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4 link rear end setup???
https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=33546		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  chrisparis [ Fri Jan 30, 2009 2:05 am ]
Post subject:  4 link rear end setup???
does anyone make one for my 70 valiant?
Author:  emptypockett [ Fri Jan 30, 2009 11:33 am ]
Post subject:  4 Bar Rear Set-Up
I just put in Cal Trac rear suspension and it basicly makes leaf springs a 4-link with out any modifications (cutting/welding).Totally bolt in.
Author:  Jopapa [ Sat Jan 31, 2009 7:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
Bill Reilly over at Bigblockdart makes a coilover 4-link setup that I've heard nothing but stellar reviews on. Looking at it and his Alter-K-tion kit, I can see why. No personal experience with any of his products, but I've talked to him several times and he definitely knows what he's doing and has a passion for his work. I'd love to get my hands on both kits and completely modernize the suspension on my Duster.
Author:  runvs_826 [ Sat Jan 31, 2009 8:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
Do a search for the 4 link and my username. That is what I run and I made it myself. I can't remember where but I thought there was some places that made some universal kits. ie the arms and ends and than you weld it in. That is honestly where I would go, alond with a coilover set. It should cost closer to a $1000 and some work. I haven't looked at Reiley's rear kit, but he did awesome work with his front stuff. I talked to him back when my uncle was talking to XV, he's a big mopar guy and builds the system right. XV is a promotion company milking off of old Mustang II kits.
Author:  slantzilla [ Sun Feb 01, 2009 9:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 4 link rear end setup???
Quote:
does anyone make one for my 70 valiant?
What are you trying to achieve? 4 link is a pretty drastic step. :shock:
Author:  runvs_826 [ Sun Feb 01, 2009 8:56 pm ]
Post subject: 
I would disagree! The 4 link is a much better set-up than the leaf springs. It's not terribly difficult to install and it much more versatile. It's equally annoying to install new perches, move them inward, or push a bolt through new bushings.
A 4 link is a great idea. Unfortunatley they are expensive, I thought there was some universal kits that would supply brackets to the axle, arms, and spring perches. So you have to make brackets that would connect the arms and springs to your car. If someone finds one I would love to know where cause a buddy is coming into a Firebird and I've suggested that suspension and brakes are a bigger concern than 500hp.
Author:  slantzilla [ Sun Feb 01, 2009 9:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
AFAIK, except for Reilly's kit there is no "bolt-in" 4 link kit.

4 links really need to be installed and adjusted properly or serious handling issues will occur.

Unless you are building a high horsepower drag car a 4 link is not better than a leaf spring suspension. The Cal-Trac setup is very adequate until you get into the 9's for sure. :shock:
Author:  Joshie225 [ Sun Feb 01, 2009 9:12 pm ]
Post subject: 
A poorly done 4-link suspension will be worse off than well executed leaf suspension. We really need to hear from you regarding your goals for the car. Here we're all about achieving goals rather than buying parts for parts sake.
Author:  runvs_826 [ Mon Feb 02, 2009 4:12 pm ]
Post subject: 
A poorly done 4-link? I don't quite understand? I mean there's room for error on both spring perches and keeping your arms parrallel. Anyways, I checked out RMS because I haven't been there in a while. The 4 link on their page would be the best bet for a "bolt in". It is a very nice kit and that price is very very reasonable. Especially if it includes the springs and shocks (can't remember now). The universal kit I was refering too I still can't find (busy with classes), but wouldn't include shocks ect. So you could easily be into a universal kit for $1000, and have to do the work yourself.
Upgrading the rear end would be more important to me than buying the front end. I mean I would buy that kit and get a polyurethane kit through PST or something. Oh wait! That is what I did. Anyways, good luck I very much suggest you persue this course as I think you'll be very satisfied. However, if money is an absolute concern, new leafs and cal-trac would be a better option.
Author:  Joshie225 [ Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
If the links are not parallel in plan view and equal in length the axle housing will rotate when the suspension moves up or down. If one side of the rear axle moves up or down and the other side is stationary or is moving the other way the suspension links will attempt to twist the entire axle housing. This creates tremendous roll resistance or binding in the rear suspension. That's just one problem with a poorly executed 4-link. Remember?

I also recall you having wheel hop problems at the Woodburn race with your home made 4-link. My 40 year old leaf springs and 205/75R14 Sears radials had no such problem. Since you did zero track testing before throwing away your leaf springs we don't know objectively if your 4-link helped with handling either. What was your goal for the 4-link and did you achieve that goal?
Author:  slantzilla [ Mon Feb 02, 2009 7:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
The problem with a 4 link in a car with a stock floor pan is room for properly locating the front mounts for the bars. Too short or too low and it will not be tuneable.

If you really, really want to get rid of the leaf springs why not do a ladder bar/coil-over? Much easier to install and more forgiving of space limitations.

There's probably not even a dozen Slant cars on the planet making enough steam to need anything other than Cal-Tracs. :shock:
Author:  runvs_826 [ Mon Feb 02, 2009 8:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
I completely agree with Slantzilla, there is maybe a handful of slants that warrant a true 4 link suspension. I've read about the coil over set-up that isn't 4 link, but don't have any true information about it.
Josh brings up some info that isn't in the quick write-up. First is when I installed the perches on the ford 8.8 I completely messed it up. I was using the cheap harbor frieght degree finder, and welded the perches on the axle before installing. It was a mess! So, we installed new perches on top of the axle and I had about 10in between the top of the tire and my body line. Well, that was all I had left in me for springs, I was done. I later found out that the springs needed to be recurved when I was giving them away.
So, we did our research and found a way for me to build something on the cheap. My old man started playing with the lathe we had at the time making a rod ends. So, with a trip to Cherry city I got more metal. The lathe blew up a gear and we had to wait to get a bigger better one. So, the next problem was I installed a wimpy 1in dia 16guageish for the top supports to attatch to. I had completely destroyed that bar, which I found out after that woodburn race when I was checking out the new shocks I had bought. The bent bar had led to the previous problem which Josh metioned that destroyed a shock tower and the shock blew oil all over the car. I had focused on this before the race and had finished the new shock mounts at 10pm the night before. So the bent bar was still in the car when we were racing.
So, now that I have fixed that, was it worth it? I don't know haven't had a chance to run the car since than, so we will see. However, it has worked and isn't blowing u-joints from installing perches right. So....
I've installed a better igntition and switched out to smaller injectors which has made the car run better. Last, I adjusted the valves and realised I had really messed them up by tightening them way to much. So yes, it was right for me, but what I've had to learn is to make sure you do it right, and even if you think you do it right go back and check.

P.S. Can't wait for a re-match Josh! I'm hoping that the tuning, learning, and small upgrades will plunge me into the 16's.
Author:  sandy in BC [ Mon Feb 02, 2009 8:16 pm ]
Post subject: 
I get that leafs can be a problem. I had leafs on both ends of my mudbogger. I could destroy a set of springs and shocks in 1 weekend of racing.

Instead of an expensive and hard to tune 4 link I built my own control arm setup on both ends.

I have little experience engineering suspension components so I decided to keep the factory geometry. I kept the factory fixed spring mounts in the stock locations. I kept the stock shock mounts. I replaced the front part of the spring with 2x2 .125 wall square tube. It bolts to the front spring mount and is held to the axle with stock ubolts. The arm is EXACTLY the same length as the front section of the spring. I made a spring pad on the chassis and axle to fit a Firefly coil spring. It all works like a damn because the geometry is stock.

The front was done the same way except I put a fixed mount on the shackle end and ran the bars forward.

The good part is everything other than the arms is OEM.

I dont even run a track bar on the rear. Cost.....less than $200 (both ends)
Author:  runvs_826 [ Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:50 pm ]
Post subject: 
Yes, the last post is all the mistakes I made on the rear and plenty on the rest of the car. It's been till this week that I feel the car is in true tip-top shape. This is something about what I was thinking with some QA1 which I don't think are included with the RMS anyway. Looking back now I would even have looked more for something like this on a tight tight budget.

http://www.streetbeatcustoms.com/gru4linkall.html

So with this you still have to take care of your coil over set-up and other fabrication. Could probably be done for about $500.

http://www.polyperformance.com/shop/Uni ... 16802.html

This get's you closer but there is a bigger price difference. Once you pay for shocks you're on your way to paying for the RMS kit. My point is even with my struggles this is very plausible and a great upgrade when done right. This is something I would suggest, now the Megasquirt setup...
Author:  chrisparis [ Tue Feb 03, 2009 9:50 am ]
Post subject: 
what I am trying to do is rid of the rear leafs so that when i put air bags on the rear I can lay as low as am wanting to. I know that I am going to get a lot of static for wanting to make a lowrider out of my valiant, but that is just my lifestyle. Low and slow :D My other car is a 03 Cavalier with a full digital air ride setup and 18" wheels on it :o I love to go low 8) 8)
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