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engine mod questions
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Author:  lisdiver [ Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:44 am ]
Post subject:  engine mod questions
Hi all, just signed up to this group and I like all the information that is posted. I have a 67 barracuda that I am restoring. I am looking to get a bit more performance out of the 225 but still make it a daily driver.

I have been looking at a few web sites to get Ideas and was thinking of going with the following:
Clifford Performance Ram Flow Intake
Clifford 264 Hydraulic Cam
Oversized Valves (1.700",1.440")
And a set of headers

Questions:
1- This sound like a good choice?
2- Clifford states the intake needs a 350 cfm carb or larger. I was thinking of using a 2 barrel. Any suggestions? Have seen talk about the carter BBD and some Holleys.

The Trans is a 904. Stock converter. Any suggestions for converters and rear gear ratio?
Like I said, its just going to be a daily driver so not looking for high performance, just something a bit better than stock so the car moves more like she looks.
Author:  68barracuda [ Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:18 am ]
Post subject: 
Clifford in the past 8) now :shock: :? :(

The product is good the service is so so :?

OK first tell us all - what is your plan with this car - what will it be doing 90% of the time

Oh and welcome to this forum nice guys listen to Doc and Dan ...............and the rest of the ingrates :twisted: :twisted:
Author:  lisdiver [ Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:28 am ]
Post subject: 
My plans for the car are to get it looking good again and being able to drive it again. Its been off the road for over 15 years :( I took it off the road when I was in college to do some body work on it and just never found the time to finish. I'm determined to get it done by the end of this summer.

Its going to be a daily driver except for during the winter when I'll use my Jeep instead.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: engine mod questions
Quote:
Hi all, just signed up to this group and I like all the information that is posted. I have a 67 barracuda that I am restoring. I am looking to get a bit more performance out of the 225 but still make it a daily driver.
Welcome on the board. You will probably want to rethink your shopping list, for a few reasons. In the first place, you're going about it backwards. Instead of picking out parts that look and sound cool, start by defining — very specifically — your goals for the car. What do you want it to do, exactly? "a bit more performance" is vague...how will you be driving this car? Where? When? How often? On what kind of gasoline? What amount of performance improvement will be satisfactory? What fuel economy do you require? What kind of budget do you need to stick to, and is it a budget just for the engine, or do you also want the car to steer and stop better, etc.? Once you've spent some time thinking and planning on those goals, we can guide you specifically to parts and techniques to go for (and those to avoid).

It's fun to page thru Clifford's catalogue, sure, but they are not the most cost-effective or trustworthy vendor, and they tend to push excess (too much carburetor, too much manifold, too much camshaft, etc.). Besides that, if the engine you're building was made before 1981, it does not use a hydraulic cam.
Quote:
its just going to be a daily driver so not looking for high performance, just something a bit better than stock so the car moves more like she looks.
Okeh, this gets us a little closer, though specifics would still be helpful. Given that desire, and not knowing your time and money constraints nor whether you're building an engine from scratch or bolting stuff onto an existing one, I would rewrite your shopping list like this (red text is clickable):

Factory Super Six 2bbl intake setup with a good example (i.e., not a parts store "remanufactured" item) of any of several suitable 2bbl carbs — Carter BBD, Holley 2280, Stromberg WW. Factory 2bbl kickdown linkage or see this thread for kickdown options.

Electronic ignition with carefully dialled-in advance curves and HEI upgrade

Dutra Duals collected via a "Y" pipe into a single 2¼" headpipe, your choice of muffler and tailpipe.

One of the well-developed new Slant-6 cam grinds from Erson

1.70" and 1.44" valves from Engnbldr, see here; hardened exhaust seats and bronze valve guides.

A good engine buildup with careful attention to detail — CC the combustion chambers, blueprint the oiling system, etc.

Disc brakes, upgraded torsion bars and shock absorbers, P205/70R14 tires and 2.93 or 3.23 rear gears depending on your preferred highway cruise speeds and percentage of city/highway driving

Upgraded headlights and brake lights and such (real ones, not the toy junk sold to kidzzz), but only because I'm a lighting geek :lol: :cool:
Author:  runvs_826 [ Mon Mar 09, 2009 3:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
I second that list Dan Just wrote. I would focus more on gears, ignition, and cam over a set of headers.
Author:  theslantingsix [ Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:01 pm ]
Post subject: 
i would go high flow and slightly bigger cam (high lift, low duration) for street use

headers arent all there cracked up to be i would go dutra duels. i got headers used from one of my frends then like 2 months lator i herd about the duels and i already had the headers

personly the duels are better becouse they dont warp like headers and cheaper

clifford aint the best place to order for ether, try offenhouser
http://offyparts.com/
Author:  runvs_826 [ Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
Um... well this is my feeling about Clifford. They aren't evil or a snake they just don't seem to be very professional or timely. I ordered a camshaft from them and two weeks later called to cancel my order. They replied that they hadn't shipped the cam yet so I wouldn't be charged for shipping. Well, that's nice....
Erson has some great general use cams that the Doc has prescribed, ha. But there is better placed to put money than intake and exhaust, those are just the easiest.
Author:  CARS [ Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
Welcome!!! You've been given great advise. Just keep reading and searching.
Author:  lisdiver [ Mon Mar 09, 2009 10:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
thanks for all the suggestions. I have worked on cars since I was little but just fixing what needed to be repaired, not much of doing mods and just starting to learn about the way cams and the gears come into play.

Ok, here's a little more about the car.

i had rebuilt the engine years ago and only used it for about 2 years before taking it off the road. I replaced all the bearings and the rings. i didn't have money for doing anything with the head. My father and I changed the brakes over to 10" discs in the front and 10" drums in the rear from a 75 dart. Not sure what gears are in the rear, will be checking that this week.

I am looking to cruise around 65-70 mph. What octane fuel should I be using? Like I said, the car has been off the road for over 15 years. I know the old leaded gas had more octane than unleaded does, so I guess I should use the highest I can get, right?

I know that doesn't have the hydraulic cam. I thought, from reading Cliffords site and another article I saw somewhere, that a hydraulic cam can be put in if the lifters and the push rods were changed as well. They were all included in the kit from clifford.

Before I found this forum, I heard about cliffords site from some other sites and thought that was one of the only places to get stuff for a slant six. Thanks to you guys I know better now.

As far as the head lights and tail lights getting up graded, where can I find stuff for doing that? I'll be checking out more of this site over the next week. Have gotten a few ideas and like the input so far!
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Tue Mar 10, 2009 7:56 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
My father and I changed the brakes over to 10" discs in the front and 10" drums in the rear from a 75 dart.
Ah, so you're all set in the braking department (those're 11" discs up front).
Quote:
I am looking to cruise around 65-70 mph.
2.93s, or 3.23s would be my pick.
Quote:
What octane fuel should I be using?
How much money do you want to spend on fuel? :shock: I prefer to set up daily drivers to run on regular so my wallet is not handcuffed to expensive high-test.
Quote:
I know the old leaded gas had more octane than unleaded does, so I guess I should use the highest I can get, right?
Wrong. Leaded fuel did not necessarily have higher octane than unleaded, leaded was just as unavailable 15 years ago as it is now, and these cars weren't configured to require high-test when they were new. Use regular.
Quote:
I know that doesn't have the hydraulic cam. I thought, from reading Cliffords site and another article I saw somewhere, that a hydraulic cam can be put in if the lifters and the push rods were changed as well
You can convert to hydraulic, but it requires more than a cam, lifters, and pushrods. You have to modify the top end oil feed and use the '81+ rocker shaft and rocker arms. Why...? Okeh, you don't have to do valve adjustments every 20k miles any more (big deal) but you lock yourself into a much more limited selection of camshafts.
Quote:
As far as the head lights and tail lights getting up graded, where can I find stuff for doing that?
Headlamps, see this post. See this post and this post for the rest of the lights on the car.
Author:  runvs_826 [ Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:54 am ]
Post subject: 
I would look up a thread called Twiggy-Aluminum Engine Build, for performance ideas. Also, stick with a solid cam, it's just easier. You don't have to run high octane and I wouldn't. The slant's compression ratio was extremely low which probably helped it's reliability. I would look into raising the compression to somewhere around 9:1 if you can.
Super six would be fine for a two barrel, especially if you don't anticipate making it into a major racer. I think you can dip into the 16's fine with it. Gears I would suggest at least 3.23 if not 3.55, but I have overdrive (A-833od if you drive stick). Balancing will help as well!
Author:  theslantingsix [ Tue Mar 10, 2009 2:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
You can convert to hydraulic, but it requires more than a cam, lifters, and pushrods. You have to modify the top end oil feed and use the '81+ rocker shaft and rocker arms. Why...? Okeh, you don't have to do valve adjustments every 20k miles any more (big deal) but you lock yourself into a much more limited selection of camshafts.
im going with dan on that one sides then you can get the chrome t handles for your valve cover like the old skool hot rods had i think they look realy cool

besides when you get up in the high rpms with hydrolic lifters you get "valve float" i think is what its called. its when the valves dont close all the way
Author:  lisdiver [ Tue Mar 10, 2009 3:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
Dan and the rest of you- Thanks again for the advice. Definately going to be going through this site and getting more info and suggestions.
Author:  Bren67Cuda904 [ Wed Mar 11, 2009 6:31 am ]
Post subject: 
Don't go with 3.55 gears. I'd say 3.07 - 2.94 would be the lowest for driving on the highway without and overdrive.
Author:  Karasik87 [ Wed Mar 11, 2009 4:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
if your gonna mess with your rear end ratio, keep in mind how fast you'll realistically cruise on the highway. i got a 2.94 rear end with p185/70r14 and at 70 mph it cruises right around 2930 rpm. and on a single bbl, tired, whipped engine, its not exactly relaxed.
Here is a fun place to mess around when trying to determine the best rear end ratio
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