If it is rebuilt it would have to say it on the box. Chances are if it's cheap, it's rebuilt. You'd be amazed at how new you can make something look with a bead blaster and a can of cast iron spray paint.
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| Are auto parts store clutches new or used? https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9727 |
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| Author: | Tim_K [ Fri Jul 02, 2004 10:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Are auto parts store clutches new or used? |
If I went to Advance Auto Parts and bought a 10 inch heavy duty Dodge truck clutch for my Slant Six, would the parts be new or used? I'd be most concerned about the pressure plate ring. I can't see how they'd consider reusing old parts for that. I've seen them, and they look too clean and perfect to be used parts. I know that disc brake pads are not rebuilt, at least according to the genuises behind the counter at Advance. |
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| Author: | slantzilla [ Fri Jul 02, 2004 4:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
If it is rebuilt it would have to say it on the box. Chances are if it's cheap, it's rebuilt. You'd be amazed at how new you can make something look with a bead blaster and a can of cast iron spray paint.
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| Author: | DusterIdiot [ Fri Jul 02, 2004 6:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Heh... |
Ott's in Portland can take your old brake pads, and clutch discs and resurface them like new (re: remanf...) for about the price of a remanf over the counter, oddly they also can respring the disc and or pressure plate if needed too... So far all the 9 1/4" I've got from NAPA are new, haven't tryed to get a 10" yet...but I'm sure I'll have to swap soon enough... -D.Idiot |
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| Author: | Dartvader [ Fri Jul 02, 2004 7:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Let me pass along what Red,(Jack's father in law) of Mclead clutches says about slant six clutches. The smaller pressure plates, 9 1/4", can be had new. For some reason, no one makes the heavy duty 10" unit new anymore, so all the 10" ones are rebuilt. For stock applications, there is probably nothing dangerous about them. For a built motor, the 10" is likely still OK, but there is the possibility of faiilure. Here is what Red is working on. He has Jack's bell housing, and is mocking up a new, steel slant flywheel with a Buick pressure plate to see if it will clear Jack's bell housing. If it does, you can order a new steel flywheel from Mclead, with special dual pattern for the pressure plate to put in either a stock slant PP or a new 10" Buick pressure plate. If it does not clear the bell housing, then we have to look at other alternatives for a new performance clutch package. e will know soon. Here are some questions that are relevant: 1. Will the later model slant bell housing from the Volare and Aspen accomodate a bigger clutch than the older single pattern four speed bellhousings? 2. Does the bigger truck slant six bellhousing accomodate the standard 833 tranny bolt pattern? If either of these things is true, then we have another possible option from Mcloud even if Jack's bell housing is too tight. I don;t know what bell housing he gave Red to try,but his car is a '64. Where does one get a truck slant bellhousing? I had one once which was entirely different. It took a tranny with a different bolt pattern from an 833 tranny. I sold it, and picked up the volare bellhousing instead. If you use the truck bellhousing, what years and models are useful? DI you are on here............. |
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| Author: | sixty4dartgt [ Fri Jul 02, 2004 9:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I haven't got an update from Red yet. I think if the clutch does not fit, he will make it fit by changing the pressure plate housing or trimming it down (like in Doug's article). My bell housing is original and I have a non OD tranny. I believe that the search for a truck bell housing may not be necessary as he is going to make an adapter to fit the engine. Are all of the engine bolt up paterns are the same? Of course this will allow not only a non OD AND OD 4 speed to bolt up, but also a 5 or 6 speed (with the proper bell housing). He already has similar "adapter rings" for Chevy and Ford V-8s (but who cares about that  )This is still experimental and I will be setting up the "stock" assembly (mild build up) and hopefully something can be set up for Dartvader soon Sam - I am his SON in law (weak Star Wars joke) I want to have that turbo smokin' some V-8s 
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| Author: | DusterIdiot [ Fri Jul 02, 2004 10:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Fyi.... |
Dart, The OD tranny bellhousing for slant trucks is the same as the car version, and the 1975+ unit was built with housing the 10" clutch for 'police and taxi' service in mind. The later truck OD bellhousings use a ball stud for the clutch fork in stead of the 'slot' style retainer. THe HD application with the 11" clutch was available (boy is that thing is a mammoth and not fun to pull out of junkyard trucks...). I've seen it with two styles of bolt patterns: A-833 and the 'rock crusher' granny 4 speed (NP435?). I have access to a 1964 sweptline at my father-in-law's with the HD 11" clutch mated to a truck A-833 (bellhousing and stuff will be 'stuffed away' when I get time to strip it, I will be using the A-833 gears to rebuild a grenaded A-body A-833 when time permits...). Lou I think runs one of these 11" units, but it'd be a tight fit in a car without some 'hammer tuning the tranny tunnel'. To remove the bellhousing you literally have to rotate the crank and pull the pressure plate first, then the fly wheel, then you can access the 3 bolts at the top of the engine mounting pattern inside the bellhousing with a long handled ratchet and short socket... I'll be going to a 10" clutch soon enough, I think if I were going to 'plunk' a load of money into a 'race clutch' I might just be tempted to use Andy's adaptor, use an SFI LA-pattern 'boom proof' bellhousing, and have a flywheel modified to use the LA race clutches/ see if the 11" flywheel is compatible with the more common mopar HP clutch types (no scalloped big block clutches thanks...) my 2 cents, and thanks for the informative post, -D.Idiot p.s. my hollander's says the 11" clutch was used in 225 /6 manual tranny applications in the mid to late 60's in the 'tuna boat' Dodge/Plymouth passenger cars (B/C body)... Hmmm...now that I left the post open and double checked the same pressure plate for the 11" clutch is interchangeable from 1967-1970 6 cyl passenger cars, and all 1969-1987 Dodge/Plymouth Trucks V-8 or 6 cyl... They also list two clutch disc for the 6 cyl apps and the 8 cyl apps, but both have 23 spline usge... so I'm not sure the difference between them (truck = HD material and different springs?) Brain hurts, going to bed now.... |
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| Author: | Rick Covalt [ Sat Jul 03, 2004 5:04 am ] |
| Post subject: | Clutch package |
For anyone who wants the part #again. We have already installed a high performance Flywheel , Clutch & pressure plate frm Mcleod. We have a dual pattern flywheel and Webber Pressure plate which was installed without any interference issues. It works and holds great. The total cost for everything including dual pattern flywheel was $535.The only thing I see different than what he is working on now is that our set-up is not quite 10" in diameter. 30# dual pattern flywheel (No part number) $300 Webber P.P. , 9 11/16" #360131 $135 Disc, Dual performance #260804 $110 Rick |
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| Author: | Dartvader [ Sat Jul 03, 2004 5:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Thanks Rick. That is a big help. What kind of power are you running through this clutch? |
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| Author: | Dartvader [ Sat Jul 03, 2004 5:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
DI, thanks for the info. Describe Andy's Adapter. What will it adapt to what? I would not be apposed to upgrading this 5 speed to a heavier unit. It is the 4.01:1 first gear t-5 that came out of a four banger. I used it because the input shaft was longer than the v-8 unit. However, I only paid $200 for it, and if a good alternative came along, I might spring for it eventually. |
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| Author: | slantzilla [ Sat Jul 03, 2004 5:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I have an aluminum adapter (and I think Rick does too) for putting the 340 scattershield and flywheel on a Slant. Then you can use a 10.5 clutch. The adapter was made by Mark Goodman and his gang (Team Green) in Carthage, MO and was not very expensive. They also got me a new Lakewood shield for about $30 less than Summit.
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| Author: | Dartvader [ Sat Jul 03, 2004 6:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Thanks Dennis. Does the adapter plate set the bellhousing back some? If so, it might move my tranny too far back to reach the input shaft pilot bearing. I have an adapter on the rear of the bellhousing, and it just barely reaches now. Also, is their room for the scatter shield without cutting up the tunnel? This is sort of a moot point, since I constructed a new cross member and reconstructed the tunnel entirely when I put the t-5 in. Here is another thought: Keisler was working on a slant six conversion for their Keisler 5 speed. One would think they would use the bigger flywheel and bellhousing. Maybe I should give them a call sometime soon. In the mean time, maybe I will just get the clutch Rick gave numbers for, and make serious upgrading a longer term project. |
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| Author: | Rick Covalt [ Sat Jul 03, 2004 9:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | Power?? |
Well let's see? How much power do we have?? If I were a chevy guy I'd say I must have 450 HP !!! But the reality is I don't know. Our engine is a .030 over 225, with Oversize valves, 600 4barrel and full length headers. The current cam is a .460 lift but we had a .528 mopar cam in until it failed. The car ran a 15.8 / @88 in full street trim and it spun very badly. I'd say it's a 15.0 car with a little traction. The car is actually my sons, and if you have ever had a 19 year old, you'll know that this set-up has been run pretty hard for about 10,000 miles. I do have one of the adapters that Mark made for me and it cost 75 plus materials if memory serves me correct. I eneded up with about $130 in mine, but I had some shipping because I sent Mark my Belhousing so he was sure it was right. He did a great job on it too. It does not set the tranny back much if any. That's because if you take off the block plate for the V-8 and put in the adapter they are about the same thickness. Then you can run any 10.5" clutch off a V-8. It does put your starter in the low V-8 position. Rick |
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| Author: | Dartvader [ Sat Jul 03, 2004 5:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Hi Rick. I have a few questions about your adapter plate. I don;t know what the "block plate" is you are removing. None of my engines have anything between the bellhousing and the block. Is this related to adapting a 518a auto to a slant? I know there is an adapter plate that will allow that. How thick is the adapter plate Mark made for you? Was it to install a v-8 bellhousing behind a slant? Is Mark still open for business on these adapters? What 11" flywheel will fit the slant crank? If I am thinking of buying a new flywheel, PP and clutch then maybe I need to explore all the options here before I send my money off. Thanks |
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| Author: | Dartvader [ Sat Jul 03, 2004 5:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Hi Again Rick. Are there two slants in your life now, or just one? It sounds like your son has a stock bellhousing since he has a 9 11/16" clutch. Is there another one with an adapter and the bigger flywheel? What tranny is behind that one? By the way, I live not too far from you. Let's arrange a get together sometime. At last, another slanter on the East coast. It seemed as if most of the slants were on the West coast or Midwest. Thanks again. |
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| Author: | Rick Covalt [ Sat Jul 03, 2004 10:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Block Plate |
On the blow proof Belhousing there is usually a steel plate that goes between the belhousing and the block and behind the flywheel. This protects your block in case of an explosion. Since this is between the belhousing and block the blowproof bell is a little shorter than a stock belhousing to make everything fit at the proper length. When Mark makes the Aluminum adapter (3/8" thick) you bolt that to the slant with special countersunk bolts he supplies and then you bolt the V-8 belhousing to the aluminum adapter plate. By leaving the steel block plate off you wind up with everything at just about the same position as stock. You can use any 10 1/2" flywheel except for the 360, and you have plenty of clutch & P.P. choices. You do need to elongate one hole on the flywheel as it is slightly off from the slant mounting pattern. To go to an 11" clutch is probably going to require a Big Block Belhousing and I really don't know if that would cause any tunnel clearance issues?? We do have 2 different cars. My sons is a 72 swinger using the clutch set-up from McLeod with a stock aluminum belhousing and 4-speed OD. tranny. My car is a 65 Valiant 2 dr. sedan that I am gathering parts to make a race car / hot street car. I plan on running the Adapter from Mark behind my car with a standard 833 4-speed. I just can't do the automatic thing yet! Theres nothing quite like shifting your own gears. This car is just a shell right now but I have a lot of the parts to get it going. Hopefully by next year at this time I'll be ready to go to the second Pittsburgh race. Vader, Are you going to Carlisle by any chance? I'll be there on Friday, Maybe we'll see you there? Rick PS. I can try to e-mail you a picture of the adapter if you would like. |
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