| Slant Six Forum https://slantsix.org/forum/ |
|
| Installing Pertronix module and coil https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24954 |
Page 1 of 2 |
| Author: | 64 slantsix [ Mon Sep 17, 2007 8:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | Installing Pertronix module and coil |
I am trying to install a Pertronix ignitor II and a Pertronix Flame Thrower II coil on my 1964 Valiant w/ 225 two barrel. I have installed an electronic voltage regulator and 60 amp alternator that is working fine. The instructions for the pertronix say that I can bypass the ballast resistor by wiring together all of the wires connected to the ballast resistior. This does not work. Wired in all together, I am not getting anything to the starter (or very little, the starter will click). The pertronix instructions say that I can retain the ballast resistor and wire the positive side of the module to any ignition source. According to the 64 service manual wiring diagram I have two ignition wires to the ballast resistor, one on each end. By the way it is a single ballast resistor. Which ignition wire should I connect the pertronix too? Is there a way to rewire the system to by-pass the resistor or is it worthwhile? |
|
| Author: | Pat Dawson [ Mon Sep 17, 2007 9:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
The ballast resistor sends limited current to the ignition system. I don't think it ties to the starter motor. Look at the starting system for the problem. I bypassed the resistor with my Pertronix. |
|
| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Mon Sep 17, 2007 9:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
The ballast resistor doesn't have anything to do with the starter circuit. If connecting together the two 2-wire plugs that were originally on the ballast resistor results in an inability to crank the engine, either the car has major wiring problems or you have not correctly identified the ballast resistor. 
|
|
| Author: | 64 slantsix [ Mon Sep 17, 2007 11:59 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
You are confirming what I suspected, that there is no connection between the starter circuit and the ballast resistor. However, I was curious if changing to the electronic voltage regulator and changing the wiring to install it may have somehow affected the starting circuit. I do know what a ballast resistor is, it is the ceramic thingee you carry around in the glove compartment. The car does not have major wiring problems. This does not mean I don't have some wiring problems. In fact, the car has failed to start several times. I have usually cleaned up battery posts and battery cable terminals and everything is fine. I am on a learning curve here. Can a faulty starter relay cause intermittent problems with cranking? |
|
| Author: | rock [ Mon Sep 17, 2007 12:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Hi slant six think about this |
Hi Slantsix! As many on this forum I use a pertronix, but with stock coil. I had sufficient problems electrically before doing any work that I completely rewired the vehicle and installed relays. While you may want to do that in the long run, in the short run you could have either of two problems that may seem strange to you and thus worth looking at. First, the relay to the starter is a great Mopar thing. Relays are good in my opinion and particularly so on the starter circuit. On occasion I have seen the utterly dependable Mopar relay fail to give perfect internal contact when the large central bolt is loosened inside the the relay case. That central bolt is held to the relay by a hex nut. If you or a previous owner have "unscrewed" the nut that holds the batt cables on you could have conceivably loosened the central bolt. Second, you need a good engine to body ground. I use a battery cable with bolt holes on each end, one to a bellhousing to tranny bolt, one to the firewall and create a good ground spot on the firewall. I use copper washers and dielectric grease. But before you do any more, get the wiring diagram and a VOM and trace out your voltages with the IGN key off, then on. Pay attention to the voltages between the relay terminals (bat, sol and ign) and a ground. Can you take a screwdriver and short the relay to get the starter to turn over? If not then look to see if the relay has power from the battery. If not the + cable is not connected properly....etc. Sketch out the standard primary circuit, in other words, and see where you are good, or not. Map out the juice before going into parts replacement mode. rock '64d100 |
|
| Author: | 64 slantsix [ Tue Sep 18, 2007 4:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Thanks to all for your replies. Each reply put me in the right direction. The 64 Valiant is now up and running with the pertronix and with elimination of the ballast resistor. As suggested the Valiant has wiring problems that need attention. The grounding system needs a complete rewire. This forum is an incredible asset and I would like to thank all that are responsible for its existence and maintenance and others that take time out of their day to advise us. |
|
| Author: | Blood Duster [ Tue Sep 18, 2007 10:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
You will have to forgive my ignorance here. I'm thinking of upgrading my ignition system also but I have very little knowledge in this area. Do the ignitor and flame thrower just over the original distributor or do you recommend buying a new one? I'm just not sure what all I need to buy to upgrade my ignition system. |
|
| Author: | slantvaliant [ Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: Do the ignitor and flame thrower just over the original distributor or do you recommend buying a new one? I'm just not sure what all I need to buy to upgrade my ignition system.
Are you talking about the '75 Duster listed in your signature? You mentioned replacing the ECU recently. That precludes the Pertronix Ignitor (it replaces points in a points distributor). A hotter coil like the Flamethrower might help your electronic ignition when teamed with good ignition cables, cap, rotor, and properly gapped quality plugs. Slant Six Dan has again given the scoop on numbers recently.I wouldn't buy a new distributor unless I suspected the one I had was too worn for service, or I just wanted something shiny and new. 
|
|
| Author: | Blood Duster [ Wed Sep 19, 2007 8:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I guess im confused about the difference between doing either the HEI conversion or putting in the pertronix ignitor and flamethrower coil. Either one will be an upgrade from the stock ingition system I have now but what is the difference between the 2, or is it a matter of opinion? |
|
| Author: | rock [ Wed Sep 19, 2007 9:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Hi Blood duster, ok, here's an opinion! |
Blood Duster, Look at it this way: Mopar made a lot of great engineering for a long time. The parts they made work so well most folks driving the vehicles never think of the parts...ike coils. I have never had an HEI but am certain that it, like most Mopar, is good stuff. I just didn't have a set on hand when it came time to put in a ignition upgrade. I was going to buy HEI cause I knew about it and because Slant Six Dan explained it so well, but on the way to HEI I stumbled onto a used Pertronix so cheap I thought what the heck, slide on a unit into dizzy and see what happens. Well, it has done so well I never looked back. I mean running hard to about 6,000 rpm. Not really racing. But I did finally stumble across an HEI setup and pulled it and put it in the parts bin in case I need it. Stock distributor, NO hot coil...I am thus unconvinced of the need for a hot coil in normal and some mild performace use...based on my experience. Read up on the induction in coils and see why in many cases hotter can be wasted, especially if you a paying a premium for it. That stock coil throws some serious fire if you use good wires. So in summary, this man's opinion is upgrade is good, spending more than you can get one kind of upgrade for just to have it is not necessary if you can get the other cheaper, and try life with a stock coil for a while. rock '64d100 |
|
| Author: | Blood Duster [ Wed Sep 19, 2007 10:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Hey thats why I joined this board. I figure I ask a lot of question and figure out what I can now, so I don't make a lot of mistakes and waste money for nothing. Now to figure out why when it rains water drips down through the console to both the driver and passenger side..... |
|
| Author: | slantvaliant [ Wed Sep 19, 2007 11:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Blood Duster, you already have electronic ignition, so you don't need an Ignitor. It replaces points in older cars than yours. Quote: Now to figure out why when it rains water drips down through the console to both the driver and passenger side.....
This belongs in another thread, in "Other", but have you checked your wiper pivot seals?
|
|
| Author: | rock [ Wed Sep 19, 2007 11:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Blood...you are talking about the '64 valiant, right? |
Hello again, I assumed you were talking about the '64 you asked about in your first post...and I see slantvaliant wondered if it was the '75 you were asking about. You know how assuming is...and if slant is right and it is the 75, then my suggestion, applying to points, won't fit. But if the '64.... rock '64d100 |
|
| Author: | 64 slantsix [ Wed Sep 19, 2007 12:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Rock, I think you are getting me (64 slantsix) confused with Blood Duster. Actually in reading back through the messages, I don't think Blood Duster ever specified exactly what model and year car he is talking about upgrading. Rock, you put me on the right track with the ground wiring suggestion, that was my problem with the 64 Valiant. Also, I installed the flamethrower coil and ran it with my stock points and I do believe the car ran a bit better with the hotter coil. However, I haven't upgraded my spark plugs and ignition wires yet (they probably have 10k. - 15k. miles on them). I am guessing that maybe that is why it ran a bit better. I probably would not have bought the flamethrower coil if I'd read up a bit more on this site. |
|
| Author: | slantvaliant [ Wed Sep 19, 2007 12:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I'm looking at Blood Duster's "75 225 Duster" listed in his signature, and at a previous POST where he mentioned replacing the ECM. It could have a points ignition swapped in there, but ... Or maybe it's a different car he's asking about. How about it Blood Duster? We're here to help, honest! |
|
| Page 1 of 2 | All times are UTC-08:00 |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited https://www.phpbb.com/ |
|