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staged carb or tbi question
https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=34324		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  75duster [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 7:32 am ]
Post subject:  staged carb or tbi question
has anyone tried to use the staged holley off the 2.2 four? what about the tbi setup off the 2.2?
Author:  Joshie225 [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 8:15 am ]
Post subject: 
The staged Holley off a 2.3 Pinto worked for me for a while, but it didn't get enough better economy to make up for the performance hit so the Holley 390 4bbl went back on. The Chrysler 2.2 carb is similar, but I think all are of the feedback type.
Author:  Rug_Trucker [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 9:01 am ]
Post subject: 
I was told you don't connect the wire on there it will be OK. Former dealer mechanic told me that.
Author:  CARS [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 9:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: staged carb or tbi question
Quote:
has anyone tried to use the staged holley off the 2.2 four? what about the tbi setup off the 2.2?
Pharmboy (think I got that right) has 2 progressive carbs being added to a dual carb Offy intake. The carbs are off of a 1.6L escort engine I think.

Well, here's the link: http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/sho ... hp?t=53237

If you go to the articles section here Josh wrote a carb article that discusses his carb swaps in more detail than what he wrote here.

I can see 2 weber/holleys working but a single just doesn't seem to be enough. I'm waiting for the South African dual weber to be cast. Until then I am just going to run a 350 Holley.

There are a couple articles about using 2 TBI's but I can't find the link right now. Google it.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 9:41 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
I was told you don't connect the wire on there it will be OK. Former dealer mechanic told me that.
That's not correct. Feedback carburetors aren't smart enough to default to any particular position when the wire's disconnected.
Author:  75duster [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 10:02 am ]
Post subject: 
what cfm do these different types flow?
Author:  Joshie225 [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 10:25 am ]
Post subject: 
I have seen a few flow numbers thrown out for the Weber 32/36 DGV types (the Holley 5200 is similar, but I believe the 5200 flows less), but most appear to be educated guesses. In the real world a Weber 32/36 DGV is the major restriction on a 1.6L SOHC VW Rabbit engine with a mild cam, header and head work. The 2.2 and 2.4L Toyota 20/22R engines do OK on the street with a 32/36, but they don't rev very high. I feel that two of the 32/36 Webers could do well on a mildly hopped up 225 (3.7L), but my alternative solution (still a work in progress) to using two progressive 2bbl carbs is to divide the plenum of my Clifford intake and use a 4bbl. The divided plenum separates the front and rear cylinders as does a dual carb intake and makes the carb function as two progressive 2bbls. Using just one carb simplifies the linkage and reduces costs. One Holley or Carter 4bbl and air cleaner is almost always cheaper than a pair of Webers. Doug Dutra runs a divided plenum Hyper-Pak manifold on his race car to improve low speed torque.

The Holley 5200 I tried didn't have enough accelerator pump shot to keep from bogging on a Clifford manifold. A manifold with a smaller plenum and/or increased accelerator pump delivery would probably eliminate this one issue.
Author:  68barracuda [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 10:46 am ]
Post subject: 
I agree with Josh webers are EXPENSIVE cool but expensive - the 38 DGAV/DGAS carbs flow enough if you use larger mane venturis- ...which is one of the weber pains.... you can replace increase decrease and so on the the boosters, main venturis - the whole spiel

I am busy making a spacer to rotate the 390 I have on the cuda - and I am adding a plenum devider = just need that bouchillion kick down cable

The reason for my dualy project - restoration and performance
Author:  wjajr [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Sorry folks. Hate to be a thread hijacker, but I guts to know... Did he fire 5 shots, or six...

Josh:
Quote:
divide the plenum of my Clifford intake and use a 4bbl.
Josh can you post a photo of your divided plenum Clifford, and or, explain how you did it. Welding a divider would be best, but would epoxy glue work to secure a divider? Dose one need some kind of equalizer hole in it, and if so how big?

When you mount the carburetor, are the primaries facing the driver's side, or passenger's side of the car? What is a good longer throttle cable to use that would fit the round hole in a 67' for a repositioned 8009. Also, do you know if the Bouchillon kick-down cable, with their cable clamp bracket, will work on this set up?
Author:  Joshie225 [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 3:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
Image

The divider was welded in to prevent movement and fretting of the manifold and divider. You could fix the divider in the manifold with a good industrial epoxy. Doug stated he likes to mill a slot in the bottom of the manifold, insert the divider and then weld up the slot.

Image

I did not put any hole or opening in the divider. I'm using a modified nitrous plate to mount the carb to the manifold and there is a gap around the spray bars so there is "communication" between the two halves of the manifold. I don't think a hole or slot is strictly necessary, but the theory is a hole or slot can help the top end more than it hurts the bottom end. I think experimentation will be needed to find the optimum.

On my '67 Valiant with the Offy intake the primaries are toward the driver's side and the stock throttle cable reaches my bellcrank linkage setup. The Offy manifold is stock except for the sideways carb mounting, no plenum divider that is and the car has a manual trans. With the Clifford I'm going use passenger's side primaries as it will simplify plumbing and transmission throttle pressure cable routing. I expect to use a custom throttle cable along with a Lokar throttle pressure cable. I have no experience with the Bouchillon trans pressure cable, but it looks like you could mount the carb either way and have it work just fine.
Author:  wjajr [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 5:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
Is this the bellcrank linkage set up here?
Author:  Joshie225 [ Mon Mar 16, 2009 8:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
Yep, that's in in my dearly departed '66 Dart.

See the bungs in the header primary tubes? That was for the old exhaust heat setup Clifford used to offer. The guy I bought the headers from had heat, but my manifold wasn't drilled and tapped for the heat plate.
Author:  Wizard [ Tue Mar 17, 2009 6:24 am ]
Post subject: 
WHAT? There are different DFAV/DFEV Webers and it is not the 32/36 number, that's for bore sizes. LOOK at the casting for 2 small circles with two digit numbers in each that's your true venturi size.

The ones that came off the 1.6 probably have much smaller venturis.

But, Really the 26mm/27mm venturis too small even for 2.2?!

Cheers, Wizard
Author:  75duster [ Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:39 am ]
Post subject: 
do they fit on a super six manifold? or need an adapter?
Author:  Joshie225 [ Tue Mar 17, 2009 12:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
The Weber DGV/DFV needs an adapter to fit the Super Six manifold. The Jeep kits that use this carb to replace the Carter BBD have the correct adapter which is also available by itself.

http://www.piercemanifolds.com/Images/C ... 04.551.htm
http://www.piercemanifolds.com/Catalogpages/jeep.htm
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