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| Talk me out of this - Toyota slant 6 conversion https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=39441 |
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| Author: | radarsonwheels [ Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Alright! |
Way to thrash on her! It reminds me of learning to wrench on harleys and taking long trips the day after motor swaps, or other major surgury. Great stuff. Good luck to ya- I guess you're out on the road now? radar PS: I figured out my speedo (therefore my odo) is around 10% slow. 60mph is really 66mph. According to those figures I am currently getting 15 mpg. Not too shabby. |
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| Author: | GunPilot [ Sat Oct 16, 2010 10:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Kip, I like your style. Let us know when you want us to also talk you out of EFI and turbo. You might search for posts on this site from MPGMike and also google him on the web. MPG is his thing and he has a lot of interesting ideas. |
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| Author: | kipamore [ Sun Oct 17, 2010 3:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Update |
Still a no go. After many days of work, I was dang sure the knocking noise was coming from the pilot bushing, which was badly worn. New one installed: exact same noise. So all I can do is pull it out, and reinstall the engine without the trans. Noise gone, it's the trans. I'm 90% certain it's the engine, because the trans seems fine - rotates smoothly by hand, works fine in the truck. Doesn't grind. It's actually pretty good news if it's the engine because I have 2 spare slants that can be installed without much trouble. At this point, I just need to have the damn thing done and working. At least I can comfort myself with the knowledge that aside from the horrible noise, it starts, runs, everything works, doesn't overheat, motormounts work, shifter fits, HEI works well, throttle and choke cables work, hydraulic clutch works fine (as long as you bleed it 5 times when you install it), etc. What would make an engine make this loud rpm and load dependant metalic knocking sound that's inconsistant? Something in the hyraulic valvetrain? Collapsed rings? It doesn't smoke at all, and there's some blowby in the valvecover but not a huge amount. It's not in the belts or front accessories. It's not a counterweight hitting the oil pickup tube. It's not a counterweight hitting the dipstick. Oil pressure is okay. Could the EGR valve make this noise somehow? I'm open to suggestion at this point. Kip-Not-Truckin' |
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| Author: | kipamore [ Fri Oct 22, 2010 6:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | I blew up a slant? |
Good news, bad news today. I ran the engine today without the trans and the knocking sound I've been plauged with was still there. Pulled of the pan, and it was chock full of chunks of metal shavings. The oil had so much metal in it it looked like brown pearl paint! In my experience with slants I've never even heard of one grenading, so I guess I'm the first! Over the winter I'll take it apart and find out exactly what happened, but at this point I can only guess that what I'm finding in the pan is either bearing material or bits of cam lobe. I'm leaning toward the cam because if that much bearing was chewed up the engine would have throw a rod or otherwise siezed by now (I put maybe 10 hard miles on it since I got it fired up). But at any rate, who cares! It's GOOD NEWS in a way because I have another slant that's ready to go. It's BAD NEWS because this slant means I have to break up my 65 Valiant wagon (which has been down for 2 years with minor transmission issues anyway). The GOOD NEWS is that the Valiant engine is a riduculous TURBO slant with an Edelbrock AFB. The BAD NEWS is that this combination won't be the greatest for mileage with no EGR and less ability to max out the spark advance. The GOOD NEWS is that while I've been working on this truck project, I've lost roughly 1/3 of my trucking business, so I won't be pililng on 1000 miles a week anyway and thus fuel economy isn't as important. Poverty has it's upsides! The BAD NEWS is that the turbo, which is mounted on top of the intake basically, will obstruct my vision going down the road when it's sticking up 7 inches out of the hole in the hood. The GOOD NEWS is that since I did the body lift on the truck, the sightlines are better anyway. The BAD NEWS is that the turbo engine has a 2.75" head pipe that will have to neck down to mate up to the spindly 1.75 exhaust system I've already paid for. Might have to stick a header muffler on it but keep the cat-back stuff in place to fool the cops. The GOOD NEWS is that this beast should do full-on 4 wheel burnouts (the truck is a dually with 4.56 gears) at will. The blown up slant would already chirp them, so this thing out to be a 1 ton road boiler. Anyway, tommorow morning I'll put the needed parts on the turbo engine (oil pan, alternator mount, clutch bellhousing and tranny) and get it all ready to go. Then I'll probably stick it in on Monday, test and tune on Wednesday, and then drive 800 miles in it on Friday. If you thought the pics of the truck already looked Mad Max, wait till you see this giant turbo garbage sticking out of the re-cut hood. Kip-soon-to-be-truckin' |
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| Author: | crash922108 [ Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Kip, if it was me I would put the intake and exhaust from the bad engine onto the good one and bypass all that turbo stuff. That would get you back to work sooner and probably be more dependable as well seeing you need this truck to earn a living. Just my 2 cents 
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| Author: | kipamore [ Sat Oct 23, 2010 7:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Crash, Good idea. I figure that I'll put it in with the turbo since I have GOT to get it finished. At a later time, I can put the regular old 1945 and intake/exhaust back on. And I can do that with the engine in the truck and well sorted. Worked on it about 7 hours today. Pulled the turbo motor from the valiant, undressed it, and got it mostly back together. There was probably 3 onces of metal shavings in the pan and wedged into the oil pickup tube. Another weird thing; on the day I first got it fired up I made an audio recording of it running on my phone, just for the heck of it. Listening back to it I don't hear the massive knocking sound, so something must have happened shortly afterward. Maybe when I had the pan off it swallowed a big gulp of air instead of oil. Maybe I didn't prime it right before the first fireup (I cranked it without the coil wire until it read 40lbs on the gauge). Maybe a lot of things. I'm rather eager to dig into the blown engine and find out what happened, but that's for a later date. The Valiant looks so sad without a motor. Might be time to build a second TWIN turbo slant six! |
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| Author: | Reed [ Sat Oct 23, 2010 7:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
The last thing that Toypar needs is a flux capacitor! Good job! |
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| Author: | Tim Keith [ Sat Oct 23, 2010 8:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Some swap the 7MGE inline sixes into these Toyota trucks. JDM normally aspirated Supra motors are under $500. They're getting pretty old now so these sixes are not worth that much. The only problem I hear is its a good idea to replace the head gasket from the JDM and maybe use ARP studs. Other than that, if you keep oil in this inline six it'll last for many years. The Supra manual gearboxs are pretty fun, but the inline six will bolt to the stock automatic in the truck. The 3.0 liter six does not make a lot of HP, but its got the torque that a truck needs. I thought of using a 7M in my '46 Plymouth coupe as the block is almost identical in shape to the long gone Chrysler L-head. The 218 L-head has 3.25" bore, the 7M has 3.27" bore with a block length about the same. With the plastic shrouds removed the 7M looks impressive. I like the 7M in the old car as the Toyota clutch is hydraulic which makes fabrication easier for a manual transmission. Plus I like inline sixes better than another V8 . |
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| Author: | crash922108 [ Sat Oct 23, 2010 9:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
LMAO Reed  Kip, send us some pics of the turbo sticking out of the hood and of you burning off those dual rears!! 
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| Author: | Karasik87 [ Sat Oct 23, 2010 10:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Man I think Kip is ready for a chrysler turboencabulator. |
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| Author: | kipamore [ Sun Oct 24, 2010 4:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Tim, If you scroll back a page on this very thread, you'll see a link to a guy who is in the process of putting a Benz inline 5 diesel in his Toyota truck. I've been talking with him via email. We've bonded strongly, in a strictly heterosexual way. If I had this all to do over again, I must say that once you do the body lift, the Toyota will pretty much take any engine, big block included. It's roomier than an A body. Were I to start from scratch, I might choose a small block over the slant. But the slant is what I had. If I had to pick an inline motor, my ranking would be slant six, 5 cylinder diesel benz (for the stupidity factor), Ford 300 strait six, or the 4.0 Jeep inline motor. In V6 it's a no brainer - the 4.3 Chev motor. Last choice, 10 briggs and strattons on a common crank, all with pull starts. Kip |
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| Author: | Reed [ Sun Oct 24, 2010 4:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
If I was going to go through all that trouble, I would just say to heck with it and stuff in an Cadillac 500CI motor. There's no replacement for displacement, and the 500 supposedly weighs as much as most smallblocks. www.500cid.com |
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| Author: | Tim Keith [ Sun Oct 24, 2010 7:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
The Toyota 7M is overbuilt for its 200 HP stock output. Even with the longish 3.58 inch stroke (same as a Mopar 360) this inline six can rev high. These don't tolerate low crankcase oil and need periodic re-torquing of the head bolts (or a better aftermarket composite gasket and ARP studs). The turbo version 7MGTE JDM costs 3 or 4 times more than the common Supra or Cresida version but only makes 32 more HP at the low stock boost. But the boost comes on strong mid range - the 50 - 70 MPH acceleration can feel like a big block. The 3.0 turbo is not a hot rod 0 - 60 pavement ripper. But the turbo motor with stock internals can make about 400 HP. Many 7M have a early demise with blown head gaskets, but this iron block motor is robust and generally good for better than 300,000 miles. The turbo version has a superb 5 speed that shifts very clean and is tough enough to handle a V8. The 7M was replaced with the short stroke 2JZ, which has a bore closer to that of a slant six. With sequential turbos and better fuel management the 2JZ is a better turbo motor out of the box but the JDMs run above $5,000. Toyota stopped making this inline six in favor of V6 about the time that 2JZ became something of a hot rod. A 7MGTE really has too high compression for a turbo, so that factory boost is pretty low. Rebuilding these with lower CR and some of the goodies from the 2JZ and it can make almost as much power. A V6 from a Camry now has more stock power than the 2JZ, but the 2JZ with its iron block and strong bottom end is the better hot rod turbo motor, but $10,000 or so to do a proper build. |
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| Author: | kipamore [ Wed Oct 27, 2010 6:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Update |
90% done, 90% left to go. Today I put the motor in, buttoned it up, and fired it. She hit on the 3rd rev. Runs pretty good. I was able to get it to idle, and started fiddling with the timing/idle mixture/idle speed before I lost daylight and had to quit. I would have test driven it, but I ran into a new problem - the throttle cable is sticking the carb wide open. That's weird since it's in pretty much the same position as it was with the NA engine, and with the V6 for that matter. Probably just needs oil - worst case Summit sells a universal for $25. I also have a new problem with the exhaust - the headpipe is about 2" short of mating with the rest of the exhaust. I plan to cut up a coffee can and use hose clamps to make it driveable, then fix it right in the future. The hole in the hood needs recut yet, and it's going to be obscene. This turbo setup is from a 78 Buick, and it places the carb in the center of the engine, the plenum to the drivers side, and the turbo hangs WAY off the driver's side roughly inline with the steering column. So I'm going to need an oval shaped hole that runs ACROSS the hood. The top of the air cleaner sits 7" above the hood, and it's right on the ragged edge of obscuring my sightlines. It's gonna be weird looking. I gonna work on it over the weekend, shake it down, and then take the maiden voyage to Pittsburgh and back (280 miles) on Tuesday. There's light at the end of the tunnel. Pics will be forthcoming when the hood is on, and maybe a Youtube burnout video if I can get someone to work the camera. Kip |
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| Author: | mopardean [ Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
i've been following your story and i'm really impressed. you're to be congratulated for your efforts here Kip. i am really impressed with your abilities and guts to pull all this off. please keep us posted dean |
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