Slant Six Forum :: Sucks to be us

i just got some lead last week.3 gas stations around me have 110 leaded gas. it is not cheap, but compared to what they charge for ethanol garbage, its a bargain. ron

Sorry, no sale (and no tears). There was a bunch of Chicken Little, sky-is-falling hysteria when leaded gasoline was withdrawn from the roadgoing motor fuel market. It's the end of the old-car hobby! This is just the beginning, once we can't fuel the cars they'll come and confiscate them! Guess what: None of that happened. We still drive old cars even though you haven't been able to pull into a gas station and buy leaded gasoline since the early 1990s. There is life after tetraethyl lead, and speaking of cancer (and more generally, of diseases caused by exposure to lead) life's better without lead.

No Pro Mod, No Pro Stock, No Top Fuel or Nitro Funny Car and no American competitors in any of our sportsman classes. Only Alcohol Funny Cars would remain unscathed.

hi cars, i live in mass. the race fuel is sunoco standard 110 purple . i go to mark's sunoco in worcester or the sunoco in northborough. thompson speedway in ct is closed now but opens in a few more weeks. info on racegas.com . it has a one year shelf life. cost me 7.25 gallon. ethanol lasts about 1 month around here before going stale or absorbing water. ethanol costs about 3.10 gallon for 76,000 btu energy. 29% LESS energy per gallon than the regular gas we could get a year ago(but contained mtbe) that produced 114,000 to 116,000 btus of energy per gallon. thanks, ron

Why the exemptions for planes? Can't they adapt also? Or do they really need the lead? I'm sure more politicians fly planes than go drag racing .
Rick

Author:	polara pat [ Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:16 pm ]
Post subject:	Sucks to be us
This is a real kick in the nuts and affects all of us Canuck drag racers and any one who travels North of the border to race. Don't shrug it off just because it doesn't affect you now. This is the kind of bill that could spread like a cancer once passed. http://www.grandbendmotorplex.com/08-end-of-racing.html

Author:	SlantSixDan [ Tue Jan 15, 2008 7:03 pm ]
Post subject:
Sorry, no sale (and no tears). There was a bunch of Chicken Little, sky-is-falling hysteria when leaded gasoline was withdrawn from the roadgoing motor fuel market. It's the end of the old-car hobby! This is just the beginning, once we can't fuel the cars they'll come and confiscate them! Guess what: None of that happened. We still drive old cars even though you haven't been able to pull into a gas station and buy leaded gasoline since the early 1990s. There is life after tetraethyl lead, and speaking of cancer (and more generally, of diseases caused by exposure to lead) life's better without lead.

Author:	1969ronnie [ Tue Jan 15, 2008 7:54 pm ]
Post subject:
i just got some lead last week.3 gas stations around me have 110 leaded gas. it is not cheap, but compared to what they charge for ethanol garbage, its a bargain. ron

Author:	CARS [ Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:04 pm ]
Post subject:
Quote: i just got some lead last week.3 gas stations around me have 110 leaded gas. it is not cheap, but compared to what they charge for ethanol garbage, its a bargain. ron I would like you to elaborate a bit on your reply. Where do you live, what was the cost per gallon of the 110 octane and what you mean by "what they charge for ethanol garbage". Please.

Author:	Bren67Cuda904 [ Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:45 pm ]
Post subject:
It seems that their implying that the fast cars can't run on unleaded fuel. I know Nascar just switched to unleaded and a few more engines seemed to blow at first, but now they seem to have adapted. Other than valve recesion resitance and some extra valve stem lubrication, what benifits does the leaded fuel offer? (besides O2 sensor contamination )

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Author:	polara pat [ Tue Jan 15, 2008 10:17 pm ]
Post subject:
Quote: Sorry, no sale (and no tears). There was a bunch of Chicken Little, sky-is-falling hysteria when leaded gasoline was withdrawn from the roadgoing motor fuel market. It's the end of the old-car hobby! This is just the beginning, once we can't fuel the cars they'll come and confiscate them! Guess what: None of that happened. We still drive old cars even though you haven't been able to pull into a gas station and buy leaded gasoline since the early 1990s. There is life after tetraethyl lead, and speaking of cancer (and more generally, of diseases caused by exposure to lead) life's better without lead. I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that you could really care less about drag racing. That's totally fine but some of us really enjoy it and I'll go so far as to say live it during the driving months. I would like to be as optimistic as you and believe that they're just blowing smoke (non-carcinogenic of course) but the truth is that they have been testing the big tracks for emissions and the results have been less than good. Maybe this will come to term and the larger tracks will be shut down, it sure as hell won't encourage any southern racers to venture to our facilities. I just like to point out what may or may not come to be before it happens and we didn't have a chance to make a stand. (not that it would help) So no Chicken little and no tears (yet) just thought I'd point out what's in the cooker.

Author:	dakight [ Wed Jan 16, 2008 3:17 am ]
Post subject:
I'll let Dan speak for himself about his interest in drag racing but the end of leaded racing fuel is not the end of racing by any means. Will it have an effect? Absolutely! Will it end racing? Not a chance! Racers are an inventive lot and will work around the issue just like they always have. The truth of the matter is that specific power and torque ratings of modern engines are notably higher than their pre-unleaded counterparts. It will take some work and some effort but the sport will definitely survive and even thrive. Now, you my well have a legitimate complaint about the way the legislation came up and was passed but that's a different matter that you'll have to collectively address within the political systems of your country and province.

Author:	Rick Covalt [ Wed Jan 16, 2008 4:19 am ]
Post subject:	The planes??
Why the exemptions for planes? Can't they adapt also? Or do they really need the lead? I'm sure more politicians fly planes than go drag racing . Rick

Author:	emsvitil [ Wed Jan 16, 2008 4:54 am ]
Post subject:
The technology in plane (piston) engines are generally older than our slants................ They need the higher octane to produce the power needed. And some engines still need the lead for the valve lubrication. Remeber aviation engines are normally run at high power output (75% or more of sea-level max power) The lead will eventually be phased out as they develop a replacement fuel, and as new engines become available that don't need the lead

Author:	Charrlie_S [ Wed Jan 16, 2008 5:53 am ]
Post subject:
Quote: No Pro Mod, No Pro Stock, No Top Fuel or Nitro Funny Car and no American competitors in any of our sportsman classes. Only Alcohol Funny Cars would remain unscathed. I would have more sympathy, if the facts were correct. Since when does top fuel and Nitro funny car run leaded fuel. Most (notice, I said "MOST")sportsman cars could run unleaded, with no problems. And if NASCAR can run unleaded, I don't see much of a problem for the "Pro" cars. Also this was posted (published) by an entity, that according to them, would hurt their pocket book, more then any one else. I do agree in principle, that the "bang for the buck" is minimal.

Author:	Dart270 [ Wed Jan 16, 2008 6:41 am ]
Post subject:
I run pump unleaded in all my cars. Can't see why this is a problem, for all the reasons stated above. NASCAR motors should need more protection than drag motors and they don't use it... Lou

Author:	slantzilla [ Wed Jan 16, 2008 6:48 am ]
Post subject:
Canada banned leaded fuel in race cars years ago. That was what brought the demise of the NHRA Molson Nationals. All the race fuel at the pumps at RT66 have been unleaded for a few years too. When they first opened, they couldn't pump race gas into a '75 and newer car with license plates on it. Now, you can buy what you want from any pump. All the accepted fuels for Stock/Super Stock, Comp, etc. are already unleaded. Another tempest in a teacup.

Author:	1969ronnie [ Tue Jan 22, 2008 5:50 am ]
Post subject:
hi cars, i live in mass. the race fuel is sunoco standard 110 purple . i go to mark's sunoco in worcester or the sunoco in northborough. thompson speedway in ct is closed now but opens in a few more weeks. info on racegas.com . it has a one year shelf life. cost me 7.25 gallon. ethanol lasts about 1 month around here before going stale or absorbing water. ethanol costs about 3.10 gallon for 76,000 btu energy. 29% LESS energy per gallon than the regular gas we could get a year ago(but contained mtbe) that produced 114,000 to 116,000 btus of energy per gallon. thanks, ron

Author:	CARS [ Tue Jan 22, 2008 7:15 am ]
Post subject:
Quote: hi cars, i live in mass. the race fuel is sunoco standard 110 purple . i go to mark's sunoco in worcester or the sunoco in northborough. thompson speedway in ct is closed now but opens in a few more weeks. info on racegas.com . it has a one year shelf life. cost me 7.25 gallon. ethanol lasts about 1 month around here before going stale or absorbing water. ethanol costs about 3.10 gallon for 76,000 btu energy. 29% LESS energy per gallon than the regular gas we could get a year ago(but contained mtbe) that produced 114,000 to 116,000 btus of energy per gallon. thanks, ron I think you are either mis-informed about ethanol or you are keeping it in open drums Around here, E85 is $2.15 a gallon, availible anywhere including delivery to my barrel. Race gas is over $7.00 a gallon, like you but is only available at the track. We drive our race cars every chance we get so being able to fill up with 105 octane at the pump for alittle over two bucks a gallon makes toatal sence. During the race season this year we are buying E85 by the barrel so we don't have to pay road tax. If you read Car Craft, you will notice in the last issue that they had their top-10 dyno challenge. Guess what... every single one of those cars are using E85!!

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Author:	440_Magnum [ Tue Jan 22, 2008 10:51 am ]
Post subject:	Re: The planes??
Quote: Why the exemptions for planes? Can't they adapt also? Or do they really need the lead? I'm sure more politicians fly planes than go drag racing . Rick Two reasons. One, the legacy aircraft fleet. If you look at general aviation, a HUGE percentage of the airplanes still flying out there are 30, 40, and 50 years old. Two: liability. If something goes wrong in an airplane which results in a fatality, it WILL be investigated and fault assigned. A negative side effect of that is that the engine manufacturers (Lycoming and Continental) are VERY cautious about making any changes at all and so general aviation engine technology progresses very slowly. There's not much doubt that they CAN build unleaded fuel aircraft engines, but they don't want to make the leap because if there were a rash of failures, it could bankrupt either company. Remember, they don't sell a huge volume every year, either. Its hard to tolerate a technology "glitch" in a very, very small market. There's also a third reason: mixed fleet. If new aircraft are made to require unleaded, then all the aviation service facilities will have to stock an extra fuel type, and now you get the risk of putting unleaded fuel in a 1955 Lycoming that still needs leaded fuel.