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need some advice on an engine combo
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Author:  sandy in nova scotia [ Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:26 pm ]
Post subject:  need some advice on an engine combo
been so long since I posted here my login didn't work or I may have messed it up....

anyway i'm a long time slant guy and have several slants. I bought a really nice 84 100 /6 833od. The motor is completely stock except the previous owner swapped it to electronic eliminating the lean burn.

It has no power going up hills. the rear gear is 355 the tires on the rear are 295 50 15's. I weighed it it weihgs 3600 without me in it. I have a complete low miles hyd cam super six that came with the truck as a spare. I also have 2 other spare super 6 manifolds. A complete feather duster 76 slant and a very low mile 69 225.

I also have a full race 225 /tripple webbers to go into my good feather duster( i have a good one and a parts car) herein lies the problem too many choices.

Should i use the hyd cam super as is or do I put a 2bbl manifold on the 69 motor.? I'm just looking for good power and milage for the truck. The race slant has truck headers and oil pan so i can use those off it as they won't be needed for the duster.

What should i use for a cam the dc ones are ns1 is the mech stocker in the 69 better than the hyd? Should i just swap the super setup/ headers on the slant in the truck now?


See what i mean i'm just a bit confused if i go with the early head(69) I can use the offy valve cover and pretty up the truck under the hood!
Author:  Reed [ Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:11 pm ]
Post subject: 
Here is what I recommedn (and if I understand your parts list correctly):

In the truck: Use headers, and the Super Six manifold and carb. Be sure to bypass the OSAC valve and disable th EGR valve. The hydraulic cam should do you fine. It is what is in the truck already. If you have a spare head, spend some time at least porting it if not installing larger valves and porting it. Then you can run the older head and the Offy valve cover. Mill it a but to increase compression.
Also, I can guarantee that you will need to spend some time playing with the distributor in the truck. If it is has been swapped it has a distributor that did not come originally with the truck so the timing advance and curve will not be optimized for the truck.

While you are in there check for a stretched/jumped timing chain.

In the Duster: Full race motor with triple webers.

The hydraulic cam wil fit inthe 69 motor and will have a slightly more aggressive profile, but you must be sure to use the correct lifters and valvetrain to match the hydraulic cam.

If the motor in the truck has good compression and oil pressure, don't bother changing it out for the 69.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: need some advice on an engine combo
Quote:
84 100 /6 833od.
It has no power going up hills
These trucks were gutless right from the start, as the 1984 225 was rated at between 85 and 95 horsepower :shock: which is not a lot to haul around a truck of that size, shape and weight. Nevertheless, it pays to make sure there aren't problems interfering with proper driveability—exhaust restriction, carburetion problems, induction vacuum or exhaust leaks, slack timing chain, improper ignition timing curves, etc.
Quote:
I have a complete low miles hyd cam super six that came with the truck as a spare.


Certainly the Super Six would be an upgrade, assuming the manifold isn't leaky or internally cracked (the aluminum ones often are). The stock hydro cam is a stinker (too mild/too retarded), but there may still be a couple of upgrades available for the hydraulic cams.
Quote:
I also have 2 other spare super 6 manifolds. A complete feather duster 76 slant and a very low mile 69 225.
Should i use the hyd cam super as is or do I put a 2bbl manifold on the 69 motor.[/quote]

I'd probably start with the '69 engine, use a good 2bbl setup (complete with factory ducted air cleaner) and a pair of Dutra Duals, maybe swap in an MP244 cam (degreed-in carefully, of course!), a thoughtfully-curved electronic ignition distributor with the see HEI upgrade, install a NAPA Echlin long-tip rotor # MO-3000 with Standard-Bluestreak CH-410X cap, Magnecor wires, and open up the gaps on a set of NGK ZFR5N plugs to 0.045".
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Fri Oct 20, 2006 3:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
The hydraulic cam wil fit in the 69 motor
Not without mods to the rear cam journal and/or rear cam bearing, it won't.
Quote:
and will have a slightly more aggressive profile
Nope, the hydraulic cam has a wimpier profile than any of the factory solid-lifter cams.
Author:  Reed [ Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
Okay, I give up. I don't know much about the hydraulic cams. Listen to Dan though!
Author:  sandy in nova scotia [ Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'm staying tuned for more info i'm thinking of just the 2bbl and headers but maybe a head swap too. as I said earlier too many parts to make a move without more info. you guys are great. i know that the truck isn't the optimum place for a slant but I have several bb and sb all too ready to put in the truck I realy want to make the slant work![/img]
Author:  Charrlie_S [ Sat Oct 21, 2006 1:39 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
[

Not without mods to the rear cam journal and/or rear cam bearing, it won't.

.
The oil groove is in the hydro cam rear bearing journal. The rear cam bearing is the same for the hydro cam or the solid cam.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sat Oct 21, 2006 7:25 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
I'm staying tuned for more info i'm thinking of just the 2bbl and headers
Headers will do the opposite of what you need. Get Dutra Duals instead.
Author:  Reed [ Sat Oct 21, 2006 10:39 am ]
Post subject: 
I thought the 69 cam (unless it is the export two barrel cam) was smaller than the 72+ mechanical cam which was only slightly more agressive than the 81+ hydraulic cam? :?
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sat Oct 21, 2006 12:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
The '71+ stock cam is the generally best one, but the '65-'70 item isn't too far off and is still preferable to the hydraulic cam.

Cams listed intake duration / exhaust duration / overlap / lift

'60-'64 (225) '60-'65 (170) cam: 232° - 228° - 8° - 0.365"

'65-'70 (225) '66-'69 (170) '70 (198) cam: 240° - 236° - 16° - 0.395"

'71-'80 cam: 244° - 244° - 26° - 0.414"

'81+ hydraulic cam: 228° intake duration, rest of specs at my office, IIRCall of them are closer to the '60-'64 cam than to anything else, will post as soon as I retrieve the info.
Author:  sandy in nova scotia [ Sat Oct 21, 2006 7:18 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Quote:
I'm staying tuned for more info i'm thinking of just the 2bbl and headers
Headers will do the opposite of what you need. Get Dutra Duals instead.
i've got an aussie 245 hemi 6 with headers and a 350 holley mild cam etc. it will run circles around a stock 318 I can't see getting that out of a slant but I can't see how a set of small tube long primary headers will hurt it? I'll just y together the 3 in 1 sections into a single 2.5 or 3 " single system just like my aussie rig.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sat Oct 21, 2006 7:38 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
I can't see how a set of small tube long primary headers will hurt it?
They'll reduce low-end torque and driveability, which is what you want to maximise in a truck application.
Author:  Joshie225 [ Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
This is a rare instance where I disagree with Dan. Properly made long tube headers will make more torque at every point in the engine's operating range than any other style header or exhaust manifold. The problem is most headers are use too large of primary tube and too large a collector for the RPM and output of most slants. It's also very easy to throw away most of the gains of headers with a poor exhaust system. Another side effect of headers on a slant is that most don't provide intake manifold heat which will affect cold driveability and I'd give that strong consideration in Nova Scotia. If you really want to use the headers you have you'll need to come up with some form of intake manifold heat. You'll also need a good exhaust system about 2 1/4" diameter with a high flow muffler and catalytic converter if needed. Another drawback of headers is they don't last like an iron exhaust manifold and they are harder to seal. On some applications they can be a major PITA.

I would certainly use the 2bbl and recurve the distributor. Use a good ignition module like a Standard Motor Products LX101 (Orange boxes suck) or do the HEI module conversion. I would also use much lower gears like 4.10 at least. If you want to get into the engine I'd look at using the '71 and later mechanical cam and raising the compression a little.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sat Oct 21, 2006 9:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
This is a rare instance where I disagree with Dan.
Fair enough, but dude's in Nova Scotia, and if he puts on headers, his fuel economy and driveability are gonna be quite poor for at least six or seven months out of the year—take a look at average temps in his location.
Author:  Joshie225 [ Sat Oct 21, 2006 9:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Quote:
This is a rare instance where I disagree with Dan.
Fair enough, but dude's in Nova Scotia, and if he puts on headers, his fuel economy and driveability are gonna be quite poor for at least six or seven months out of the year—take a look at average temps in his location.
Yep. Which is why I wrote: "Another side effect of headers on a slant is that most don't provide intake manifold heat which will affect cold driveability and I'd give that strong consideration in Nova Scotia."
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