| Slant Six Forum https://slantsix.org/forum/ |
|
| Wrong UCA bushings for 63 daily driver rebuild? https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18085 |
Page 1 of 1 |
| Author: | sixsignet [ Fri Jun 16, 2006 3:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Wrong UCA bushings for 63 daily driver rebuild? |
I took the upper control arms without bushings to the front end shop. I asked them to unscrew the ball joint, screw in the new one, and press in the new OFFSET bushings. I asked that they be pressed in like in Condran's "Performance Handling for Classic Mopars" - with the hole offset away from the wheel at the front of the UCA and the rear offset towards the wheel. *This is supposed to increase caster* The front end guy said the offset bushings installed that way would give 7 or 8 degrees caster - instead of the 3 degrees I want. So I will go back monday or tuesday after buying another set of bushings. OK. I've re-read a bunch of stuff... My car will be riding about 1/2 or 3/4 " lower than stock in front. I have 195/70/14 on 5.5" rims What bushings do I want for 3 degrees caster and "about zero" for toe-in and camber? |
|
| Author: | sixsignet [ Fri Jun 16, 2006 3:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Shop has the balljoint socket, but rejects offset bushings |
OK. I've re-read a bunch of stuff. I think the front end guy was wrong. My front end will be 5/8 to 3/4" lowered. The Performance Handling book calls for "lowering the front - less than an inch" - from pg 89. And it says to use the offset bushings for maximum caster Quote: I have +2.25 deg caster and -0.75 deg camber in my '64 Dart and that feels very good, at least up to 130 MPH... You don't need more than that for a street car and that's easy to get with the problem solver bushings. If you have pwr steering, you can run more caster, and about 3-4 deg is the max using stock UCAs and MOOG offset bushings.
Lou I have to take a break anyway because I destroyed the left lower control arm. Gouged* it badly with a chisel while getting the outer sleeve out. I found a local wrecker that has a replacement LCA. I wonder if I'll get a free pivot pin stuck in it? * My mistake was skipping my normal Grande coffee breakfast because I was too soft to walk in the rain. |
|
| Author: | sixsignet [ Fri Jun 16, 2006 10:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I'm going to go back and instruct him to install them my way. (It's only a mile walk) After I put it together, I'll drive a little farther to a shop that agrees the offsets will work. Now I have a weekend to clean the control arms for painting (which I was going to skip). It's a 63 Valiant with new 5-leaf rear springs The front is set at 5/8" below stock No sway bar (this year) Thse are the specs I'm going to give: Quote: For a basic stock-type upgrade, I would do these specs:
Can you confirm these are good numbers?Camber = negative 0.2-3 degrees, matched on both sides Caster = positive 1 degree, matched Toe = 0.05 - 0.10" total (add both sides) These are not stock. They or you should be able to look up the stock specs and they work fine too. Lou Can the toe-in be expressed in degrees? |
|
| Author: | Joshie225 [ Sat Jun 17, 2006 12:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Those are good numbers Lou (Dart270) posted. You can get there with just one offset bushing in the rear of each upper control arm with the hole toward the ball joint. I had my race car set up with two offset bushings. Both bushings were offset toward the ball joint to effectively shorten the UCA and increase negative camber. Too much caster makes for tough steering with a manual box and especially so with the 16:1 gear I used. Toe is usually expressed as a linear measurement. 1/16" (0.0625") works if the steering and suspension is in very good shape. |
|
| Author: | sixsignet [ Sat Jun 17, 2006 12:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Using just one problem solver as you described sounds like a safe way for me to go. Worst case might be I'm limited to 1 or 2 degrees caster, and that's still good. (But Dart270 sounded pretty certain when he said 3 degrees is the maximum caster one should expect with the problem-solvers and stock control arm.) My bushings were so worn the guy who inspected it said it was impossible to tell what the old alignment range was. Is the 67 your race car? |
|
| Author: | Joshie225 [ Sat Jun 17, 2006 5:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I've noticed many people get quite involved in trying for a lot of caster. Most folks want it for high speed stability. The need really isn't there. Factory spec for manual sterering cars was for negative caster to make steering easier (lighter) and they don't have stability problems. The '67 is actually going to a friend of mine. My race car was a '66 Dart 270. I blew up the 225 so I went V8. I sold the car in early '05. 
|
|
| Author: | sixsignet [ Sat Jun 17, 2006 6:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
NON-EXPERT OBSERVATION: When 2 offset bushings are used (with one reversed), the control arm is rotated back through a point centered between the bushings. When a regular bushing is used in front and an offset in back (with the hole away from the wheel), the arm rotates on the front regular bushing. The upper ball joint is shifted closer to the center of the car. BS? Negligible? |
|
| Page 1 of 1 | All times are UTC-08:00 |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited https://www.phpbb.com/ |
|