I've been pondering the purchase of a deck hone plate. I thought they would be $300-$350. CJ Yother makes then for $400, BHJ has them for $650!!! This is a lot of money for the performance gain. If I knew how many motors it would be used on, I could amortize the cost out per block and it may not sound as bad. Can anyone give their opinon that may help me decide whether to buy one or not?
Bud L, have you used the one you made?

Cecil

Cecil, I have not. I don't have the figures right in front of me, but $400-$500 doesn't sound out of line to what I paid. Don't get me wrong, that is alot of money. I wish it was cheaper. It's twice what I paid for either of my SB or BB plates. I think I paid about $100 for the solid steel plate. I had it roughed out 1/4" u/s, then had it stress relieved(another $80), and then had it finish machined to fit a sample block, w/locating dowels($200,included the previous rough machining). Oh, yeah, the GR8 fasteners and stud washers, another $40(yikes!)
I still plan to make a nice wood carrying case for it, probably around another $100.
If the plate works near as well as the honing/piston ring seal on my 340, I'll call it money well spent, even if it's just used once.

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'66 Cuda 225/4spd
'66 Dart GT convertible 225/auto
'64 Dart GT 340/4spd

We ordered one from CJ and it shipped yesterday. My blocks will be first, of course. I would like to try to figure out a good way to help out folks who need one after we're done making chips. Obviously, I can't just ship it blind all over the country. There are several machine shops in VA that I know. Perhaps if we could work out getting the block(s) here to VA for boring, the plate could be reused with little fuss. Even if the freight charges for a block is $100 each way, you're money ahead. If there's interest, feel free to email me and we can discuss this off-line.

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Gilly

1960 Dodge Pioneer
"Long Rod" /6, A833 Pistol grip Hurst
8 3/4" w/Suregrip and 3:91's
Still have more parts in boxes than on the car....

Thanks,Gilly. I'm starting to lean toward the purchase of one of CJ's. Besides me, Charlie S would have use of it as we're using the same machinist. Is there a way a list could be made of hone plate owners around the country willing to loan or rent their's, Doc?, Chuck? More people would benefit if there was. Maybe I should look at this as the money I saved from the slant six having a lower cost, can be invested back into the hone plate. Next week I'll decide to buy or not.

Cecil

We really should make-up a list of who has these SL6 hone plates.
Most of the SL6 Racers already have them.

As we know, they are kinda expensive to make but a good investment.

There are always issues around "borrowing" / Renting these plates, for example, the on I have (also made by CJ @ Yothers) weighs 45 lbs, add another 5 lbs for hardware and 5 lbs for a wood box and you have some weight to ship.

To be honest, I am careful about who I will let use my plate, it is precision ground dead flat, I have special bolts / studs / spacers / hardened washers which I don't want lost. Don't get me wrong, I trust SL6 owners & racers, it's the machine shop people I worry about, I've seen some real "hacks" out there. The kind of moron who can break a 2 inch thick piece of steel in half.

A list of plates would be a great thing, If I had someone here in my local area was using a shop I know, I would have no problem letting them use my plate. I'm sure other's would be open to do the same if the situation was good.

Does someone want to manage the data collection effort?
Start a "Calling All Slant Six Torque (Hone) Plates" post? Let's decide what info. we want besides: Name, email, location, plate's bore size material type and weight.
Let's put the post in the Engine section and we can tag it as a "sticky" for a while.
After we collect some details, we can put a formal list together and post it in the articles for easer reference. (First step, create the list format - info needed)

These are just my thoughs so someone *please* "take the lead" on this, I have tooo muuuccchh on my plate at the moment so someone else has to jump into the driver's seat and guide this project down the road for a while. It's is a good project and it will be a great resource for us performance SL6ers. I will collect some names & details from other non-internet racers so we can get them on our list. There could be a plate right down the road from you and we just don't know about it, this is a good way to find-out.
DD

years ago i worked for a man who owned a machine plant and had a plate made in lieu of a paycheck. i just gave him a head gasket and said "like this, but two inches thick!" well, i have it. and have used it. but reading this thread i am not quite sure it's "right." stress relieved? i don't think so. machined "dead flat?" maybe. it was machined a long time ago. it is made of some very dense metal as it probably weighs about 100 pounds. any ideas on improving what i have? optimum bore sizes for the popular .030-.100" overbores? i had trouble at mccandless' shop years ago since the bores were too small for their boring head to fit properly. what should the overall bore of the plate be? what capabilities of the machine shop are necessary? any particular processes? the small automotive places won't touch it.
when i had this thing made, i read somewhere that a special plate would be beneficial to bolt to the HEAD for use during a vave job. it should have clearance notches for the valve grinding equipment to work. anybody made any of these?

-james

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I would like to see this torque plate registry happen. If everyone would like to email me the specs, I'll compile it into a spreadsheet. Guys, I seem to get a ton of spam and wipe out my email quickly unless it it someone I recognize or am expecting. For the subject, please label it "TORQUE PLATE". Put your info in the email text. No need to send a file attachment.

Chuck, if I get into an Excel format, can you take it from there?

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Gilly

1960 Dodge Pioneer
"Long Rod" /6, A833 Pistol grip Hurst
8 3/4" w/Suregrip and 3:91's
Still have more parts in boxes than on the car....

Oh yeah, an address would be nice.

TLG225CCR@AOL.COM

Gilly

I received my 3.53 bore torque plate from CJ today. It looks nice but no dowel pin holes. It took longer than I thought it would. CJ received my check on 3-13 and the plate was delivered on 7-2!
Gilly, I'm E mailing you info for the registery.
Anyone need use of a hone plate, I'm in central FL.

Cecil

Cool, Cecil.
I know why they don't have dowel holes, it is a lot more screwing around to machine them(much greater precision is required). That means increased costs for them and, of course, for you the retail customer. Many customers will have the dowels pulled anyway for block decking. I just wanted the plate to fit consistently. Who knows, maybe Ma Mopar isn't that consistent positioning them either. If that is the case, then all my work and extra expense would be for naught.

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'66 Cuda 225/4spd
'66 Dart GT convertible 225/auto
'64 Dart GT 340/4spd

just when it one of these a serious necessity?

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Slant Six... out of the ordinary - just like me!

I should have checked in with you guys before I bored my /6 without a plate (did it yesterday, went .030 over). I've heard that the plate wasn't really necessary for a slant, even tho I'm building as carefully as possible (dare I say blueprinting) for a Super Six, Dutra Duals, Comp 364 cam, etc. Apparently the distortion due to head bolt pull is negligable, compared to a Chev 350, for example. I would have liked to use a plate but our shop doesn't have one for a /6.

Tomorrow I'm honing, and at least I'll torque the mains down to try and get the hone as accurate as possible.

Next time I'll check with y'all, there must be a plate available somewhere in the L.A. area! Networking is always a good idea, I got stuff like ball joint sockets just gathering dust, would like to see this junk get used...

Steve

The plate probably isn't necessary for boring. It's used for honing (after boring) in a CK-10 or the equivalent. I've heard of people just stacking up a bunch of washers under the head of a head bolt. That might be better than nothing, maybe. I've also heard of some guys actually mapping the distortion in the cylinder walls with a dial bore gauge, before they plate hone, and after they're done.

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'66 Cuda 225/4spd
'66 Dart GT convertible 225/auto
'64 Dart GT 340/4spd

The single greatest benefit of a torque plate is to imitate the shape of the wall under actual assembled conditions so the bore is round when the motor is running.
Most of the stress-induced bore distortion is the intrusion of the head bolts, which warp the wall inward when torqued. This is not related to how the head itself is constructed, so the plate only acts as a fixture for the bolts here. The ACTUAL bolts to be used (length, grip, material, washers etc.) MUST be used for the bore/hone, since the amount of bore distortion is affected by how the bolt thread engages the block.
However: a spacer under each bolt the exact thickness of the head casting at that point will do the same thing.
What's missing is the effect on the block shape caused by the stiffness of the head itself when attached. I'm not at all sure that a steel plate imitates the beam stiffness of the head casting faithfully, since not only is the material different (let alone heat treat) but it doesn't have water passages, etc. all of which affect local resistance to bending. A fixture made from a head with the cylinder area removed for hone access will of course now be much weaker. The killer prep is to use honing oil heated to 200F to imitate water jacket temps also.
To be completely accurate, it would be done from below using an actual head, but of course this is impractical.

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