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 Post subject: Initial timing confusion
PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:21 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber

Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 9:27 pm
Posts: 99
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I got my engine back together and had the cam timed for me so it runs finally but not well, It lacks guts. The more I drove it the worse it performed until it developed a bad miss at idle. So I started checking things like loose bolts and found quite a few, even a head bolt was loose. Then I played with the distributor to see if I could better performance out of it and at first it liked the timing all the way advanced but this drove idle speed down. The pedal wasn't very responsive and even quit on me while trying to nail it from a dead stop but on the higher end it pulled better. So I tried adjusting it again later and it seemed to like the distributor set right in the middle. This raised idle speed and vacuum and was and instant responder and wow did it have low end power but was gutless outside of that. So I suspected the valves needed to be looked at so I check them the other day and sure enough the exhaust valves were way too tight and the intakes were loose.

I have a comp cam in here and it calls for .010 and .012 so the exhausts were probably in the .008 or so. So I'm thinkin hey here's my problem this should fix it. I was wrong. As soon as I adjusted those exhaust valves the car ran rougher and at lower idle. Doesn't make any sense to me at all. So I thought ok maybe the engine wants the distributor in a different place now that the valves are set correctly. So played with that and it doesn't seem to like anywhere I move the distributor. The engine has all remflex gaskets and my vacuum gauge doesn't have the slightest move to it so I'm pretty sure a vacuum leak isn't my problem. Now the engine has the same problem it did before where the pedal isn't very responsive and has died on me while trying to smash the pedal from a stop. I checked the plugs before the valve adjustment and they were black and sooty with the back of the electrode being white or yellow. I found a grounding issue with my EI and it seemed to help when I drove it last. Haven't checked the plugs yet to see if it changed.

My understanding is moving the distributor up is advancing it and moving down is retarding it but shouldn't advancing it raise the idle speed? If I move it up the idle speed drops and goes up if I go down with it. I now have a new issue with what sounds like rocks or bolts being flung around at idle. Can't tell exactly where it's coming from. I checked the flexplate to converter bolts and they were fine. Could be flexplate to crank bolts I guess. Here's the kicker: doesn't do it in gear. In park or neutral it makes that noise but any drive gear it doesnt. Ive tried putting it in drive and foot braking it to get the rpms up to idle speed and it still doesn't make the noise so I know it's not rpms that are the cause. I drove it around yesterday and even did some full throttle runs and it didn't make the noise until I either hit the brakes or maybe went around a turn.

Checked tranny fluid and it looks normal. No flakes or weird smells or odd color.
Engine oil needs to be changed but has plenty of oil in it. Matter of fact it had a half quart too much in it which you would think would drive my oil pressure up but it had no affect on it. I'm not impressed with my oil pressure either. Or my vacuum. Before u rebuilt the engine if I tuned the engine and got the most vacuum out of it, it would idle in the 24 or 25 range in park and go down to about 20 in drive. Now it idles about 20 and once it's in gear it's around 15 or 10 depending. It's got the 264s cam which I get is a bigger cam but vacuum shouldn't be this low. It's acting like the almost .500 lift cam in my Father's car which does have lower vacuum but that makes sense. Any ideas anyone?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 12:56 pm 
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TBI Slant 6
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Joined: Tue Jul 28, 2009 3:45 am
Posts: 123
Location: Springfield, Nebraska
Car Model:
I think we could use some more info on your whole setup. Need specifics like how much compression, what carb and what exhaust and intake system is being used. Unless I missed the specs of your setup on another thread, it is hard to take a stab at the advice without more info.I dont know about comp cams recommendations about valve clearance but I am sure that .012 is not enough clearance for the exhaust valves. I always thought that the recommended clearance on a solid lifter engine was .010 for the intake and .020 for the exhaust {maybe .018}. I believe that is what is recommended on this site. Yes the vacuum is gonna suffer with the bigger cam and advancing the distributer should indeed raise the rpm. Too much oil does not raise the oil pressure but in fact will lower the pressure IF the crank is "whipping " the oil into a froth. This causes air to be mixed into the oil which is not good on any engine but I dont think a half quart would make any difference, but, just drain a bit out. I think you should consider the engine as a whole, you cant just throw a bigger cam into the thing and expect things to all work together as one. Bigger cams need specific changes to be made as to compliment the cam. Increase the copmpression ratio, major carb tuning and on and on. And yes a bigger cam can make the thing into a real "slug" on the street. I dont know what carb is on it though but certain stock carbs do not do well with ANY changes {Holley 1920}. So more tweaking is in order. I am not a fan of the Comp Cams for a slant engine.

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225, NP435, 9 1/4, Dana 44

The Good Life.


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 Post subject: It's...
PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 6:01 pm 
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Board Sponsor
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Joined: Tue Oct 29, 2002 8:27 pm
Posts: 9714
Location: Salem, OR
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Quote:
I dont know about comp cams recommendations about valve clearance but I am sure that .012 is not enough clearance for the exhaust valves.
That is the standard lash for the 252 cam and is that tight because it is a chevy lobe...typically users find that the lash after break in and some miles is better about .014-.016....I think he's using the 264
Quote:
I always thought that the recommended clearance on a solid lifter engine was .010 for the intake and .020 for the exhaust
Only on the stock mechanical cam shaft, does not apply on the aftermarket cams unless it's a regrind of the original OEM cam.
Quote:
vacuum is gonna suffer with the bigger cam
Typically, but if it's a comp the overlap is tight and the duration is just a tad over stock the 252 would be OK in a stock CR engine...but these cams do much better with a 9:1 SCR vs. the stock cam. I think one of his last posts was a 264 with a 2 barrel and working toward adding the turbo, so lack of compression will make the NA engine lacking until the turbo can be the "adder" to the mix.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jul 18, 2015 4:24 pm 
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Turbo Slant 6

Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2011 12:58 pm
Posts: 569
Location: New Jersey USA
Car Model:
Besides the specifics of your current setup, what are your manifold vacuum readings, ignition timing (degrees), & engine cylinder compression?

On your distributor, rotating the housing clockwise will retard base timing, while going counter-clockwise will advance it.

_________________
63 Valiant Wagon
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