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Power Brakes on a 65 A Body
https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12336		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  65 dartman [ Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Power Brakes on a 65 A Body
Wonder if someone might know the reasoning behind using a vacuum storage canister on the 65 A Bodies (not sure about 64s or 66 and later). My 65 Dart sl 6 wagon has the PB (which I understand was dealer installed) which besides the booster also has the vacuum storage canister. Actually it's a squarish metal "box" mounted on the top of the driver's side inner fender. The booster has a "Y" type fitting with one side to the interake manifold and the other to the canister. Also noticed it has no check valve, which may be why the canister. I don't think having a V8 or slant makes a difference, as I've seen the same set-up on V8 A Bodies also. Can anyone shed some light on this?
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Power Brakes on a 65 A Body
Quote:
Wonder if someone might know the reasoning behind using a vacuum storage canister on the 65 A Bodies
That setup with the square vacuum tank on the LH inner fender was used through '66. It was used because the early boosters weren't set up to serve as vacuum reservoirs as well.

Are you having problems with the system and need help troubleshooting? Or just curious?
Author:  65 dartman [ Tue Mar 22, 2005 6:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
Both curious and a minor problem. When I bought my wagon (actually won it on eBay) the owner said she was having a problem with the brakes "hissing". When I took possession of it (was transported from CA to here in VA), I found that the the tee part to the storage reservoir was blocked off and there is a slight hissing sound when the brakes are applied. Haven't had time to tropubleshoot, but I'd suspect a problem with the reservoir and/or the hoses and possibly the booster for the hissing sound. I'm getting ready to convert to discs and may eliminate this system altogether and use a later model PB booster. I know A Bodies really don't need PB's, but the wife says she's got to have them (along with PS and automatic). I know she won't be driving the Barracuda or Valiant convert (both sticks, manual steering and brakes)
Author:  VDART [ Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:16 pm ]
Post subject:  p/brakes
not trying to barge in , but when were power brakes a factory option on the early a bodies? I had a 60 valiant from the original owner & it had the set-up discussed here, he told me the power brakes were a $10 add-on bought from a local shop, (I cannot remeber if it was a dealer or a local speed shop) Just curious,
Author:  65 dartman [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 5:25 am ]
Post subject: 
I don't know when they were factory installed on A Bodies - I would guess around 67 or so. My 65 FSM list 3 different PB boosters - the Midland Ross, Kelsy Hayes, and Bendix. The Bendix looks similar to what's on my Dart but makes no mention of an auxillary storage unit. Also the FSM lists no application for any of them. Since the manual is specifically for Darts & Coronets, does that mean the 3 different boosters were all used on just Coronets? Maybe Dan might be able to shed some light on this.
Author:  Guest [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 7:44 am ]
Post subject: 
Does the car have air conditioning?
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 10:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: p/brakes
Quote:
not trying to barge in , but when were power brakes a factory option on the early a bodies?
Starting in '66. Prior to that, they were a dealer option, and there was some availability of the same parts in the aftermarket.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 10:20 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
My 65 FSM list 3 different PB boosters - the Midland Ross, Kelsy Hayes, and Bendix. The Bendix looks similar to what's on my Dart but makes no mention of an auxillary storage unit. Also the FSM lists no application for any of them. Since the manual is specifically for Darts & Coronets, does that mean the 3 different boosters were all used on just Coronets?
I don't have my own '65 book in front of me (it's about 3,000 miles away!) but only one booster was used on the early A-bodies, and I think it was the Midland-Ross unit. The other boosters would've been used on the larger cars. The big cars got internal-vacuum-reservoir boosters before the A-bodies did.
Author:  65 dartman [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 12:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
According to my 65 FSM the picture of the Midland Ross looks just like booster on the 69 Charger I used to have (still have the booster for it though). It has the removable clamp that holds both sections of the booster together. It also goes on to say no reservoir is required. The KH booster looks similar to the MR except it has pins located around the circumferance of the rear part of the booster. A special spanner wrench is used to separate the 2 halves. It doesn't say no sparate reservoir is needed but does say it's a sel contained unit. The Bendix looks like the one on my Dart. The covers are held together with bolts. It doesn't say anything about a reservoir or being self contained. Internally the KH looks to be quite complicated compared to the other two. In looking at my options, I think the best course of action would be to use a later booster and eliminate the reservoir completely (and cleans up the engine compartment a little and there's 2 less things to go wrong (booster that needs a reservoir and the reservoir.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 12:55 pm ]
Post subject: 
I definitely agree on your "use a later booster" idea.

Just for reference, the early booster looks like this:
Image

While the later boosters have a more conical front face.
Author:  Charrlie_S [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 3:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
I asked about air conditioning for a reason. I have a 66 Cuda, I bought, minus engine and trans. It was a 273 2bbl engine and auto trans. It has "factory" A/C, and the square vacuum can, on the inner fender. I would have to double check the tag, but I don't think it had power brakes. I think the Square vacuum can was for the vacuum A/C control. Non a/c cars did not have vac controls.
Author:  65 dartman [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 4:53 pm ]
Post subject: 
For Dan - Yep, that's the booster and master cylinder that's on my Dart. I have a spare booster but think I may eBay it cause it just makes sense to use a later booster (have several of the small conical ones)

For Charrlie_S - my Dart does not have AC of any kind. I'm in the process of parting out a 65 Dart that did have factory air. It had a small vacuum hose running from the intake manifold in thru the firewall to the switch. Also parted out a few years ago a 66 Dart GT with the same setup. I don't believe the AC needed a supplemental reservoir. I'd bet that your Cuda had the PB, something went wrong with a component (betcha the booster) and was swapped to manual brakes and the reservoir just left in place.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 5:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
The square vacuum can was only for power brakes. No A-bodies of any year had a square vacuum reservoir for the A/C system. There was no vacuum reservoir at all for the vacuum-operated factory A/C in '65-'70. A reservoir appeared for '71 with the replacement of the '65-'70 double-action heater valve with the '71-up spring-loaded type, but it is a round one, about 4" diameter and 4" thick, and it's mounted on the RH side of the engine bay.
Author:  Guest [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 5:02 pm ]
Post subject: 
My Cuda does not have any master cylinder mounted. Restoration was started by PO. There are still many boxes of parts I have not looked thru. Just offering a suggestion, I don't know for a fact.
Author:  Guest [ Wed Mar 23, 2005 5:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
AAAARRRRRRGGGG

Dan, I agree, this login every time is getting to be tiring.
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