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Carter BBS Fire 20 mins ago
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Author:  carpdar [ Mon May 24, 2010 8:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Carter BBS Fire 20 mins ago
Ok so i just drove a mountain pass and almost over heated twice, but managed to gear down and nurse my valiant home and drop off my friend. After about 10 minutes i started it, drove down the street and shut it off to figure out my next destination (by this point the engine temp gauge has been in the middle for over an hour so it wasnt hotter than usual). When i tryed to start it, it didnt completely start and sounded funny, so i tryed again and black smoke shot out everywhere so an extinguisher was located and i put out the fire.

My guess is a large amount of heat was retained in the metal even though the water temp was fine and the carb boiled when i was parked. When i first popped the hood it was flaming from the downpipe all the way up to the air filter so im guessing it started on the hot manifold/pipe.

The only damage is that the vaccum line burnt off at the carb. Im about to re connect the line and see if she fires up so i can get her home, but im wondering if its possible that the carb is dangerous now that it was on fire for about 2 minutes.

edit- also the heat riser flap is non functional and seized counter clock wise when facing the motor

Thanks,

Aaron
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Mon May 24, 2010 8:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
Wow, that's no fun. I am guessing you're right that the carburetor boiled. The counterclockwise-seized heat riser means less manifold heat, not more, assuming the valve plate is still connected to the shaft. How old/worn is this carburetor?

In the wider view, if your car is overheating like that, it needs serious attention. That's not normal, even in the mountains.
Author:  carpdar [ Tue May 25, 2010 8:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
Turns out the starter ground strap was loose and was sparking badly which ignited the carb boil over.

All i did was change the vaccum advance line and drove home after tightening the ground strap nut.. Put in a new air filter and everything is back to "normal". Today i found that the backside of the manifold heat valve shaft was missing a bushing or something cause theres a notch there, so i rigged up a spring to pull the whole shaft assembly towards the rad which allows it to move freely since it was binding on the manifold.. I think the bimetallic spring is weak because the tang that hooks onto the stop keeps popping off and just hangs there once its warmed up.

Earlier in my trip the heater core started leaking bad inside the cab so i bypassed it, which probably robs about 10% of my cooling system through convection which probably didnt help very much. Also my rad leaks a bit and is somewhat rusty appearing down the cap, im also using a 14psi rad cap which seals well.

Another note is that the motor is from an 82 mopar so its possible the rad/thermostat combo isn't the greatest. Tomorrow im going to reverse flush my rad and see how plugged up it is
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Tue May 25, 2010 9:05 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Turns out the starter ground strap was loose and was sparking badly which ignited the carb boil over.
The starter hasn't got a ground strap. Which part is this?

Has your car got an automatic transmission?
Author:  carpdar [ Wed May 26, 2010 9:57 am ]
Post subject: 
Yes its a push button 903. I dont know about your car.. but my starter solonoid is grounded to the starter itself with a copper strap (positive goes straight to battery), and that was loose causing a massive spark.

I've always had a problem with fuel getting out of the bowl through the accelerator pump slot that the plunger linkage travels through, so im guessing i probably kicked the accelerator as i was starting it even though it was already hot and sprayed fuel out of there :?

I have another BBS thats identical except the little 'ladder' shaped cam that contacts an adjustable screw looks alot healthier wheras my carb has only 2-3 notacable notches remaining. As for the last year of driving my carb has had a flat spot under initial acceleration and the pedal has to be gradually depressed and matched to the revs to get the most power.

I'm working towards my ASE at the moment so i bring the car to college everyday and mess around with it.. today im putting in new strut rod bushings since its metal on metal right now :p
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Wed May 26, 2010 10:06 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Yes its a push button 903
The 903 is a 3-speed manual transmission. You've got a pushbutton 904. The reason I ask about the transmission is to wonder whether the necessary 1/8" adaptor ring was installed between the later-than-'67 replacement engine and the earlier-than-'68 automatic transmission. If not, transmission front pump bushing and seal failure is in your future sooner than later.
Quote:
I dont know about your car.. but my starter solonoid is grounded to the starter itself with a copper strap
No, that's not a ground strap. Take a closer look. It's the power feed from the downstream side of the starter solenoid to the starter motor itself. It carries power from the starter solenoid to the motor when the solenoid is engaged (i.e., when the key is in the "Start" position).
Quote:
I've always had a problem with fuel getting out of the bowl through the accelerator pump slot that the plunger linkage travels through
Sounds like the carburetor could do with a rebuild.
Quote:
I have another BBS thats identical except the little 'ladder' shaped cam that contacts an adjustable screw looks alot healthier wheras my carb has only 2-3 notacable notches remaining.
I don't know that I would be able to discern a sick fast idle cam from a "healthy" one, but there have been various cams with different numbers of steps on them, right from the factory.
Quote:
As for the last year of driving my carb has had a flat spot under initial acceleration and the pedal has to be gradually depressed and matched to the revs to get the most power.
A worn accelerator pump plunger will cause both this and the fuel splash out the top.
Author:  carpdar [ Wed May 26, 2010 10:32 am ]
Post subject: 
My bad its a 904 (dumb mistake). So what should i expect as far as problems if my tranny 'front pump' bushing is incorrect? Im not a transmission guy by any means..

I changed the plunger and the gasket on my carb but that didnt help.. Maybe the plunger seal didnt seat right, or is it possible my needle and seat could be plugged and the bowl is filling up with to much fuel? Its definately not a very enclosed system so extra fuel is going to come out of that little hole before anywhere else i can see.

Im about to take off to class in the my beast so hopefully i can reverse flush my rad and try to squeeze some more life out of it.. My rad and heater core leaks so im going to try and braze them for now untill i have more than 20 bucks to my name.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Wed May 26, 2010 11:58 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
My bad its a 904 (dumb mistake). So what should i expect as far as problems if my tranny 'front pump' bushing is incorrect?
The front pump bushing isn't incorrect. The crankshaft counterbore and torque converter nose got larger for '68. If you use a '68 or later engine in front of a '67 or earlier transmission, the torque converter nose is not supported because it is smaller than the crank counterbore. Rapid wear of the front pump bushing and seal is the result -- and often vibration, as well. There is a 1/8" spacer ring that needs to be inserted in the (larger) crank counterbore to support the (smaller) torque converter nose when putting a late engine in front of an early transmission. At one time this was common knowledge, but it no longer is; you may well wind up dropping the trans or pulling the engine to install that spacer…either before or after you also have to go in there to put in a new front pump bushing and seal.
Quote:
I changed the plunger and the gasket on my carb but that didnt help.
Did you oil and flare the plunger before installation?
Quote:
is it possible my needle and seat could be plugged and the bowl is filling up with to much fuel?
No. If that were happening, fuel would be pouring overtop the carburetor, onto and into the engine, which would not run. Carburetor operation and repair manuals and links to training movies and carb repair/modification threads are posted here for free download.
Author:  carpdar [ Thu May 27, 2010 2:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
According to the woman i bought the car from (7 years ago), the tranny was serviced and it works great except for it seems to shift really hard even though my idle speed isn't very high. There is alot of noise while driving on the highway (above speeds of 40mph) but i attribute that to the lack of carpet and my worn out rear end.. What kind of sounds would this incorrect space make?

I took apart my carb yesterday and pulled out alot of sediment, especially where the springloaded needle sits into (its like a pipe fitting in the bottom of the bowl that screws out). I also checked the accel pump plunger and it forces fuel properly when i push on it.. you can just barely see the spring in the bottom part of the assembly underneath the seal.

After checking it out and putting it back together it still will leak fuel out of the accelerator pump shaft slot on top of the bowl once i turn off my motor when its warmed up. If i go to start it when its still hot it floods easily and fuel is on the intake manifold by this point so i check for fuel puddling before i start my car just incase.

As far as i could tell the needle and seat are functioning properly and im assuming it uses fuel preassure to open the passage and cuts it off once the floats reach they're designated height. I also installed a taller felt carb spacer to reduce heat transfer but it didnt make to much of a difference.

At this point i think the float level is to high (fuel sits about 3/8" below the bowl when the upper part of the carb is pulled off (called the stove?)

At this point i think im going to drive my duster until i can resolve these issues because i love my valiant to much :)
Author:  rustyfords [ Thu May 27, 2010 2:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
Sounds like that carb needs a total rebuild or replacement.
Author:  carpdar [ Thu May 27, 2010 3:01 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hahah that pretty much sums up the car :p I did some reading about the bowl vent and im pretty sure im missing the clip on the accelerator pump rod, and the gasket that sits under the spring retainer.. Im just trying to keep her safe and drivable until i can figure out what my long term plans are with the intake.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Thu May 27, 2010 5:45 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
According to the woman i bought the car from (7 years ago), the tranny was serviced and it works great except for it seems to shift really hard even though my idle speed isn't very high.
What do you mean by "shifts really hard"? If you mean it bangs into engagement when you select Drive or Reverse, that's one thing. If you mean the 1-2 and 2-3 shifts while driving are hard, that's another.
Quote:
What kind of sounds would this incorrect space make?
The vibration caused by the lack of torque converter nose support is not always discernible from the driver's seat, and is not the main effect (the main effect is rapid trans front pump bushing and seal wear).
Quote:
I took apart my carb yesterday and pulled out alot of sediment, especially where the springloaded needle sits into (its like a pipe fitting in the bottom of the bowl that screws out). At this point i think the float level is to high (fuel sits about 3/8" below the bowl when the upper part of the carb is pulled off (called the stove?)
You are studying to be a mechanic, you say? Please consult the manual if you do not know what the parts are called, and call them correctly. It's important. What you are calling "like a pipe fitting in the bottom of the bowl that screws out" is the main jet. What you are calling "the springloaded needle" is the step-up rod and step-up piston. What you are calling the "stove" is the air horn. Fuel level is checked and adjusted by measuring and setting the float height -- not the other way around.
Author:  carpdar [ Sat May 29, 2010 1:48 am ]
Post subject: 
As in shift hard i mean strongly throughout the gears not just initial engagement. When i got the car the idle speed was at 1000rpm and i have it now at 700 so it doesn't slam into gear.

I think the transmission must have been assembled correctly because i have put over 10,000 miles on the car since i was 14 and the only change in sound is the rear-end howl. I've had the diff cover off and pulled the axles to inspect everything for wear. The gear oil wasn't contaminated with any water or metal shavings and the hypoid gears in the 'pumpkin' had even wear on the surfaces. The spider gears appeared to be in decent shape but i think the noise lies in the axle-splines.. they didn't look as good as the rest of the diff components i could see and when i put them back in the noise was even more noticble since i must have disturbed the meshing of the splines that they were worn into (or at least thats my theory).

Today i checked the timing for the first time in a couple years and it was way off. Something like 0 degrees.. so i put it to 8 and she is alot more resiliant to stalling and accelerates much smoother through the gears.

One thing thats concerning me is theres noticable smoke (blow-by i think) coming from the crankcase vent and the motor sounds alot more rough than it did before my may long weekend road trip which racked up another 1000 miles.

As of now im looking for a 60's 225 to rebuild and swap with my '82 motor, but for the meanwhile i've chose to keep her as my daily driver and do the bearings, suspension, and figure out an intake configuration for my needs (probably a BBD i have left over from my 318)

I'm going to try and get some pictures of my project on here as soon as i get my camera working
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