| Slant Six Forum https://slantsix.org/forum/ |
|
| Pegged amp gage has me stumped https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=46195 |
Page 1 of 3 |
| Author: | wjajr [ Fri Sep 02, 2011 11:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | Pegged amp gage has me stumped |
Pegged amp gage has me stumped On a cold start normally amp gage moves 25% or so to right for a short time, and steadily returns to center of gage. During two recent cold starts, amp gage needle has been pegged hard to far right, idling engine is abnormally low, labored as if under load. First time this happened, condition self corrected in about 30 seconds. Second time I let it go for about 15 seconds, than shut down engine, and restarted engine where it pegged once again for a few seconds than gage needle snaps back to normal. Also while this pegging is happening, tachometer is giving false 2x actual reading with a drifting- floating needle from actual rpm, and false reading. Once over charge condition end, tachometer reads true. I installed a VR 1001 electronic voltage regulator two months ago along with new conductors. What would cause this heavy charging? A short in the voltage regulator/ coil feed circuit? I have a 0.1 ohm between battery & Voltage regulator, and 0.1 ohm between voltage regulator and alternator case so grounding of charging components’ is good. Bill A short in the voltage regulator/ coil feed circuit? I have a 0.1 ohm between battery & Voltage regulator, and 0.1 ohm between voltage regulator and alternator case so grounding of charging components’ is good. Bill |
|
| Author: | emsvitil [ Fri Sep 02, 2011 2:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Check the volts at the battery before starting. Then check the volts at the alternator and battery when it's happening. |
|
| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Fri Sep 02, 2011 2:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
One of my first guesses is a dead cell in the battery. How is the cranking speed? |
|
| Author: | wjajr [ Fri Sep 02, 2011 5:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Dan, It cranks up just fine, battery is two months old, a relic of chasing my tail diagnosing an over charging problem caused by tapping ignition circuit to run electric choke. You may recall it was a problem cured by one of Stern Lighting’s fine relays. Incidentally late this afternoon on a pizza run, I heard a funny noise/ tone from an unknown source, perhaps from under dash, or under hood—I don’t know, I don’t hear well, as I left the driveway, looked and amp gage was pegged again. It held for only a few seconds, returned to normal & noise ended, and then a few seconds later, a repeat performance. It did not act up again during my three mile foraging jaunt involving one restart at store. For those wondering, the pie was a large pepperoni with extra pepperoni, most excellent, and enough is left for my breakfast tomorrow! Mrs. Wjajr won’t eat pizza at any temperature for breakfast…LOL Battery is a Group 58, cranking amps = 675 Voltage across battery +/- is 13.2V Voltage across battery +/- after running headlights for two minutes = 12.64V I would love to check voltage, but event doesn’t last long enough to get out of car, hood up, and VOM leads onto battery etc.---or at least not yet. Bill |
|
| Author: | emsvitil [ Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Hook up the voltmeter and watch while your wife starts the car........... |
|
| Author: | wjajr [ Sat Sep 03, 2011 3:43 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
To get her into “that heap†as she “lovingly†calls it, I have to bribe her with trip to ice cream stand, or a special retail experience such as a trip to Wal-Mart on a sunny day… Ain’t gonnah happen, the ice cream and shopping biz that is, so I’ll just make a set of jumpers to extend reach of VOM leads so monitoring can be made from driver’s seat at start-up. This ‘over charge’ doesn’t happen every time, so far, only three times in the last 20 starts. It will be hit or miss. Bill |
|
| Author: | Slanted Opinion [ Sat Sep 03, 2011 4:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
This is going to be a tough one... as it is so intermittent. Troubleshooting intermittent electronics involves one of three methods: - Have test meters all hooked up and hope you can "catch" the problem in action. - Wiggling wires and tapping components (like the VR) to see if you can make the problem reoccur. - "Shotgunning" parts (blind replacement) to find the one that cures the problem. Assuming the bulkhead connector is in fine shape, I would start with the wiggling and tapping method. Failing that, try replacing the battery (especially if you have a good one laying around you can put in there... surely Mrs Wjajr won't miss hers!). Failing that... the regulator. - Mac |
|
| Author: | wjajr [ Sat Sep 03, 2011 6:13 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: This is going to be a tough one... as it is so intermittent
True.Quote: Wiggling wires and tapping components (like the VR) to see if you can make the problem reoccur.
Not sure taping method will work on electronic regulator, it seams to be one big chunk with its back sealed with some sort of gunk often found on electrical devices.Quote: "Shotgunning" parts (blind replacement) to find the one that cures the problem.
I thought about swapping with a mechanical regulator known to be working properly, and may do that after a few more malfunctions at which point I can hopefully capture a few voltage readings for a better understanding. This will have to take place later as we are out of town baby sitting newest grandchild today!Quote: Failing that, try replacing the battery (especially if you have a good one laying around you can put in there... surely Mrs Wjajr won't miss hers!). This car has the newest battery. But, what I can do, is stop by Battery's Plus for a quick test. |
|
| Author: | Jeb [ Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
My Duster one time did that, while I was driving through town. Turned out to be a bad voltage regulator. The power surge fried my tach though, and my radio. I popped the hood, unhooked the regulator and drove it back home. The alternator quit screaming at me also. |
|
| Author: | Slanted Opinion [ Sat Sep 03, 2011 8:58 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Yes, my bet is on the regulator as well. |
|
| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Come to think of it, faulty regulator ground should be checked for. |
|
| Author: | wjajr [ Sat Sep 03, 2011 6:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
For the hell of it I swapped back in the old mechanical voltage regulator, and connected two VOMs to remotely monitor battery voltage, and alternator output voltage from driver’s seat. All readings with hood open, ambient temperature 70*F. All grounds to spark control, voltage regulator, alternator case, and neg. battery terminal are equal resistance of 0.01 ohm. A: Cold start; amp gage acts normal, battery voltage + to - = 14.3V & alt to battery = 14.6 V, and amp gage reading half way between center line and full charge while feathering throttle for a few moments to let it settle into a normal in “park†idle of 1000 rpm. B: Turned on headlights before gage fully back to center line: At battery = 14.6 V, alt to battery = 15.3 V C: At 1500 rpm. Gage getting close to normal run position. Battery = 14.6 V, Alt to bat = 15.2 V D: Engine warmed up, 1500 rpm, battery = 15.5 V, alt to bat = 16.0V E: Engine warmed up, 1000 rpm, battery = 14.9 V, alt to bat =15.3 V Clearly mechanical voltage regulator needs adjusting ------------------------------------------------------------------------ I than reinstalled solid state regulator, and engine warmed up: A: Engine off, battery = 14.46 V, alt power lug to battery 13.4 V B: Engine at 1000 rpm battery = 14.9 V, alt to bat = 15.6 C: 2800 rpm battery = 14.6V, alt to bat = 15.08 V D: 1000 rpm headlights on battery 14.5 V, alt to bat = 15.08V Not at any time during all tests did amp gage peg to charge side of gage. One thing I did notice is the “Field post†on VR 1000 regulator was not locked down tightly by its locking nut, and second nut that clamps conductor to this stud was hard to turn as if it were cross threaded. I wonder if at some point I may have damaged the internal connection to the field terminal by twisting it too far? In other words, if regulator dose not see field because its wire is not connected, would alternator crank up the charge rate? Sunday I’m off to a car show, I’ll bring old regulator, and wrenches just in case I need to swap regulators. |
|
| Author: | 87D100 [ Sat Sep 03, 2011 6:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
You have too much voltage drop between the alternator and the battery. You should see no more than a 1/2volt difference, if its higher u have a bad connection, bad wire, etc. Checking this with an ohm meter will not work, an ohm meter does not run enough current through the circuit, look at it this way, if u put an ohm meter across the terminals of a light bulb it will have excellent continuity but u certainly can't put 60 amps of alternator current through that filament. I suspect a problem in the bulkhead connector. hope I was of some help Kevin P.S. my personal opinion is that amp gauges are a car fire waiting to happen, I eliminate them in favor of a volt gauge at all cost. |
|
| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Re-run your tests but each time you check engine-off battery voltage first drain off the surface charge by turning on the headlamps for 2 full minutes (engine off). If ammeters were a "fire waiting to happen", there wouldn't be any more pre-1990 Mopars on the road; they'd've all burned down years ago. |
|
| Author: | wjajr [ Sun Sep 04, 2011 2:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
This morning a fellow and his family met me at the house to drive to a car show 70 miles up the road. Damn Dart pined the gage again this morning with solid state regulator. There was no time to re install old mechanical regulator, and check bulkhead connector. Dart got left behind in the Man Cave, and “B Team†called up -- the ’82 LeBaron, and was placed into service with a twist of the green knob kill switch, a turn of the key, and we were off to the show. Tomorrow I shall investigate connections, even though I went through this drill few months ago, and correct any voltage drops that are found. Also follow Dan’s advice of burning off surface charge from battery before testing. I have to get this thing running right this week, as there is a big all Mopar show Saturday 10 that I want to take the Dart to. |
|
| Page 1 of 3 | All times are UTC-08:00 |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited https://www.phpbb.com/ |
|