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Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s
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Author:  Slant 6 #6 [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:42 am ]
Post subject:  Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Hey all, you guys who have owned Chrysler flathead 6s and slant 6s some topic of debate for yah.
How do you find these engines compare to each other?
Some believe a 265 flathead 6 stock has a lot more power than a 225 slant 6 stock.
Now there 2 different animals for sure.
I have often pondered installing my 225 Slant Six with A833 overdrive trans into my 1955 Fargo pickup which weighs about 3300lbs.
In fact 1 local old Hotrod buddy would like to see me do just that.
My flathead buddies think the 265 hopped up has more grunt than a mildly hopped up slant 6, Im not so sure about that.

Author:  64 Convert [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

I've owned and driven many of each, but opinions vary.

My first three cars were Plymouth flathead sixes. Being young and stupid, I did everything I could to destroy them, but they were tough. All would peg the 100 mph speedometer, but I have no idea what the actual speed was. While drag racing friends with their OHV sixes, I would always get beat off the line. but the way the transmissions were geared, I could run with or ahead of any of them once I started to wind out in second gear, so performance was comparable, as was fuel efficiency. The feature that outclassed the Ford and GM sixes was the smooth, quiet performance. They cruised easily at the speed limit and never felt like the engine was overworking. They were by far the smoothest running cars I ever owned.

FWIW, I sold my '48 Plymouth to a friend who lost it when a tornado dropped a garage on the back half. The body couldn't be repaired, and he decided to see how much abuse the engine would take. He put it in neutral and placed a rock on the accelerator. We watched it for a while before we got bored and walked away. It was over an hour later that we heard a noise from the garage rubble that told us it finally blew. Kids are indeed stupid.

My first slant six was a '63 Signet hardtop with a 225 and automatic. I drove it hard and street raced all kinds of cars. I could run away from any similarly equipped OHV Ford or GM of similar age. I never broke a slant from abuse, but I have seen a few with vent holes in the side of the block when over-revved. When I was selling Plymouths in '64, we had a V200 four-door demo with a 225 and a four-speed that our sales manager liked to race against small block V-8s of any make...and he beat a lot of them.

The slant six car in totally stock form would probably perform better than the flathead in the same car, so I agree that the transmission has much to do with perceived performance superiority. In my opinion, both were better than their competition in every way, and I would love to have a car with either engine and a better geared transmission than what they had from the factory.

Author:  Greg Ondayko [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Any stock slant 6 that I have driven tuned correctly / carb / valves / points / timing is seat of the pants faster than the OE 1936's that I have driven of my dad's..
He has 2 Bone stock 1936's one s a truck and one is the D2 Sedan. Of course by 1959 flathead's could be another matter.


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Author:  Slant 6 #6 [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Quote:
I've owned and driven many of each, but opinions vary.

My first three cars were Plymouth flathead sixes. Being young and stupid, I did everything I could to destroy them, but they were tough. All would peg the 100 mph speedometer, but I have no idea what the actual speed was. While drag racing friends with their OHV sixes, I would always get beat off the line. but the way the transmissions were geared, I could run with or ahead of any of them once I started to wind out in second gear, so performance was comparable, as was fuel efficiency. The feature that outclassed the Ford and GM sixes was the smooth, quiet performance. They cruised easily at the speed limit and never felt like the engine was overworking. They were by far the smoothest running cars I ever owned.

FWIW, I sold my '48 Plymouth to a friend who lost it when a tornado dropped a garage on the back half. The body couldn't be repaired, and he decided to see how much abuse the engine would take. He put it in neutral and placed a rock on the accelerator. We watched it for a while before we got bored and walked away. It was over an hour later that we heard a noise from the garage rubble that told us it finally blew. Kids are indeed stupid.

My first slant six was a '63 Signet hardtop with a 225 and automatic. I drove it hard and street raced all kinds of cars. I could run away from any similarly equipped OHV Ford or GM of similar age. I never broke a slant from abuse, but I have seen a few with vent holes in the side of the block when over-revved. When I was selling Plymouths in '64, we had a V200 four-door demo with a 225 and a four-speed that our sales manager liked to race against small block V-8s of any make...and he beat a lot of them.

The slant six car in totally stock form would probably perform better than the flathead in the same car, so I agree that the transmission has much to do with perceived performance superiority. In my opinion, both were better than their competition in every way, and I would love to have a car with either engine and a better geared transmission than what they had from the factory.
Thanx enjoyed your sharing on this topic.
Ive owned a few flathead powered vehicles, usually with tired engines so not the fastest outta the gate. Ive owned a few slant6 powered vehicles and not suoer powers either but a little more umph than my flathead stuff.
These days running a 228 long flathead 6 with dual carters and tru split exhaust. 4 spd truck trans and 3.23 Mopar 8 1/4 diff. Truck is a 108 wb shorty and weighs approx 3300lbs.
This engine is tired and its no ball of fire. Strong headwinds and your flooring it to keep her at 65 mph.
1 of my buddys thought my 1971 225 slant and A833 4sp trans would be a better powerplant. Of course it would have headers and either a 2 bbl carb or 4bbl intake and carb.
1971 225 is rated at 145 hp, think that is majorly inflated though.
I love slant 6s and love flatheads too...

Author:  Slant 6 #6 [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 12:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Quote:
Any stock slant 6 that I have driven tuned correctly / carb / valves / points / timing is seat of the pants faster than the OE 1936's that I have driven of my dad's..
He has 2 Bone stock 1936's one s a truck and one is the D2 Sedan. Of course by 1959 flathead's could be another matter.


Image
Of course the little 201 is nothing compared to a Slant6 or a later 230 251 or especially 265.
But the Slant6 is rated 6 outta top 10 best engines in world. Must be a reason...

Author:  GregCon [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 4:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

I'd leave it a Flathead. If it's tired, rebuild it. It's not as 'good' of an engine but the world doesn't need yet another old vehicle getting its engine swapped.

Author:  drgonzo [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 4:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Quote:
I'd leave it a Flathead. If it's tired, rebuild it. It's not as 'good' of an engine but the world doesn't need yet another old vehicle getting its engine swapped.
Agreed. At least no one mentioned an LS. :mrgreen:

Author:  Slant 6 #6 [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 5:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Quote:
I'd leave it a Flathead. If it's tired, rebuild it. It's not as 'good' of an engine but the world doesn't need yet another old vehicle getting its engine swapped.
Well im not building a 228 it will be a 265 with hotter cam 9 to 1 compression dual carbs and headers.
Probably 150 to 175 hp out of it...

Author:  drgonzo [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 5:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Pics or...... :mrgreen:

Author:  emsvitil [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 6:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Can you get to 9 to 1 with a flat-head?

Doesn't airflow reduce thru the flat portion of the combustion chamber if you go to high on compression?

Author:  Slant 6 #6 [ Sun Mar 22, 2020 6:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Quote:
Can you get to 9 to 1 with a flat-head?

Doesn't airflow reduce thru the flat portion of the combustion chamber if you go to high on compression?
You can go higher with an EDGY aluminum or Edmunds style head. Even with a major cam lift increase it can be done.

Author:  Tim Keith [ Mon Mar 23, 2020 12:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Quote:
Can you get to 9 to 1 with a flat-head?

Doesn't airflow reduce thru the flat portion of the combustion chamber if you go to high on compression?
In '57 there was a option for a high compression 230 that also had a BBD two barrel that was rated at 132 hp. You can increase the compression more that that OEM head, but in my opinion, the problem will be the head gasket. Flatheads are thermally inefficient, one side of the cylinder is very hot, the other cooler. High compression is tough on head gaskets - six bolts around each cylinder. The short ports flow reasonably well. The heat of the exhaust valve tends to "coke" the oil in the ring lands, broken rings and lands are common in high mileage L-heads, the synthetic oil helps. I know someone who claims more than 200,000 miles on a 218 that he built years ago - probably due to the better motor oils.

I have two unassembled 265s and a couple built 230s and a Desoto 237. They're good motors that won't let you down. They were admired for long service life and easy maintenance. A 265 probably has better torque than a 225. They were the standard motor when the first gen Hemis became an option.

Author:  Slant 6 #6 [ Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Yes by the late 1950s the 230 with more compression, cam profile changes and 2 bbl carbs were listed at 132 hp.
I think this was quite liberal about as liberal as a 145 hp 226 slant 6, I could be wrong though...lol
In the mid 50s the 265 for big trucks was rated at 136 hp with dual carbs and exhaust option. The 250 in the 1960s was rated at 120 hp.
On raising compression you can go a ways before head gaskets become an issue to gain max performance too going to .080 is not a problem generally..
The main features on slants I like are, 6 intake ports, OHV design, huge main bearings, spin on full flow oil filter and more potential for big power too. 265 features i like, long stroke big torque, forged balanced cranks, full pressure piling, bearing inserts, can bore to .080 and beyond to max .125 for a 283 ci displacement.
On miles, many a cab went beyond the norm. Rebuilding you go to modern 3 ring pistons.
George Asche the Dutra of Chrysler Flatheads has over 200k on 2nd engines in his 51 Plymouth and 29 Desoto.
The 29 desoto with 265 with tri carbs hit 142 mph at flying mile in Daytona in 1954.
George is still building flathead engines to this day, he turned 88 recently.
He runs synthetic oil in his flatheads too.

Author:  GregCon [ Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

The beauty of a Flathead, to me, lies in it's simplicity and lack of fanfare.

The simplicity part needs no explanation.

The lack of fanfare...means they run without a lot of noise or commotion and are very docile engines. That's what you get when you have a fairly heavy, cast iron engine with low output. So hot rodding one with high compression, cam, carb, etc. is kinda counter to its nature. It's like when you see the guy who's slammed his dually on the ground or added a snow plow to his Ferrari.

One time, one of my kids asked, "What is trail mix made out of....? M&M's and whole lot of disappointment!"

That's a flathead to me....the more 'stuff' you do, the more disappointment you get. Just enjoy the M&M's.

Author:  Slant 6 #6 [ Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Slant 6 versus Flathead 6s

Quote:
The beauty of a Flathead, to me, lies in it's simplicity and lack of fanfare.

The simplicity part needs no explanation.

The lack of fanfare...means they run without a lot of noise or commotion and are very docile engines. That's what you get when you have a fairly heavy, cast iron engine with low output. So hot rodding one with high compression, cam, carb, etc. is kinda counter to its nature. It's like when you see the guy who's slammed his dually on the ground or added a snow plow to his Ferrari.

One time, one of my kids asked, "What is trail mix made out of....? M&M's and whole lot of disappointment!"

That's a flathead to me....the more 'stuff' you do, the more disappointment you get. Just enjoy the M&M's.
What on earth are you talking about?
Have a looksy, then reconsider your post
https://youtu.be/DVsGYDcWUPI
https://youtu.be/VZxLcnfJq5w

https://youtu.be/CpyQpdc7LB8

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