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HEI trouble
https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=50252		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  turbocuda [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:34 pm ]
Post subject:  HEI trouble
Hi all. I switched to HEI a few years ago and the car ran great defiantly the best mod I've ever done for my car. However last year I finally pulled the engine and rebuilt it. I bought a new distributor and accel coil in which is what I had on it before. So I put the engine back in with new distributor and coil and hooked everything back up. Car won't start. So I take the module down to have it checked and sure enough its bad. So I buy a new one and install it on the car. Still won't start. So I go through the wiring for the HEI setup and make sure I hooked it back up right and everything is fine. No start. Engine turns but won't light off. So I take the module back down and had it checked. It works fine. Tested the distributor and the rotor turns when trying to start it. I tested to see what all components were getting juice and everything is, until you get to the side of the module that hooks to the distributor. The other side has fire but its not making it through to the other side to send down to the distributor. So there is no spark from what I can tell inside the distributor. I am baffled with this. Anyone know what's going on here?
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:02 pm ]
Post subject: 
Try a different coil?
Author:  turbocuda [ Fri Nov 09, 2012 8:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
Ok tried switching the coil out and that didn't help either. Anybody have any other ideas? Just doesn't make sense at all. Any other ideas appreciated.
Author:  Aggressive Ted [ Sat Nov 10, 2012 9:20 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Ok tried switching the coil out and that didn't help either. Anybody have any other ideas? Just doesn't make sense at all. Any other ideas appreciated.
If your not getting a good trigger signal, it won't run. Test the output of the distributor pickup coil inside the distributor. It should be from about 150 to 300 ohms to get a descent signal up to the HEI module. If it reads 0 ohms or very low ohms, you will have to replace it.
Author:  turbocuda [ Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
It would appear if I did it right that the reading was 336. A book I have says normal reading is between 150 and 900 ohms. So assume it's ok?
Author:  Joshie225 [ Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
Resistance is good to see if the pickup coil winding is good, but a failed coil is not the only way to get low output from the reluctor. If the air gap is too wide or the cranking RPM is too slow the output will be low. My HEI was sensitive to cranking speed. Probably voltage too as I was using a small battery. I'd pull the distributor, move the coil wire near a ground, turn the key on and spin the distributor to trigger the HEI module. Are you using a relay to provide battery voltage without the power going through the ignition switch and related wiring?
Author:  Mroldfart2u [ Sat Nov 10, 2012 11:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: HEI trouble
Quote:
So I put the engine back in with new distributor and coil and hooked everything back up. Car won't start.
Are you certain that you have the distributor connected to the module right? If you wired it with a keyed type connector that is a non issue, but if its just spade connectors etc you could have gotten them reversed, and it wont run. Usually no harm no fowl, just no start.
Quote:
I tested to see what all components were getting juice and everything is, until you get to the side of the module that hooks to the distributorThe other side has fire but its not making it through to the other side to send down to the distributor..
I have no idea because i have never checked to see if the module "passes" voltage without it being triggered by the distibutor. I could go stick a bat in my big car ('77 Newport) and check it. (did the hei to dump the non operational Lean Burn)
Quote:
So there is no spark from what I can tell inside the distributor. I am baffled with this. Anyone know what's going on here?
There is no 'spark' inside an electronic style distributor, its Hall Effect, or something like that ;), no electro/mechanical CONNECTION like a points dist. Did you get a read out from the test on your module? or did they just tell you it passed?


On another note make sure the gap in the dist is set correctly, usually around 0.008 or something like that, others will know for sure
Author:  turbocuda [ Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:18 pm ]
Post subject: 
I've gone through the wiring diagram and everything looks to be where it should. We have a spark plug wire off with a screwdriver in it to check for spark while cranking and there's nothing. For some reason there's no fuel either so have to figure that out too.the car sat for a year so I'm wondering if the gas evaporated in the tank. Wasn't a lot in it when I parked it I don't believe. I don't think they gave us the reading they just tested it and said it was good. Its Select brand and I'm wondering if that's the brand that gave me so much trouble with the ecu units for stock electronic ignition, if so that might be part of it but it tested ok. The air gap is something I thought of also. But the issue is that while cranking there's power from the coil side of the module but it's not going through the otherside of the module to send power to the distributor. The power just stops on the coil side and goes no further. It makes so sense at all. That sounds like a defective module but it tested as working right.
Author:  turbocuda [ Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
And josh no I don't have a relay on it. I drove the car for 2 years or so and never had one on it. Not saying anything bad about relays just that the car ran fine before without it so it shouldn't be preventing it from working now.
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
Put it on a relay.
Author:  Joshie225 [ Mon Nov 12, 2012 11:38 am ]
Post subject: 
Power does NOT go through the module to the distributor. The distributor provides an electrical signal TO the module. This signal happens when we desire a spark. This signal commands the module to switch the coil current off (just like when the points open) causing the coil's magnetic field to collapse across the secondary winding, inducing voltage into the secondary winding.

Use the coil wire when checking for spark. You get 6X the opportunity to see a spark and eliminate problems such as a burned distributor rotor.

Again, I would pull the distributor and spin it by hand with the ignition switched on to see if you have spark from the coil wire.
Author:  turbocuda [ Thu Nov 29, 2012 2:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
Ok guys little update. I put the old distributor in and now I have spark. Not sure what's wrong with the new one but I'm going to see if I can see exchange it. Car needs some new gas since it's a year old and timing needs to be rechecked. Can the air gap in the distributor be far enough out that it prevents spark? Need to check the gap but don't have a brass feeler gauge. Have to get one or borrow one. Also does anyone know why there's water coming out of the center intake bolt hole?
Author:  JCAllison [ Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
If the air gap is too wide or the cranking RPM is too slow the output will be low.
Hey Mr. JS,
Have been working on getting an a Proper&Correct Autolite 4100 Carburetor installed on Ms. American 3.14159, and haven't been dealing with Lorrie Van Haul for about about a month, but before the Carburetor install, Lorrie had quit starting. Nothing that was done has gotten her to run.

She was just fine. Drove her one day, brought her home, parked her, and went out the next morning, and she wouldn't start and hasn't run since.

Everything checks out. Spark Plugs fire when taken out, put back into the Spark Plug Lead, and laid on a ground source, so the HEI conversion is functional. BUT when all the Plugs are put back in, even when a shot of Start Fluid won't even make her cough.

This slow cranking thing is of interest as it might be what is wrong.

JC
Author:  64ragtop [ Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Ok guys little update. I put the old distributor in and now I have spark....Can the air gap in the distributor be far enough out that it prevents spark? Need to check the gap but don't have a brass feeler gauge. Have to get one or borrow one....
I have used a plain ordinary business card successfully on several occasions. They seem to run closer to .010, but that's been "close enough" for my needs.

Maybe someday I'll buy a brass .080 feeler gauge to add to my growing tool mountain. Whatever you use to get that gap "close enough", don't forget to check each reluctor node to the pickup, and check the dizzy shaft for sideplay.

ATB

BC
Author:  DonPal [ Sat Dec 01, 2012 3:14 am ]
Post subject: 
Would you have an old IBM card? Mine are .007 thick & have successfully used them in the past to set the gap.
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