The parts are still available (might be rarer in certain cases, but someone here will know how to get the parts), but if it's in good shape,
YOU SCORED!!!
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| I bought an Aluminum Block Engine https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=16041 |
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| Author: | Pat Dawson [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 12:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | I bought an Aluminum Block Engine |
I went to "Crazy Ray's" salvage yard in Baltimore on the hunt for a 225 to replace my seized 170. I found 63 Dart 270 2 door in the yard with a 225 that looked pretty good. I picked that one because I know the early crank will fit my 63 automatic trans and the engine looked to be in pretty good shape. I removed the engine yesterday in the rain, paid the man, and brought it home. I power washed off the gunk and noticed that the block was shiny as the paint came off. I got a magnet and stuck it to my 170 block and then went to the 225 block and tried to do the same but it just fell to the ground. So, do I have a gold mine or did I get the shaft? The block deck rail reads TA 22 9 28 The block side reads MoPar casting 2121. No freeze plugs. It is now on my engine stand complete and untouched. I've read that this engine requires a special head gasket. Can I still get one? I want to check the internal condition but am leary to remove the head until I know I can get a gasket. Is this engine important to anyone? I'm just trying to get a good running 225 in my 1963 Valiant convertible pushbutton automatic car. |
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| Author: | emsvitil [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 1:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
The parts are still available (might be rarer in certain cases, but someone here will know how to get the parts), but if it's in good shape, YOU SCORED!!!
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| Author: | Charrlie_S [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 5:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
This is my personal opinion. The cast iron engine is better for a performance application. The main reason, being, the amount of dificulty and the price for the special parts for the aluminum engine. It would be a nice addition for a early Valiant or Lancer, as I think it would increase the value of the restoration, or be a conversation piece on a driver. The overhaul gasket set was available about 2 months ago from Kanter auto parts, $150. Even if you don't want it don't throw it out, there are many who want them. Do check the block carefully for corosion, and condition of the cylinder bore. They cannot be bored as much as the iron engine. |
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| Author: | Dart270 [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 7:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Pat, You do have a bit of a find there, but there can be problems as Charlie said. You can still get the rebuild gasket kit from Kanter for $150 as I just bought one. If you are interested in selling the engine I am likely interested in buying and will be in MD (Gaithersburg and Baltimore) next month. Nice thing is that it takes about 88lbs off the front end of your car - nicer for steering effort, handling... Lou |
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| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 8:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Yep, that's a 1963 aluminum-block 225. Everything everyone else has said here applies: there are special parts that can still be had with some effort and expense, there are special corrosion concerns that need to be checked, and there are special assembly procedures that need to be followed. These engines, if in good condition, properly built and properly maintained, work well in low-stress applications. Without a great deal of very expensive custom prep work, they aren't the best choice for a high-perf buildup. |
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| Author: | Pat Dawson [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Today I removed the oil pan, timing cover, and cylinder head. The block has vertical lines that I thought may be cracks but now I'm thinking they're just casting lines. They don't follow through around the oil pan rails, deck rails, or inside the open water jackets. They are located on the manifold side in the middle of cyl. # 3 and on the dist. side toward the back of # 4 and the front of # 3. I found a bit of corrosion at the top of # 5 liner on the manifold side but not enough, I think, to make a difference. None of the iron liner was pulled away from the aluminum cylinder casing. This engine has never been bored out according to my dial indicator. It has a copper multilayer head gasket, longer head bolts, and the con rod oil holes point opposite of the cam side. Here are more numbers. Casting number 2121 355 MoPar C.C.P. Chyrsler Corporation On the right side area that bolts to the trans: 51859 then below P.T. 2121 355-3 The block has the bosses on the oil gallerey rgallerywhat might have been an idea for hydraulic lifters. I think Carlie S. micharlieve the right idea on this. I'm just building a cruiser and this would be a good conversation piece. I see what my machinist says. The Dart 270 in the junkyard had a round sticker on the back window that said "Slant Six Club of America". The car was white in color. Anyone you know? |
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| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 7:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Your "Mopar CCP" marking is in fact "Mopar DPCD", with the "DP" above the "CD". Stands for Dodge-Plymouth-Chrysler-DeSoto. |
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| Author: | GuyLR [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I've always thought the alloy engine would be perfect for building a really good handling A-Body. The reduction of 70-90 pounds off of the front end would be just the thing for making a significant shift in the front to rear weight balance of the car. Maybe add to that by putting the battery in the trunk and it would make the fast ratio manual steering box a viable option for a good handler. Too bad we never got an aluminum big valve head to go with the block  I too would stay away from trying to build one as a high performance engine but I'd bet it would hold up just fine with the late model cam, two barrel intake and Dutra Dual exhaust setup. The big question for you is whether the block is still in good condition. An engine strip and inspection is the first step in deciding how to proceed. |
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| Author: | mcnoople [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 10:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | new mls head gasket |
Some time ago there was talk of someone tooling up to make a mls head gasket for the alum slants. Does anyone know if it progressed beyond the conversation stage? |
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| Author: | Dart270 [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 10:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
AFAIK, Dan had talked to Cometic about making a MLS gasket. I bet if we made some calls to them and got a commitment for a minimum order, we could get some built. I would be interested in at least 2, likely more dep on price. Lou |
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| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 11:13 am ] |
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That's right. I asked them last spring/summer, and they said "We're way too busy, ask us in the autumn/winter". I just got off the phone with them, and here's what needs to happen: 1) They're faxing me a custom gasket request form. I'll fill it out and send it in. 2) Next Monday in their weekly planning meeting, they'll look at the form and decide how to proceed. They may ask to see an original gasket, they may ask for more information regarding the gasket and/or demand for it, they may decide they'll make it but only if someone coughs up the money for 150 gaskets upfront, they may decide they're not interested in the project. This suggests to me that it wouldn't be a bad thing for us to be e-mailing and calling them! www.cometic.com , phone 440-354-0777, email info@cometic.com . 3) If they decide to proceed with the project, they'll want an original gasket, a block and a head. Yes, it'll be a hassle to ship a block, but not a huge hassle. I've UPS'd aluminum 225 blocks across the country before. Maybe someone closer than DD is to OH can send a bare block (which I can't imagine not being returned safely). Head is heavy but still shippable. The idea I had in mind was a gasket meant for the aluminum engine (max bore 3.44") that could also be used on the iron engine, and could be design-tailored with bigger bores for those building extreme iron engines. The Cometic tech I just spoke to said multiple bore sizes are easily doable, and nine or ten different thicknesses can be provided as well. |
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| Author: | GTS225 [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
OK.....if this is gonna get done, I've got an empty aluminum block, stock bore, and a junk iron, bare head, that I could ship to them from Iowa. Anybody closer? I do also have an old Fel-Pro, unused gasket for the aluminum engine, but I would be a bit squeamish about letting it out of my control without some assurances. I don't have the capital available to put up for a large quantity of gaskets, though. Roger |
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| Author: | NewLancerMan [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I know of an aluminum block motor in Columbus, but its in the car still =) I'm not sure its "available" for this kind of operation. I'll check with him though MJ |
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| Author: | Doctor Dodge [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 9:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: On the right side area that bolts to the trans:
Wow, you have block casting number 51,859, that is the highest casting number I have seen (or reported) so far. 51859 then below P.T. 2121 355-3 It makes sense that you found it in a 63, looks like one of the very last Alm blocks produced. DD |
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| Author: | Guest [ Tue Feb 07, 2006 4:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I found the aluminum block overhaul gasket set at Kanter. The price says $100. Thank you Charlie_S. Here's the plan. I want to buy another head 1974 or up for the hardened valve seats. I want to take it to the machine shop and have it checked for cracks, flatness, and have a standard valve job done. The block "looks" to be original and in pretty good shape. I'm so tempted to just clean it up, hone the cylinder walls, and replace the rings, standard size pistons, bearings, gaskets, cam & lifters, timing set, and oil pump i.e. a standard size master kit. If I take the block to the machine shop the man is going to get deep in my pockets. Maybe this is penny wise and pound foolish, but this will just be a stock 1 BBL. motor. and the motor was completely stock and I don't think it has ever been apart. The crank turns smoothly, the cylinder walls are smooth, and there is just a small ridge at the top of the cylinders. I need to find literature as to any special procedures to rebuild this engine engine. I like the idea of the battery in the trunk too, but I've done it before and it's a bit of a pain to live with. |
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