I'm the proud owner of a 1982 dodge diplomat with a 225 /six. she runs pretty good, no smoke or anything like that, but she failed smog miserably. during the pre smog under hood visual, the tech noticed a vacuum line disconnected from a little black box on the passenger side firewall. there are 2 of those boxes, one apparently is a vent of sorts (guessing because of the "sponge" on it.) and the other is where the line goes. but when connected, the car runs like crap. you literally have to hold the gas while in drive to keep her running, all the while she is sputtering and choking. What is the little box for? what do i replace to make her right. I had a mechanic replace all of the vacuum lines a while ago, and now i think he missed something. I usually work on my own cars but was in a rush


please help. registration time is near and i need my car

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Put your seatbelt on. Im gonna try something

The last few years of \6 passenger cars (which includes your '82) were/are a smog nightmare. Vacuum hoses, wires, boxes and widgets everywhere, and a delicately-balanced and failure-prone primitive feedback carburetion system that tends to go off calibration if you sneeze at it. Do you have the factory service manual? You will need it to get this corrected.

The little black box with the sponge could be an atmospheric (baro) sense line filter. Have you tried cleaning the "sponge"?

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一期一会
Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.

unfortunately i don't have a FSM yet. as soon as i get the extra dough, i will. yes i tried cleaning the "sponge" but it only deteriorated. i've been trying to follow the vacuum diagram under the hood to find out where the line comes from, but the label is so far gone i cant use it

thanks for the reply. i really appreciate the advice. this is my first slant six but second car with this body style. I also had a fifth avenue with the 318, but she passed smog no problem ununtil the engine seized (200,000 mile engine. oil pump went out on the freeway).

i really look forward to all of the helpful wisdom on this site. thanks again

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Put your seatbelt on. Im gonna try something

Since you're in a hurry, suggest you spend the $25 on a 1-year subscription for your car to www.alldatadiy.com . All the info in the FSM, plus all TSBs and updates, online and in printable form.

You really cannot get anywhere on fixing this without that info...and it was hard enough to find professional mechanics who could make 'em run right when they were new, let alone 23 years down the line!

I see you're in California. That complicates matters greatly: It's not enough to have clean exhaust emissions; you also must have every underhood component and system set up exactly as the factory had it. In other states you can often rework the factory systems, substituting more modern/less unreliable parts or even eliminating some of the controls altogether, but that dawg don't hunt in California. Also, California emission system is more complex than the Federal system in '82. So...either get an FSM or get AlldataDIY!

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一期一会
Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.

I feel for you. Much of the wisdom around these forums is geared to mimimalizing those bloated vacuum systems. They can become troublesome after 20 some years of negelect.

I am also residing in a pollution control state which requires visual as well as the sniffer test. I agree with Dan that the FSM is gonna be an invaluable tool. I've been studying for about a year and a half, and I still don't fully understand how to repair all the worn out vacuum systems on my 75, 80, and 85 slant sixes.

In order to make it work, you'll need to learn what all of the parts should actually be doing and then test them for correct operation. This will take some real dedication. I have found that searching on the advanced auto parts website, I can browse my model car and look at the pictures of the emissions parts to start giving names to the parts in question. If you right click on the part, you can get a path to the image and post it when asking questions here. This sometimes jogs the memory of others on this site.

Often, disconnecting a control box is just a mask of the real problem, such as a blown gasket in the carb, so you will neeed to do a little detective work to see which part is doing it's job, and which needs rebuilt or replaced.

Sorry, but this is a bad situation because often a mechanic will get paid by the hour instead of for actually fixing the problem. My local mechanic doesn't seem to care how much is origional as long as it isn't pumping out pollution. It also helps that I put very little miles on my rides.

I've seen some ads on ebay for full vacuum diagrams. Might be worthwhile to get one for your car, but I've never purchased one myself.

I'll keep watching and offer real help when I can.

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1980 Aspen 225 super six

After sleeping on it, I wanted to also suggest you check out the 'F and M body' forum over at allpar.com

There arn't as many slant six guys on that forum, but someone might have a manual with the body specific vacuum diagram you need. It's a longshot, but doesn't hurt to try.

You may need a vacuum gauge to do tests and track down the fault. The right tools make a job easier.

Good luck and let us know what you find.

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1980 Aspen 225 super six

thanks for the tips guys.

for now i found a smog guy thatll pass it for a small fee. thatll buy me some time to replace everything ie: carb, cat converter, 02 sensor, etc. itll also buy me some time to find a cheap rebuilt engine i can swap in. (oil consumption is driving me nuts. 1 quart per 500 miles driven +/-.

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Put your seatbelt on. Im gonna try something

Some of that has got to be a leak?

Not saying it's not possible, but WOW, that's a lot of oil. I thought mine really burned it up, but not like that.

I must say, that a fresh oil change makes it last a little longer in mine. Sometimes it's tempting to skip the oil change when it's burning so much, I feel like I'm changing it a quart at a time. Gas leaking out of the fuel pump into the block will thin out the oil and make it burn really fast.(ask how I know) Smell your oil to check. How many miles on that motor?

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1980 Aspen 225 super six

the cars odom says 12,7xxx but more then likely, its 100,xxx or 200,xxx.

theres never an oil spot in the driveway. i know cause i park in the same spot. i just changed the oil ~200 miles ago (pre smog tune up) and shes about half a quart low. maybe its a leak that only happens when the engine is under load??? Im guessing cause i do mostly freeway driving. oh and the only time she smokes is when i rev it high in park or neutral. she leaves black residue on the gravel.

that leaking feul pump theory is actually making sense. feul mileage has gone down a lil bit. i was thinking it was because i was getting off the freeway sooner and taking a back road a lil ways to work to skip traffic (not really because everyone else does the same thing )

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Put your seatbelt on. Im gonna try something

This isn't usually oil. Grap some off the inside edge of the tailpipe and rub it between your fingers. It isn't oily is it? If it's grit, then it's carbon deposits caused by unburnt fuel. The spit on the driveway is caused my moisture mixing with the carbon. My truck is this way due to valve problems.

What that means, is that you've got an ignition miss or your carb is adjusted too rich. Which seems to jive with what your smog test has said. It's possible that a valve problem is at fault, but not very likely, since your car is new enough to have hardened valve seats.

If you've recently replaced the plugs, wires, cap and rotor, what did the plugs look like. Was there clear signs of oil consumption?

I'm guessing that your carb and vacuum lines are the source of your problems, but you'll never get the carb adjusted right if the ignition system is worn out.

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1980 Aspen 225 super six

Wow, it's rare to find a smog guy that'll pass you in CA (keep it quiet, the EPA/BAR is everywhere!). Try to not replace components unless you're sure they are bad - save yourself some money and time.

Do you have the printout of the failed smog test? What gases did it fail on (HC, CO, NO), and by how much? What was the O2 percentage? This can be a clue to what might be wrong. How did the timing check out?

Steve

1966 Dodge Dart GT

well i cant find this years smog paperwork (probably in the file cabinet, too tired to search) but i found the one from a couple years back when it barely passed.

15 mph test: %CO2: %o2: HC: max ave meas CO: max ave meas
14.2 0.4 126 52 125 .92 .20 .43

NO (ppm)
max ave meas
1180 475 1095


25 MPH test CO2 O2 HC max ave meas CO max ave meas
14.2 .7 99 32 99 .72 .14 .12

NO (ppm)
max ave meas
1040 499 506



like i said, this test is from a couple of years ago when it kinda passed. as soon as i find the current results ill post them. thanks again for all the help.its really hard to find people wo are willing to help other people this hard when they dont even know them. thanks again. i really appreciate the help

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Put your seatbelt on. Im gonna try something

oh dabout the grittiness of the soot, yes it is a lil gritty. and to add to the pot, whenever i put her into drive within 5 minutes of starting in the morning, she dies. i have to let her warm up at least 5-10 minutes(not possible because she never warms up to past the first line on the guage. she runs ice cold)

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Put your seatbelt on. Im gonna try something

The high HC numbers on the smog test support the "gas in the oil" theory, and/or possible misfire. Can you smell gas on the dipstick? You can also hold a lit match under a wet dipstick, and if it flares up, that means gas in the oil.

While you're replacing stuff, might wanna add PCV valve to the list. Cheap and easy to replace.

I'll try to check AllData this weekend for info on hose routing, etc. (we were offline last weekend). If that black box isn't the baro sensor housing, I wanna find out what it is! At first I thought charcoal canister, but it sounds too small, wrong shape, etc.

Steve

1966 Dodge Dart GT

It is? Maybe by today's standards, yes... I've seen late model Toyotas provide many thousands of miles of service while burning no more than 1/2 quart, if even that much. But that's not the playing field we're talking about here.

I've spent only about two decades of playing with slant 6s... and I've never owned one that was younger than about 15 years old by the time I got it. Most were factory motors with between 70k and 200k miles, in A-body vehicles. So this is probably closer to the playing field in which you've found yourself now. Just for reference... I've seen quart consumptions anywhere from 1500 miles to as rapidly as 450 miles. I've also seen that it can make a measurable difference whether I choose a steady speed of 65 mph or 70 mph.

One of these days, I'll have the luxury of playing with a fresh rebuild. I'm very curious to know what sort of consumption is valid, under those conditions.

Remember, a tiny bit of consumption due to a "loose" engine does help the engine last longer. Volvo 240s were particularly famous for that... my Dad's 1980 consumed a very steady 800 mile/quart diet pretty much from new. For that car, it was normal. For most other cars, the dealer will often tell you that if it's more than 1000 miles/quart that's fine.

Just to put it all in perspective.

- Erik

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Lots of early Valiants and Barracudas have crossed my path.
Also a handful of other toys for variety now and then.