| Slant Six Forum https://slantsix.org/forum/ |
|
| Steering Gear Attaching Bolts Keep Loosening https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=57130 |
Page 1 of 1 |
| Author: | 63valconvert [ Thu Feb 19, 2015 8:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Steering Gear Attaching Bolts Keep Loosening |
Recently, I scared my original mechanic, who discovered that, basically, one of the mounting bolts for my manual steering gear had come loose and had fallen out! So whenever I steered the car, the ENTIRE gear box moved. The result was I ended up finding my new "heavy work" mechanic, who spent much of his teens working on Dodges. He added a new bolt, aligned the steering, and it was tight again. Sadly, after less than 200 miles, it's loose again. He's curious if the original bolt had some kind of "shoulder" on it. Because, with repeated use, the thing almost always loosens itself. Today, I had the absolutely absurd luck of finding, and removing, a power steering gear box and pump from a 65 Dart in a local parts yard. This box had regular bolts (threaded to the top), but had large lock washers for which a space was cut into the gear box so that it would stay tight. Looking at my gear box, I don't see this "cut in" area for a lock washer. I'm curious as to how to keep the gear tightly attached. Anyone have this issue before? |
|
| Author: | DusterIdiot [ Thu Feb 19, 2015 8:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | So... |
Why not use Thread locker Red on all 3 bolts? |
|
| Author: | Pierre [ Thu Feb 19, 2015 10:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Also a couple of things to keep an eye on. Make sure the box is sitting flush to the frame. Sometimes they need to be nudged a bit this way or that so it situates. Also check the female threads in the frame. I believe there's a nut welded to the backside. If it's worn or damaged this is inevitable and will have to be repaired (enough meat for a thread insert?) or replaced. I don't see how a recess for the washer in the box will keep the bolt from turning. It may help align things laterally but that's about it I imagine. If your going to use thread locker - run a tap through the frame and die through the bolts then spray them down well with brake cleaner to make sure they are squeaky clean. Hit 'em with a propane torch if you ever have to remove them next time. |
|
| Author: | nm9stheham [ Fri Feb 20, 2015 7:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Any rust around that area? It is possible that the sleeves inside the frame that allow the bolts to the be torqued down have rusted and are not holding the frame sides from moving and the bolts can't keep the torque. |
|
| Author: | bcschief [ Fri Feb 20, 2015 7:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Didn't they change the size of the mounting bolts for the steering gears in the 60s Maybe this is the problem early box in a later car ? Brian |
|
| Author: | 63valconvert [ Fri Feb 20, 2015 9:48 am ] |
| Post subject: | Upon further investigation... |
It does look like there is a very slight shoulder on the bolt. As in, NOT threaded right up to the top. My bad, but once I tried cleaning what I THOUGHT was grease, I realized that the bolt was probably just right (so as to allow zero movement. |
|
| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Fri Feb 20, 2015 5:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: Didn't they change the size of the mounting bolts for the steering gears in the 60s Maybe this is the problem early box in a later car ?
Steering gearbox interchange is '62-'72 A- and B-body.
|
|
| Author: | SlantSixDan [ Fri Feb 20, 2015 5:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Bolts like these ones? |
|
| Author: | 63valconvert [ Sat Feb 21, 2015 11:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Wow. Very, very cool. Hard to believe they make these! |
|
| Author: | '67 Dart 270 [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 10:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | steering box bolts |
I just changed my K frame yesterday and installed a new steering box. The old bolts (with the tall heads) had been torqued down good, none were loose but one had a really thick washer that didn't seat in the recess at the hole, so the bolt was really bent. I replaced with grade 8 bolts/lock washers and tightened them good; I didn't use any thread locker, but neither did they have it previously and they were snug with just lock washers. Q: what is the torque spec for these bolts? I've read differing numbers, everything from 70 lb-ft to 120 lb-ft (that latter number seems high to me). I can double check with my torque wrench if I got them tight enough (or too tight, I was feeling strong yesterday). thanks, Brian |
|
| Author: | DusterIdiot [ Mon Feb 23, 2015 5:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | It's... |
Quote: Q: what is the torque spec for these bolts? I've read differing numbers, everything from 70 lb-ft to 120 lb-ft (that latter number seems high to me). I can double check with my torque wrench if I got them tight enough (or too tight, I was feeling strong yesterday).
Split the difference...by the end of the A-body era, the 1976 Manual states to torque those bolts to 100 ft/lbs...
|
|
| Author: | '67 Dart 270 [ Tue Feb 24, 2015 10:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Ok, |
100 is a nice number, thanks. |
|
| Author: | 63valconvert [ Thu Mar 12, 2015 11:33 am ] |
| Post subject: | Resulting Repair |
So... turns out the reason why the gear moved all the time was because of the fact it had been loose before, and the force used to steer actually widened the mounting holes on the gear itself!!!! So whenever you steered the car, the box moved as well! Yesterday, a mechanic buddy and me spent all day removing the gear (UGH), drilling out the gear so we could put a snug sleeve in the hole (while still using the same bolts), and then putting everything back. At first, there was STILL movement, so my buddy fabbed up some square washers that square up against the frame, and FINALLY, we're sturdy. Probably saved about $400 on a new gearbox, but on the other hand, this battle of Man vs. Dodge was a little too much for me. Not something I would want to do again! |
|
| Author: | Pierre [ Thu Mar 12, 2015 11:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I'm glad all is well for you, but something doesn't add up. Even if the holes were ovaled out a bit the clamping force of the washer/bolt would still hold it in place if they were able to get tight enough. |
|
| Author: | 63valconvert [ Fri Mar 20, 2015 11:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | If you buy a Dodge, you'd better have a garage. |
Quote: I'm glad all is well for you, but something doesn't add up. Even if the holes were ovaled out a bit the clamping force of the washer/bolt would still hold it in place if they were able to get tight enough.
Yep, one might think so, but reality said otherwise. Believe me, if it can be weird, and it seems possible, it's happened to this Dodge! |
|
| Page 1 of 1 | All times are UTC-07:00 |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited https://www.phpbb.com/ |
|