after applying heat spray with penetrating oil. When it is cooling it will dray the oil into the threads. If you do it too soon? Expect a small fire
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| Author: | theslantingsix [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 5:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | i got a problem |
i was taking my head and manifolds off this morning geting ready for my engine build and i broke off the first stud for the exhaust manifold bus when i looked at it it wasent a stud it was a bolt is it suposed to be like hat or not and can i fix it couse thats the only head i got thanks Josh |
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| Author: | 66aCUDA [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 6:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
It can be fixed. Either by you or a Machine Shop. Frank |
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| Author: | theslantingsix [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 6:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
how? |
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| Author: | radarsonwheels [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 7:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | it will be a pain in the butt |
first use lots of penetrating oil. If there is anything sticking out you can use vicegrips to twist it out. Usually lots of heat from a propane torch or a little heat from an ox/a setup will help a lot. Some people have good luck with 'easy outs'. They are reverse threaded cone shaped bits. You are supposed to drill a pilot hole, then they are backwards threaded into the hole in the fastener. In a perfect world they will then spin the sucker right out. If you go this route make sure and buy the BEST set of easy outs you can find (snap on). I have had a couple of these break off in the fastener which is the worst because now you have to deal with a lump of tool steel which has to be ground out- a drill will just dance on it. A better choice is a reverse thread drill bit. You can get some sent to your house from McMaster Carr. Grind the face of the broken fastener flat and carefully centerpunch the middle. start with a small bit and work yout way up to bigger ones. The drill will either eventually catch and reverse the fastener out or you will have to go to bigger and bigger bits until the thin remains of the fastener can collapse in and be cleaned out with a tap. You got your work cut out for ya! good luck radar in philly |
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| Author: | Ed Mullen [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 8:15 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
If there is enough sticking out for the vice-grip route: While it's soaking in penetrant, try tapping the stud into the head very gently, but repeatedly many times (like 20-50, or whenever you attention span gives out). If there is a danger of slipping and hitting the head, use a brass hammer or punch. When you attach vice-grips start from the tightest position you can set them on and still be able to close/clamp them (with two hands, fingers woven, etc.) then tighten the vice-grips a little more and repeat (each time you clamp the vice-grips they compress the stud a little). When the stud stops compressing (i.e. you can't get the vice-grips any tighter) is when you can start applying torque. (Obviously attach the vice-grips from the clock-wise-most position possible, giving yourself the most amount of turning before having to reapply your grip.) If you do use heat, try to focus it on the metal around the hole, and not on the fastener. The reason is that A: if the heat expands the hole metal, the hole gets bigger than the stud, thereby making it phisically looser. If both expand together they more or less stay the same relative size (individual properties of the metals they are made of, not withstanding), and if you heat just the stud, the opposite happens... ...and B: if you only heat the metal around the hole, the heat has to transfer through where the head and stud touch (along with whatever sealer, anti-sieze compound and rust, etc. are present). The heat transfer screws up the molecular bond between these materials (the molecular bond being what is holding the stud still enough to break to begin with. It's not the torque. Without a head on a bolt, or nut on a stud, or either bottoming out in a hole, torque isn't even at issue) As you heat, keep adding penetrant (which may catch on fire briefly), and re-tighten the vice-grips (as the heat makes the stud softer, and it will compress even more). It also may help to resume tapping with the hammer and/or brass punch. My dad was a proccess-piping mechanic, foreman and supervisor at a chemical plant for ages. He often lectured us on how most great forces we encounter are on a molecular level, and are only sucessfully overcome by addressing them on that same level. (He often got neighbors who had asked for help with stuck/broken fasteners to perform fools errands at his direction. He'd have them do stuff like tapping a bolt 200 times with a 2 oz cartoon-looking brass hammer, then holding a plumber's torch on it and counting 300 Mississipis, then tapping 100 times, then he'd loosen the fastener with slip-joint pliers, or sometimes just his fingers--often suckering the same person into betting him that he couldn't). |
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| Author: | Rug_Trucker [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 9:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
after applying heat spray with penetrating oil. When it is cooling it will dray the oil into the threads. If you do it too soon? Expect a small fire
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| Author: | 6shotvanner [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 9:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Good stuff there Ed.I also come from a similar background as your dad,mine being Pipefitter in the pulp and paper industry. Another trick or two is heat the offending stud/bolt cherry red and let it cool then try removing.Another is drill a hole as when prepping for easyout,heat cherry red and then use a squirt bottle and direct a stream of water in the hole giving it a quick "shock"cooling. Both are meant to "break" the bond between the two surfaces,granted we were dealing with much larger bolts an studs but principle is the same. 
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| Author: | Eric W [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 11:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Since your rebuilding the engine anyway, your going to a machine shop so let them take it out. Personaly, I don't even bother trying myself anymore. |
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| Author: | slantzilla [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 2:35 pm ] |
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Quote: Since your rebuilding the engine anyway, your going to a machine shop so let them take it out. Personaly, I don't even bother trying myself anymore.
Where's the fun in that E? Don't you like fires and burning your fingers anymore? I'm with you though, if the head is going to the shop I just let Mike do it. 
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| Author: | Spikeophant [ Tue Dec 23, 2008 2:49 pm ] |
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I just did that in my truck, and when I got the manifold off, I just used a punch and spun it out, as it wasn't too rusted up, and with teh tension off from it breaking, it came out easily. I would suggest trying that at least first. |
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