Well, Spring is here and I finally got some time away from other projects to spend with the Dart. I've been slowly getting the old girl back in good running order for the past two years (after sitting in an old man's garage for 20), but I'm as yet still baffled by one recurring problem. I get her out, drive her to the local car wash to scrub off the layer of storage dust, drive around the neighborhood a little and...dead stall, no start. Let her cool, she fires back up, hurry up and get her home before she stalls in the middle of another intersection.

'71 Dart, 225, 3spd. So far, I've:

1. Changed the entire fuel system, from tank to carb (new tank, sending unit, line, pump, filter and professionally--by a reputable local carb shop--rebuilt holley 1920)

2. Tuned up the ignition (new coil, wires, cap, rotor, resistor -- points are next, Pertronix on deck)


I've searched the forum archives and a valve adjustment is coming, as well as SlantSixDan's fuel line mod (got directions for both printed out and I'll get busy on them Saturday). In addition to points, anybody have any other ideas?

By the way, I don't think its exlusively a carb or timing issue because she starts, idles and runs nice...until hot it seems.

carry a test light in the car.


When she dies jump out and look down the carb wile you give the throddle a few pumps. If you see fuel being squirted down there you can rule out fuel.

Now stick the test lamp on the "plus" side of the coil. You should have voltage there with the key on and wile cranking.

To add to CrAlt's tests when not running, pull the center wire from the distributor cap and hold it near a ground, such as the engine block while someone cranks the engine. You should get a good spark.

It sure seems like you've covered the bases as far as trying to weed out typical causes. Have you ever pulled the fire wall connector apart and cleaned it? I recall many people have had mystery problems related to bad connections there. Another mystery stalling feature is sometimes related to the ignition switch being bad. Does the key switch have lots of slop?

Neither of the suggestions I've offered are very likely, but as I mentioned, you've gone over all the regulars. It should be easier to track the problem down once you've isolated it to either fuel or electrical.

Good luck

_________________
1980 Aspen 225 super six

Okay. I'm back.


So, I tried for an hour or so to adjust the valves (hot and running) as per the instructions I found in the forum archives (plus the Haynes manual, plus the Clymer manual, PLUS the factory manual -- by the way, the directions found here were the most user friendly) and I'm just not sure I got it. The adjusters were all good and tight and only one of the intake valves was chattering louder than the rest when I started. Went through 'em all anyway. I guess my first question is...how do I know if I have the right amount of drag on the feeler gauge? (They sure do make a lot of noise if you set them too loose.)

My best guess was to slide the gauge as evenly as possible while trying to compensate for the "opening" of the gap as I went....it felt like the gauge was dragging for the split second(s) while the gap was closed. Sort of. How can I be sure the feeler gauge isn't just moving when the gap was open? Know what I mean?

Alright, second question: Given that I was not positive the "hot" method was working, I thought "Well, ok, I can just wait 'till tomorrow when the engine's good and cooled down and at least see if I'm in the ballpark with a cold adjustment. After that, I can go back to hot." Now the problem. How do I manually turn the motor over to find TDC? I went looking for the bolt head on the damper and...what?!? Huh?? No bolt head. Just a skinny damper/pulley with a threaded hole. Do I just bump it with the starter and have a friend watch the rotor?


Finally, the third question. She's still stalling when hot. I'm adjusting away with the rockers humming along like a sewing machine and....stall. No sputter. No stumbling. Just shut right down. Let her sit for a 1/2 hour and she started right up.

I realize this could still be the valves but, I dunno.

The choke was wide open, getting fuel to the carb (would vapor lock prevent fuel spray at this moment?). I've got the rubber fuel line and metal filter for the fuel line mod. I've just got to go and get the IV flare fittings tomorrow (on this note, why do the mod instructions call for a 180 degree swivel fitting?).

Oh yeah, I also changed out all of the vacuum lines, checked their routing and changed the pcv valve, too.

Next on my list of suspects:

1. Possible vacuum leak in the vacuum advancer.

2. Check for current to the positive side of the coil when it happens, like CrAlt said. I didn't have my test light w/ me.

3. Overheating?

4. SlantSixRam's suggestions about the firewall connector. The ignition switch seems fine.

5. Call a priest cause she's got the devil in her.

I'll do the fuel line mod, coil current check and firewall connector check first thing tomorrow and post what I find.


Sorry so many questions. I'm kinda on my own here.

Educated guess. Lacking someone experienced to guide you, the education comes from the valve adjustment procedure: "Each time the valve opens, the feeler gauge will be clamped tightly between rocker and stem. While the valve is closed, you will be able to slide the gauge in and out. You want a slide-fit, which is tighter than a loose slip-fit, but looser than a tight friction fit."
The gauge should only move when the gap is open (valve is closed, rocker and spring relaxed). When the valve is open (spring compressed), the gauge will be clamped tightly and won't move. It's the gap-with-valve-closed-and-spring-relaxed that you are adjusting here.
This will likely result in a rougher/poorer adjustment than you've already achieved.
H'mmm. Interesting. And wouldn't restart until that 30 minutes had passed?
Likely not.
You want whatever fitting will point at the fuel pump, so you use a 90° fitting on a carb with a front fuel inlet (Carter BBS and BBD, Holley 1945), or a 180° (straight) fitting on a carb with a side fuel inlet (Holley 1920). The fuel pump gets a 90° fitting. P/Ns for both 90° and 180° fittings are in the how-to.
Check this, sure, but it's not causing stalling at idle
Yep, definitely. Also see if you can cause the engine to stall by heating up the ignition coil by means of a hair dryer set on "HOT" and aimed at the coil at close range as the engine idles. If you can, the coil's shorting internally when it heats up, and needs replacing. You can also just check for spark right after the engine stalls, by pulling the coil wire out of the centre distributor cap terminal and holding it near the engine block while a helper cranks the engine. If no spark, probably a coil that dies when hot.
Maybe and maybe not, but you would DEFINITELY know about it through other symptoms if the engine were getting hot enough to cause it to stall. There'd be a hot-metal smell and hot-metal sounds, boiling coolant, etc.

_________________
一期一会
Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.

It was X@$#%! vapor lock. Fuel line mod done and all seems well.



From another post: By the way, Pertronix P/N CH 161 works in pre-'72 distributors. There's just some extra parts. The proper P/N is 1361A if you'd like to avoid confusion (unlike me, apparently).


Thanks for the help.


You guys rule.

Good work getting the problem diagnosed and fixed. Onward and upward! More about your Pertronix mystery in the relevant thread in a moment.

_________________
一期一会
Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.