Slant Six Forum
https://slantsix.org/forum/

MORE Electrical Woes.
https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=42939		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  76valiant [ Sun Dec 19, 2010 5:42 pm ]
Post subject:  MORE Electrical Woes.
Ok, this is beyond pissing me off.

The random shimmering of the lights was tolerable compared to what this car is doing now. I get the feeling that my alternator is randomly charging the battery since when it's not charging (Based upon speculation.) the instrument cluster lights, turn signals and headlights are quite dim. However when it IS charging, all the lights are nice and bright white, the high beams switch to low beams within half a second, the directional light switches on within half a second as well compared to 3+ seconds when it's not charging.

The alternator is new and I'm too pissed to think rationally... Please help.
Author:  Reed [ Sun Dec 19, 2010 5:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
I am assuming your vehicle is a 1976 Valiant. At this stage in the vehicles life, there is no telling what condition the electrical system is in. The first thing I would do would be to purchase a factory service manual for your car and read it, especially the section about the electrical system.

Next, I would trace the wiring of the charging system and look for bad grounds, cracked or otherwise worn or loose wires, and corrosion buildup on the terminals, especially the bulkhead connector and battery terminals. I would clean all the grounds and clean all the terminals with DeOxit (available at Radio Shacks everywhere).

Next, I would check the alternator itself (take it to a parts store that will check it for you) and also check the voltage regulator. If those items check out, then you have bad wiring somewhere, or possibly a bad battery.
Author:  olafla [ Sun Dec 19, 2010 6:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hi 76valiant. Is your new alternator a high amp model? Keep in mind that your wiring is designed for the old one, you may need to upgrade some of the wires for a higher load.

Olaf.
Author:  4speed [ Sun Dec 19, 2010 6:53 pm ]
Post subject: 
You need a voltmeter. We really can't go by how bright the lights are. Check the voltage at the battery with engine on fast idle. Leave it there and watch for changes. Note the changes. Leave the neg side of the meter on the battery and put the plus lead on the alt. output terminal. Take readings. Now move the plus lead to the voltage regulator. Take readings. Post readings
Author:  DusterIdiot [ Sun Dec 19, 2010 7:02 pm ]
Post subject:  1976
Quote:
Is your new alternator a high amp model? Keep in mind that your wiring is designed for the old one, you may need to upgrade some of the wires for a higher load.
The 76 does not run main voltage directly through the ammeter like the other years. On these years you have a better chance at going from the 40amp to the 65 amp "stock" alternator...the only difference is one wire in the engine bay gets upgraded from 10 to 8 gauge...I've already upgraded my Feather Duster with a 65 amp unit and it's been fine for the last 10 years (I actually am on my second alternator...oddly enough).



-D.Idiot
Author:  76valiant [ Sun Dec 19, 2010 11:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
This is the alternator I bought:

http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/ ... 8714_4423_

It's a 65 Amp Alternator which should be MORE than sufficent for headlights, a radio, turn signals and the basics...

About the corrosion:
I'm out here in Nevada. There's no sign of corrosion on anything, but yes...Tomorrow I will check every power and ground wire for that and also cracked wiring.

A few other things:
These "inline fuses" that are running from the battery - Are they even necessary or can I just do away with them and hardwire it in?

One weird thing I noticed tonight - The lights still shimmer very faintly EVEN when it's just on BATTERY POWER WITHOUT the engine even running!!! Wth is that? I've never seen anything like this!!
I'm going to check the voltage regulator tomorrow as well. It's a brand new battery and a brand new alternator. This thing should be charging! But I'll post testing results tomorrow when I wake up.
I'll be honest, it's pissing me off so much that I just want to gut all the wiring and rewire the whole damned car. It saved me A LOT of headaches with my Jaguar.
Author:  wjajr [ Mon Dec 20, 2010 6:32 am ]
Post subject: 
Even though nothing rusts out where you are, electrical things have their own gremlins with corrosion when dissimilar metals are in contact with each other. Most of the under hood electrical connections are not very weather tight, and if at some point in time, the engine bay was pressure washed, or degreased with gunk like surfactants, the copper will be corroded. The bulkhead connector is a prime spot for corrosion problems, as is the ground connections to the body at the headlights.

You should have a braded grounding conductor connecting the head to the fire wall, Neg. battery to block, Neg. battery to front radiator support & head lights, and an extra ground loop to the Electronic Spark Control’s chassis. Clean and remake all these connections. Additional clean the headlight's feed sockets.

Also drop the headlight switch and check condition of all its connections. This switch can at times come in contact with water from fresh air vent, and windshield wiper pivot leakage, as well as the fuse block.
Author:  KBB_of_TMC [ Mon Dec 20, 2010 10:04 am ]
Post subject: 
I've seen electronic voltage regulators go partially & intermittently bad that gave symptoms similar to yours.

If the lights shimmer w/ the engine off, is the switch in ACC, ON, or OFF? If it does it only in ACC & ON and not OFF, maybe the voltage limiter's operation is causing the shimmer. If it shimmers in OFF, it has to be something still powered up (light delay timer, radio memory, etc.) or a bad connection. You may have to unplug some fuses and/or connects one at a time to isolate something drawing power.
Author:  olafla [ Mon Dec 20, 2010 1:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
The lights still shimmer very faintly EVEN when it's just on BATTERY POWER WITHOUT the engine even running!!!
You have some bad connections or a broken fusible link; remove the large ground wires between engine and body (on my car they are open, braided wires), use a steel brush or similar on all the contact surfaces on both wires and screw attachments. Check the fusible links by twisting/bending them carefully. Follow the wires from battery through every contact point until you reach the lights, and check for bad connections.
( If you don't find any, you may start rewiring the entire car!) 8)

You should definitely mount a relay to feed the lights, use the existing wires as trigger for the relay only.

Olaf.
Author:  Sam Powell [ Mon Dec 20, 2010 6:24 pm ]
Post subject: 
Absolutely do NOT remove any fuses or fusible links. Have you ever seen a car fire? YOu can see it for miles sometimes. That black smoke will rise 800 feet. There is tremendous power stored in that battery, which if shorted causes quick heat around a lot of combustible stuff. The fuses are there to blow when this happens.

Stick with this. It is very logical, and one step at a time will fix things. With the engine running, test the voltage at the alternator. Then trace the wires along from there until you see the voltage drop off. That will show you where your bad connection is. Chances are it is more than one place. Each removal of this high resistance connection will improve things. Keep going until the voltage at the high side of the ballast resistor shows only .5 v drop from the alternator voltage.

Sam
Author:  76valiant [ Tue Dec 21, 2010 12:19 am ]
Post subject: 
Well it's raining cats and dogs out here in Nevada, and of course it will continue to do so for the next two days which means that I can't do any testing until it dries up.

I bought a made in the US voltage regulator for $15 today at O' Rielly's and the lights are significantly brighter now. However when it does dry off, I will be doing testing from the alternator because I completely agree with you guys that there has to be a few bad connections.

I mean we're talking about a previous owner that thought a "Cosmetic upgrade" was to spray paint leather seats.

I'm still wondering if the fact I have the radio hardwired in from the battery is also contributing to this mess, but I can remember the lights shimmering long before I installed it.
I'll update this on Saturday since that's going to be my next available day. I am so grateful for all of your (youses..lol) help!
Lol and I'm not going to ditch the fuseable links...That's what I thought they were there for. It's been over 2 years since I worked on a vintage electrical system... ><
Author:  wjajr [ Tue Dec 21, 2010 6:11 am ]
Post subject: 
76valiant:
Quote:
I'm still wondering if the fact I have the radio hardwired in from the battery is also contributing to this mess
So disconnect the radio, and see if condition persists.
Author:  76valiant [ Tue Dec 21, 2010 12:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
I did that and it still did it.
Author:  Sam Powell [ Wed Dec 22, 2010 5:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
Has it stopped raining there yet? Have you tested anything? I looked at your link, and it looks like a nice car.

Sam
Author:  76valiant [ Fri Dec 24, 2010 12:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
Thanks! But it looks like a heap compared to your car! lol

I'm thinking about doing the Rustoleum Roll - On Paint Job in a few weeks..:P

Between working 2-10, the rain from Sunday to Wednesday and Christmas time, I haven't been able to do any testing yet. I noticed the car is running 300 times better ever since I put a new voltage regulator and switched to 89 octane. The acceleration is nice and smooth, the car warms up within 2 minutes and there's no misfiring.

I'll be doing testing on Saturday since it's my day off.
Page 1 of 2 All times are UTC-08:00
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited
https://www.phpbb.com/