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| Tuning up a rebuilt /6 https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=29033 |
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| Author: | Tomsecks [ Mon May 19, 2008 1:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Tuning up a rebuilt /6 |
Hello, first post over here. I'm a regular on Moparts, but I am working on a slant, so figured I'd ask the authorities here. I'm helping my uncle with a 225 in his 64' Dart. It was rebuilt ~ 4 years ago, the car has never really been ran or driven much since then. He's mainly ran it to move the car in/out of his garage. It just flat doesn't run well. Won't idle slow enough, doesn't rev really well, just isn't right. SO far, it's got a new set of wires w/ Autolite plugs - got rid of the miss it had. I've narrowed it down to 2 main issues, I'll let you guys give your opinions on which is more glaring. 1. Timing. At idle, it's showing about 10 degrees. The slot on the dist is maxed out. Is this too much? Should I reposition the drive gear to get it into the adjustable range on the slot? Would a tooth over be too much timing change? 2. Mixture screw on the carb has 0 effect on the idle. The carb has been rebuilt like 3 times (that my uncle knows of who knows in the last 40 years total) so I can't tell if it is working properly or not. It likes to run at about 1/2 - 1/4 choked. If wide open just dies out - at idle or with throttle open. Thanks in advance for the thoughts. |
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| Author: | Doc [ Mon May 19, 2008 1:52 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Have you checked the valve lash? If not, I would pull the valve cover, check the torque on the head bolts, then relash the valves, hot, .010 on the intakes and a "loose" .020 on the exhaust. Seems like adjusting / setting the lash on a solid lifter engine is becoming a 'lost art' so that would be the the first thing to check on a poor running SL6. (older then 1981, after that, the SL6 had hydraulic lifters.) DD |
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| Author: | Tomsecks [ Tue May 20, 2008 7:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I have not checked the lash yet. If they were too loose or too tight would they be making noise? There isn't any noticable noise from them, that was one reason I didn't really look at it. Thoughts on the other 2 thoughts of mine? |
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| Author: | Doc [ Tue May 20, 2008 9:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
10 degrees BTDC initial timing is fine for now. There is another bolt and slot on the underside of the distributor if you need to shift the slotted plate in order to shift the range. The carb sounds like it has a plugged idle circuit, is it a Holley 1920 or a Carter BBS. (sounds like a Holley) If it's a Holley, start looking for a different working carb. If the valve are not making any ticking noises, they are set to tight and that will make the engine run bad. The first thing I do when tuning a solid lifter SL6, is pull the valve cover and adjust the valve lash. DD |
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| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Tue May 20, 2008 9:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Yup, Doc's giving you good advice to adjust the valves. Here is a detailed valve adjustment procedure. Tune-up parts and procedural recommendations are in this thread. And after sitting for so long, it is likely the carburetor will need to be rebuilt with a good-quality kit. Don't trade it in on a "remanufactured" item from the parts store, those are junk. |
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| Author: | Tomsecks [ Wed May 21, 2008 7:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Alright fellas, thanks for the tips, I will check the lash, sounds like it might be too tight. Also BIG thanks for the tip not to get a reman carb, cause that was one thought my uncle was big on. I think he is going to take it to a local resto shop, they did a Quadrabog for him awhile ago that turned out good. The carb is the Carter one IF I remember correctly. |
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| Author: | Dart74 [ Thu May 22, 2008 1:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Seeing that it haas been in the garage for some years I would also check for vacumleak. Rob |
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| Author: | Tomsecks [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | It Just Won't Run!!! |
Ok, update on this situation, I NEED more help. Since my last post, spent some time chasing down parts. I spent a good bit of time with this /6 yesturday. Here's what I've messed with since I last posted: Aquired a Super Six setup, rebuilt the BBD, and tested the BBD on a different engine, seems to work great. I WANT to put this setup on the car. But didn't do it yet, my uncle wanted to see if a Holley 1920 would work. Ideally he wants to run the 1 brl, despite me telling him it seems the 2 brl setup is the way to go. My uncle will NOT let me adjust the valves. I want to adjust them, so please minimal responses about the valves. The guy that rebuilt the engine told him he shouldn't need to do it, he flat refuses to let me do it! A little frustrating for sure. Ok, so that's some background. The Holley runs much better then his Carter did. There is still a miss at all RPMs, and it refuses to idle lower then 1200 RPM unless the choke is about 80% shut. It seems to rev up well, but still has a miss. I found that the vacuum diaphram on the dist is no good, so I've been trying to get it to idle with the port pluged on the carb. It's got about 10 degrees of timing at idle (I'm estimating that since it doesn't want to idle) it's about 15 degrees at 1200 RPM. I checked the gap on the new points he installed, .020" and then with a dwell meter, 40 degrees. Is there anything in that dist that might be causing the miss? Everything else in the ignition system has been checked or replaced: plugs, wires, coil, ballast, points. On the Holley, I did notice that down inside it fuel seems to be coming out only 1 of the tubes. The squirt seems to be working well. I adjusted the float level (wet float level of 11/16"), besides that it is how it came. I check for vacuum leaks on the carb, also found it to be pulling about 17-18 on the vacuum gauge I hooked up. Sorry for the long post, but it just seems NOTHING is making this thing run. I really want to check the valves, but for some reason that seems un-thinkable to my uncle. I think I'm going to buy a valve cover gasket and just say here's a gift, let me at em. Thanks in advance for the help. If there is anything else you're curious about ask away, I bet I've checked it. |
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| Author: | Doc [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 1:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Wow, he won't let you adjust the valves... I wonder what he is hiding under that valve cover.  Yes, you really need to check the valve lash, it is important. It sounds like ithe induction systm has a big vacuum leak or that Holley carb has lost it's idle circuit... if it will not idle / run with-out the choke closed. Thanks for the up-date, DD |
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| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 1:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
If your uncle doesn't stop being foolish, there's nothing we can do to help you help him. He's wrong. Period. Mechanical valves always need to have the lash rechecked once a new engine is started and "run-in". |
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| Author: | Aggressive Ted [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 3:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I can't imagine your uncle being so stubborn! When I fired mine up I had to relash them at least 3 times before the engine really settled down. The cam and lifters have to seat and that takes time and things change with more break in. Did the engine get broken at 2500 rpm for 20 minutes to harden the cam? If not, you may be in for some trouble..... Maybe that is what he is afraid of....... |
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| Author: | walpolla [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
perhaps you could let the "uncle" see this thread,or print it out and let him read it.  might change the thinking on his part? regards,Rod.
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| Author: | DusterIdiot [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Location... |
I have to agree, rebuilt engines have to have time to 'work in' the components, and mech. valves have to be relashed...period... unless his engine builder swapped out his original engine for a late model hydraulic lifter model (not a good fit in that car)... If you were in the Northern Oregon area I'd tell you to 'take it for a test drive' down to my place and we could go through it... it would be nice if your uncle would let 'us' help 'u', the car would sound, run, and be much better than it is now... Keep at It! -D.Idiot |
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| Author: | THOR [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 10:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Seems like we had the same problem on another car we worked on... Does the car still have points? If so, is it running a stock coil with a ballast resistor on it? Or an aftermarket coil? If the car is EI with the new engine, that kinda rules out what I am trying to accomplish. |
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| Author: | Tomsecks [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Yea it is pretty annoying that he is dead set on not looking at the valves. I've tried several times to get him to budge but he won't. I've done it on multiple vehicles before and he just doesn't want to do it. I swear I might go over to his house when he is at work and just do it! The car does have a points ignition. Installed new points, .020 gap and the dwell measured 40 degrees. Tried 2 coils on the car, and also a different ballast resistor. I've mentioned going to a Pertronix, he seems pretty interested in that. Also on that distribuitor, the vacuum advance pod is shot, but the auto parts stores don't seem to have one, is one from an LA Mopar v8 the same? Or is there a place I can get a /6 one? Thanks for the help, and the patience. |
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