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 Post subject: Budget head and rockers
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:53 pm 
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TBI Slant 6

Joined: Fri May 30, 2003 4:32 pm
Posts: 131
Location: Northwest FL
Car Model:
I wanted an engine with a better flowing head and higher compression for power and economy but I want to spend as little as possible for machine work and parts seeing how I have very little money for engines and cars and such.
I thought about intake valve to exhuast valve size ratio of the slant six and compared it to other engines and came to the conclusion that the slant six could use a much larger intake valve while retaining the stock exhaust valve. By only installing larger intake valve I cut my machining costs and parts needed. (Please share thoughts)
So I installed 1.81" big block mopar exhaust valves on the intakes and extensive bowl porting on both the intake and exhuast ports. I left the runners and floors pretty much stock, just gasket matching.
Had the head milled .100" and the deck milled for a 10.2 comp ratio. Enginebldr 340 springs and retainers and they even come with the single groove keepers needed for the new valves!
Put it together and the pushrods were to long. A good time to try my cut and weld rockers rather than buy new pushrods. Plus the comp 264 cam I have has a little less lift than advertised.
The stock rockers averaged about 1.47 ratio. Now they're about 1.58 after cutting about .070" and I was able to adjust for pushrod length.
We'll see how they hold up, so far so good. My welding skills I would describe as average at best so they're not so pretty but I think they're strong enough.

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Franklin
'61 Valiant


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 25, 2009 9:04 pm 
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Turbo EFI

Joined: Tue May 17, 2005 4:26 pm
Posts: 1237
Location: CBS Newfoundland Canada
Car Model:
i used a 360, 1.88 cut to 1.80, on my high compression engine with a 1.60 ex valve, i worked really good. nice looking pocket work on your head.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 5:05 am 
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Turbo Slant 6

Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 11:11 pm
Posts: 660
Location: Cincinnati
Car Model:
Hi,
Did you do this to a 170 slant 6? If so, would you use the same approach on a 225? Would like to hear how it responds to valve sizes you chose. Cool project! nico


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:04 am 
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Joined: Mon Oct 21, 2002 11:08 am
Posts: 17200
Location: Blacksburg, VA
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Nice work and nice pics!

Some folks have also moved the Int valve over toward the exh and used a smaller exh valve to change the int/exh flow ratio. 1.80/1.40 or thereabouts without bore notches.

Lou

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 9:11 am 
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Turbo EFI

Joined: Tue May 17, 2005 4:26 pm
Posts: 1237
Location: CBS Newfoundland Canada
Car Model:
it was a 225,i went from a .030 over bore with 318valves and 10.7/1 compression running 13.40et`s, then i went .060 over bore 360 valves and 11.4 compression running 12.80et`s,the 60ft times really pickup with the extra compression, 1.90`s to 1.70`s.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 12:51 pm 
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Guru
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Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2002 4:32 pm
Posts: 4880
Location: Working in Silicon Valley, USA
Car Model:
Be sure to check your spring pressures... the BB Mopar valves tipically use a taller spring and a 1.8 installed height. 340 springs are shorter.
DD


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 4:39 pm 
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Turbo Slant 6
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Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:30 pm
Posts: 699
Location: Nweberg, OR
Car Model:
When/where is there benefits for the larger valves. I know that it's common practice no matter what engine you run. I've seen EngrBldrs valves commonly used for cam/compression/carb builds. I haven't seen such large valves, but I'm very interested now.
Why did you go with a larger intake and same exhaust? What would be the benefit of one being larger over the other for N/A, super, turbo builds? Last, can you cut down exhaust valves? Sorry for all the questions at once, but I've been curious ever since I realised that 302 valves would work or a lot of chevy stock ones with some minor modifications.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 6:28 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 4:48 pm
Posts: 5835
Location: Burton BC canada
Car Model:
Depends on what you want to do and how you chose to get there.

For me 1.72 intake and 1.50ex works...in conjunction with a split duration cam (280intake/270 ex)

Mebbe Mr Hemi runs a long exhaust duration cam.......or mebbe big lift on the exhaust.

....I bet he isnt terbowed.....

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 7:47 pm 
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TBI Slant 6

Joined: Fri May 30, 2003 4:32 pm
Posts: 131
Location: Northwest FL
Car Model:
I bought the valves directly from Ferrea in FL.
Part #F5053 1.810" X 3/8" X .4910".
I had to use shims to get the right spring height but it wasn't much. I made sure they didn't sink the valves down when they machined.
I'm runnin a comp 264 cam just because that's what I had. My thought was the slant head needed more help on the intake side.
This is just a high compression daily driver motor.

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Franklin
'61 Valiant


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 5:12 am 
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Poser
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Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:18 pm
Posts: 3136
Location: Indy
Car Model:
With a 10.2 comp ratio I assume premium is what you will put in the tank? What is the rule of thumb for pump gas? How much can you get away with? I know that with more overlap you can bring down static compression. Just curious, thanks!

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66 Lil' Red Piggie Valiant (Mater Crusher) - Thanks Zilla!!!!! 72 Demon (Number 1 Son's)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 7:07 am 
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Board Sponsor & SL6 Racer
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Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 4:48 pm
Posts: 5835
Location: Burton BC canada
Car Model:
There are 3 easy ways to measure compression.

You refer to " ten to one"....that is static compression ratio. ,,,,a calculation based on cylinder volume BDC compared to volume at TDC.....mine is 9.5:1

you referred to overlap ....that is a component of dynamic compression ratio ,,,,a calculation based on static CR and valve timing.....mine is 8.48:1

another way is cylinder cranking pressure....mine is about 165/175lbs

All these numbers work for me....today with todays 87 fuel on the right day....sometimes

I spent a ton of time with several on-line calculators before I chose a cam for my already established CR. I chose a Dynamic CR I could live with on the street.

Performance requires homework....or a ton of guess and try

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 2:22 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2002 7:27 pm
Posts: 14743
Location: Park Forest, Illinoisy
Car Model: 68 Valiant
My junk is at just about 11-1 static. It ran well on regular 87 back when I drove it on the street.

It would pick up about a tenth on 93.

It would slow down 2 tenths on 100. :shock:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 5:31 pm 
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Poser
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Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:18 pm
Posts: 3136
Location: Indy
Car Model:
Sandy and Zilla thank you! If I was building a a Chevy ( been there -couple of smblks) or a 318 ( major sleeper) or a 440 (my personal fav) I think I would have fewer questions. Sure I had help. But........ I have learned more by screwing around with this six cylinder then all of the above. I enjoy the challenge. I am a teacher and I want to thank ALL of you for taking the time to teach me!

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66 Lil' Red Piggie Valiant (Mater Crusher) - Thanks Zilla!!!!! 72 Demon (Number 1 Son's)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 6:46 pm 
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Turbo Slant 6
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Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:30 pm
Posts: 699
Location: Nweberg, OR
Car Model:
+1
I'm planning on helping a friend with his 70 Firebird and building the engine over getting a Pep Boys rebuild. I've learned a ton from this site and continue to read and expirement hoping to try and give back too.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2009 6:46 pm 
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Board Sponsor & Moderator
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Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2002 7:27 pm
Posts: 14743
Location: Park Forest, Illinoisy
Car Model: 68 Valiant
Your in deep poo if Sandy and I are teaching. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

At least my shop is closer to you than his is. :D

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