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74 Swinger - Hard suspension with new shocks...knocking?
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Author:  Eatkinson [ Tue Sep 11, 2007 11:25 am ]
Post subject:  74 Swinger - Hard suspension with new shocks...knocking?
My '74 is an all-original car. It had what were probably it's original hydraulic fluid-filled shocks that I finally had replaced with new, gas-filled shocks.

Ever since I had them replaced, the ride has not been the same. Before, everything was cushy and soft - and occasionally, it would bottom out. Now, everything is harder by comparison, and the damn car still bottoms out.

I would say on dips and speed bumps are where I noticed the difference the most. Before, the car would handle them without too much drama - or noise. Now, after I had the shocks replaced, the car knocks when going over a dip that's little more than a gentle crease in the road, plus the back wheels act like they're 'kicking down' on the doward slope of any humpy speed bumps.

I should mention that before I had the shocks done, I had a new tailpipe, muffler and glasspak installed to make a defacto 'Quiet Package'. The guys who installed the glasspak kept saying "our factory manual for this car doesn't give an option for a Quiet Package". Nevertheless, I had them install the glasspack where the tailpipe had hung before, right before exiting under the rear bumper, using the original hanger. It is more visible than I'd like (hangs down a little) but is pretty much ok. After I had the muffler/tailpipe/resonator done, the car knocked terribly and I brought it back to the shop. They altered the tailipe section they found was hitting someplace under the rear wheelwell and they said "you need new shocks, that will help".

Well - that was a couple months or more ago, and though the knocking greatly subsided with the first alteration they made - with the addition of new shocks, not much has changed.

Are the two tied together for the extra noise the car is making over the dips/bumps? Is there a specific kind of shock my mechanic should have used to replace the old ones? I told him after he did the shock job it was noisier than I expected and it knocked some, but he couldn't find anything wrong.

Lastly, the car does ride a little low in the back and I'm wondering if that can be changed so the car's rear end is the same level as the front; maybe that way it wouldn't bottom out. I really dislike it when the back of the car rides noticeably higher than the front - I've seen a lot of Swingers that way. Right now, mine looks more like a high-prowed boat, with a slightly lowered tail. Any suggestions?

Thanks for the help.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Tue Sep 11, 2007 11:39 am ]
Post subject: 
What shocks, exactly, did you have installed? Brand and model. There's a large range of quality in gas shocks, and the common parts store items for our ancient/low-volume applications are getting cheaper and nastier by the week. You needn't spend a fortune to get good shocks, but it's "very difficult" (polite word for "not possible") to get 'em for our cars from the likes of Monroe or Gabriel any more.

"Low in the rear": Put in new leaf springs. Very commonly needed on A-bodies, especially 6-cylinder models that came with wimpy low-spec springs from the factory. Get 5-leaf springs from www.espo.com .

Additional road noise related question: what tires are you running?

As for the exhaust: what specific noise were you trying to quell with your "quiet package", and what kind of muffler did you specify? The factory quiet package consisted of extra sound insulation all over the car, and a resonator in the tailpipe. You've probably duplicated the resonator pretty closely with your installation of the glass pack.
Author:  Eatkinson [ Tue Sep 11, 2007 12:57 pm ]
Post subject:  details
Monroe Matic + shocks were installed.

Don't know the tires - will check - just had two new front ones installed when they did the ball joints and alignment up front.

Thanks on the leaf springs. May or may not do it - a little low - not tail-draggin', but definitely somewhat noticeable. I just want to avoid high ass, low front syndrome - when they put new springs in, is that something that can be tweaked to how you'd like it? Or is it pretty much - you put 'em in, end of story?

Muffler - Walker (I think). I specified a larger head pipe and tail pipe because I wanted to increase breatheability - I seem to remember settling on 2 1/4" head, and 1 7/8" tail based on the muffler they had available and what they could do.

Why? Well, this junky looking Duster - I mean a real piece of work kept cruising in and out of the garage at work in front of me. When that car drove by me, my window was down, and I tell you, I heard not one scap of noise out of that car. I mean, I did a double take and craned my neck out the window and I could barely hear engine idle, let alone acceleration noise. It was crazy. My Swinger's engine, at 41K orig. miles sounds like it's banging two pots together in comparison! I looked at the car a little more closely when it was parked and noticed a can style resonator on the tailpipe. That's what prompted me to attempt an install of a factory quiet package. I would just like my car to run that silently. I've also heard others that are that quiet - more quiet than mine. Still don't know why that Duster ran so quiet. I mean, I could barely hear the engine literally AT ALL. And by the looks of the car, it hardly seemed like the owner was spending $ on keeping it up - so I doubt he ripped the engine out and put in batteries.

I do wonder if maybe the car was carrying the V8...do they run more smoothly and quietly in general?
Author:  emsvitil [ Tue Sep 11, 2007 1:46 pm ]
Post subject:  lose nuts / bolts
Sounds like somethings not tightened properly.

Either the exhaust is hitting things or

The bolts for the shocks aren't properly torqued (I replaced shocks on my parents car and it had little clunks until I really torqued down the shock bolts)
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Tue Sep 11, 2007 1:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: details
Quote:
Monroe Matic + shocks were installed.
Not real good shocks. :-( Assuming everything was installed correctly, you would probably be happier with KYB or Edelbrock units instead.
Quote:
Don't know the tires - will check - just had two new front ones installed when they did the ball joints and alignment up front.
You might want to get in the habit of asking for suggestions on part brands and models on the board here before you buy, specify, or okay them...it could save you aggravation in the future.
Quote:
Thanks on the leaf springs. May or may not do it - a little low - not tail-draggin', but definitely somewhat noticeable.
If it's noticeable to the naked eye, it's severe enough to remedy with new springs.
Quote:
I just want to avoid high ass, low front syndrome
That is determined by the arch of the springs you put in. High-arch/high-lift springs will tend to jack the rear up higher than the front. Stock-height/stock-arch springs won't. Consider that for best handling, the rear should be slightly higher than the front, but you're right, it looks silly when the back is way higher than the front.
Quote:
Muffler - Walker (I think).
...part number?
Quote:
I seem to remember settling on 2 1/4" head, and 1 7/8" tail
That is essentially the Super Six/Feather Duster/Dart Lite system. Not a bad pick at all.
Quote:
My Swinger's engine, at 41K orig. miles sounds like it's banging two pots together
Valve adjustment and/or other issues are at work in your car!
Quote:
I do wonder if maybe the car was carrying the V8...do they run more smoothly and quietly in general?
No.
Author:  Eatkinson [ Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:57 pm ]
Post subject:  thanks
Investigating. My mechanic said KYB's are good but they ride a little firmer - which is why he went with Monroe Matic + . Now I'm annoyed I didn't check with y'all first. rrrr.

Yes, I will check with you guys on parts etc. Don't know why I didn't this time. It was an oil change that morphed into a "you have to do this right away" and I think I got frustrated.

Have to get back to you on that muffler. I should have the receipt with the info.

I exaggerate on the sound my engine is making. It's actually quite smooth. But in comparison to that Duster I couldn't hear at all, mine sounds louder under acceleration and idle, especially listening to the Duster from the outside of the car. Who knows what it sounded like on the inside.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Tue Sep 11, 2007 5:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: thanks
Quote:
Investigating. My mechanic said KYB's are good but they ride a little firmer - which is why he went with Monroe Matic + .
My experience with KYBs is that they give a better controlled ride. Less busy...less "jiggly". It's firmer and smoother in that respect. If what you want is "floaty and wallowy", then you go ask your mechanic for your old original shocks back! :shock: but "floaty and wallowy" is dangerous (and annoying 'cause you wind up buying a lot of Pepto-Bismol).
Quote:
I exaggerate on the sound my engine is making. It's actually quite smooth. But in comparison to that Duster I couldn't hear at all, mine sounds louder under acceleration and idle.
Exhaust leaks up at the manifold...worn engine mounts...transmission lines or other components hitting the floor...eventually you'll find and squash this bug.
Author:  Dart270 [ Wed Sep 12, 2007 1:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
I can highly recommend the Edelbrock IAS shocks. $75 ea, and worth it. Great ride and excellent, controlled handling.

Lou
Author:  dakight [ Wed Sep 12, 2007 5:41 pm ]
Post subject: 
Those are the ones I plan to use. Squeeze my cheeks a bit to spend $300.00 but everything I see indicates they're worth it.
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