quite visible at biking speeds.
I mean, that's MY little town. You have TORONTO!
Author:  steponmebbbboom [ Sat Jun 04, 2005 9:33 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Now my next task is to get one or more of those bikes I mentioned out of the lockup and start riding again rather than just talking about them. Much tougher to do safely and enjoyably now that I live in the city (same with car repair!)
*shrug* When I first moved to Sauga in Jan. 98 I rode my Triumph from Dixie and Dundas to Dundas and the 401 every day. I didnt get my VW til May of that year and the bike was my only means of transport. Remember the ice storm? Rode it. Get a good pair of mirrors (the mountain Mirrycle is my favorite, I have two, the arm turned down and the mirror turned inward, completely opposite the way they recommend, this way they are tucked down, dont look strange and dont get knocked off.) There are bike paths along the humber river, high park is also good, I never got hit even in the downtown core, just be defensive and make sure they see you.
Author:  steponmebbbboom [ Sat Jun 04, 2005 9:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Ride to Nowhere
Quote:
Exploring by bike is the best notion I've had. You see things at 15 mph that you'd miss at 30.
Yup.
Author:  steponmebbbboom [ Sat Jun 04, 2005 9:36 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Steponme: I think the Nexus hub would transform that bike. And the part isn't unobtainable by any means. Soon it may be so common that I can snag a couple for experimenting with different combinations. It might work well in a travel bike, for example.
ok, what would I ask for, an internal gear coaster hub? what kind of money are we talking about here and what brands should I stay away from?
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sat Jun 04, 2005 11:28 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Get a good pair of mirrors (the mountain Mirrycle is my favorite, I have two, the arm turned down and the mirror turned inward, completely opposite the way they recommend, this way they are tucked down, dont look strange and dont get knocked off.) There are bike paths along the humber river, high park is also good, I never got hit even in the downtown core, just be defensive and make sure they see you.
All my bikes are fitted with very large, lever-operated "DING-DONG!" bells that are pretty effective. I can ride in traffic, I just don't like doing it. There's far too much bad attitude and bad behaviour out there, from motorists and cyclists alike. Too many people too wrapped up in blaming the other for the whole problem ("Cyclists want me to respect them on the road when I'm driving? Hah! Let's see 'em stop for red lights, put lights on their bikes after dark and follow traffic laws, and then I'll think about it" versus "Motorists want me to obey the traffic laws and stop for red lights and put lights on my bike? Sure, fine, I'll do that. Just as soon as they start respecting me on the road". Zero-sum game.)

High Park is a real possibility; I live across Bloor from it. There's also the trail system in Marie Curtis Park.

Mirrors - good idea; I'll look into those. Never owned 'em; not sure how they'd attach to my helmet (which I haven't worn in forever). Mostly what I need to do is stop making excuses!
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