Did my front brake job. New drums, new shoes, and converted from the '63 snap-down self-adjusters to the 'improved' snap-up adjusters from '68-up. Used all NOS Chrysler hardware and springs.

Brakes were making weird squeaking/growling noises as of this evening driving around. Didn't sound right or correct.

As soon as I could get into the garage, I pulled the drum off the front drivers side, and the spring-loaded self-adjusting cable was off its guide and the pivot spring was pushing the tongue of the adjuster down, scoring the inside of my new drum. What the hey?? Put the cable back on the guide, and the tongue of the adjuster went back to it's appropriate position of just under 1/2 way up the starwheel adjustor. Why would it have ever fallen off??

Pulled the passenger front side, and the self adjusting cable is too slack: the pivot spring is positioning the adjuster tongue under the starwheel, down into the drum on that side too. Again...what the hey?? Everything should be taught and in position. I can't even get that side to taught up: the brake shoes are fully in and yet there's not enough tension on the cable, even with the return spring inside it's trap to pull the tongue halfway up the starwheel on that side. What did I do wrong here?? When I put it together, I didn't have this issue.

according to the drum brake picture, the adjusting lever should be
at slightly below the midpoint of the starwheel.
the adjusting cable spring hook should hook on near top
of adjusting lever into the cutout area.

When assembling, the adjuster lever spring should go on the
peg pivot first, then the lever goes behind the spring and the hole
on lever into the pivot.

also the eye of the adjusting cable should be position outside of
the anchor plate and behind the primary spring hook.
or sandwiched between the anchor plate and primary spring hook.

also, if the adjusting cable too slack. it may need to loop around the
cable guide, which is positioned near middle part of secondary shoe
and held down by secondary return spring.

Maybe this will help



Richard

_________________
Part of Tyrde-Browne Racing

First thing that comes to mind is that the cable guide isn't seated flush against the brake shoe. I seem to need three hands to hold the guide in place, fit the return spring into the brake shoe, then lever the spring over the anchor pin. If i'm not careful, the locating shoulder on the guide doesn't stay in the hole & the guide won't work properly. Once or twice I've also had return springs where the hook that goes into the shoe wasn't quite the right shape & again it allowed the guide to get out of position.

If the guide is ok then I take the cable & give it 1 or 2 twists before I hook the end to the adjuster lever. Twist one way & it'll loosen the braid & "lengthen" it, twist the other way & it'll tighten the braid & make it some shorter.

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63 Valiant Wagon
225 - 4 bbl

Thanks Wagons. So a few things on this post:

1. The guide is flush: I've checked. Yes, it's a bear to get it together without throwing everything off, but I managed.
2. Hook on the return spring went into the shoe hole fine so that's not the issue.
3. Thanks for your comment about lengthening or shortening the cable via twisting it. I had not thought of that. I did check the cable length against an uninstalled NOS stock cable, and the length appeared the same. The most confusing thing is that when I installed all the new hardware, shoes, etc., everything (including the self adjusting lever and spring) lined up and held taut exactly where they are supposed to be. Now on the front passenger's side, they won't stay.

Here's a little more info to help diagnose what's going on here:

A) Right front drum is bedding in nicely, and the surface on the inside of the drum where the shoes are rubbing is smooth.
B) Left front drum is bedding in, but I don't know if it's bedding in nicely: the surface of the inside of the new drum feels 'wavy' and slightly ridged. There's also an abundance of brake dust within this new drum, far more than on the passenger front. Sidebar: I had to have the drums turned to get them to fit. The right front had the right clearance, but the left front was tight and wouldn't turn without scraping (beyond acceptability), so this may be where the dust is coming from on this side - wearing down the brake pad.

Update: after yanking off the drums, moving the adjusting levers to where they should be (mid-way up the starwheel) so they don't rub the drum, re-installing the loose cable, and re-installing the drum, I stomped on the brakes a few times to equalize the shoes with the drum, and I could spin both wheels perfectly with just the right amount of 'rub' from the new pads.

Took the car on a short test drive. Came back and hoisted the car again to check. Left front wheel was still fine but the right wheel is stiff and feels like something is rubbing again.

I'm so at a loss. I'm wondering what I'm doing wrong. Here's photos to help tell the story:

When i assembled my 9" rear drum brakes. I remember
i had to rotate the adjusting lever upward, then used a
long nose pliar to grab the hook on the adj cable and
hook it on to the adj lever.
Then i positioned the adj lever on the star wheel about slightly
below mid point. the teeth on the star wheel kept the lever
from sliding up.

On your picture i could not see the anchor plate, maybe the
flash blocks it out? not sure how critical that part is for
the adjusting functions. You can always make one up

Check diameter of these two drums, they have be the same. If one drum is turned larger than the other contact of shoes to respective drum side to side will be less for the oversize drum. This could be why one side is scuffing off more shoe material than the other because it is wearing in to fit the radius. This mismatch will cause pulling to the side with larger shoe contact to drum.

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67' Dart GT Convertible; the old Chrysler Corp.
82' LeBaron Convertible; the new Chrysler Corp
07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

Thanks wjajr, I will check. But the drums were both turned and surfaced an equal amount - think they took off a thou. Couldn't really see why one side had more clearance than the other initially, but once surfaced, they both seemed relatively similar. It's not pulling to one side when I brake - that's good. But it was odd to see so much dust on one side, and not the other, in just this short amount of time.

There is no anchor plate for a '63 Dart. For the full-size Dodge models, yes, but for '63 Dart, no. The FSM does not show one.

So I pulled off each rim last night, and found the levers underneath the starwheels again. Twisted the self-adjusting cables to tighten and shorten them. That seemed to work to shorten up the cable enough to hold the lever tongues in the correct position against the starwheels. Though the torsion 'twist' now on the cables wants to hold the tongue away from the starwheels a bit.

Did a test drive today and for the first few miles, everything seemed kosher and better than it had been.

Then, I started hearing a high pitched whine. It got a little louder every time I stepped on the brakes.

Pulled into my garage, jacked the car up, and spun each wheel. Each wheel spins freely with no noise. Stepped on the brakes while the wheels were spinning and each one stopped with no whine. This is just so odd.

Is it standard to have all sorts of squeaks and whines when breaking in new drums and knew shoes? The noises I'm hearing don't sound right at all. I keep pulling the drums off to try and fix what I think is a problem. This last effort should have fixed any squeaking and self-adjusting hardware issue, but with the whine, I can only think there's something rubbing where it shouldn't and now I'm going to pull them off again.

This learning curve is a bitch. I didn't know drum brakes could cause so many issues. Is this what happens when you upgrade hardware from an old style to newer?

When I got my car, the first thing I went through was the brakes(9" drums all around). I bought complete brake kits for front and rear, replaced everything that could be replaced(Shoes,Springs,Adjusters,Wheel Cylinders,Lines,Master Cylinder, had the drums turned, an so on.)
I heard all kinds of popping and scraping the first time out, I pulled the drums and couldn't find anything wrong. Over time I slowly replaced most of the New parts with the old parts(springs, adjusters and such)hoping for a process of elimination and the noises went away! The original springs on the brakes were much heavier coils than the replacements.(everything I got in the kits looked alot cheaper, or cheaply made from what I was taking off)
Converting to Front Discs and Larger Rear Drums in the near future.

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1964 Dart GT

I hear you. That's why I went with Chrysler NOS parts to replace my originals. And why I'm surprised I'm dealing with the self-adjuster cable issues, as well as all these squeaks and whines that were never there before and which I have yet to be able to solve.

Something else is coming up and I thought this might have more to do with the fact that I need to bleed the brakes than anything else.

My pedal is low, not high and hard where it needs to be. If I drive forward and depress the brake pedal, the car stops. If I reverse, the pedal sinks lower on the first press, and higher on the next. But if I shift and drive forward again, the pedal sinks quite low, and I must depress the brake pedal at least once more before the pedal rises again. What would be causing that issue? It's almost as if the shoes are shifting inside the drum. But they seem firmly anchored, the last time I checked.

Dual Master Cylinder? or single ? sounds like air in the lines somewhere.

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1964 Dart GT

Single now, but I am converting to dual. I have it - just have to put it on. now that I finally got the right junction block.

I would think if there's air in the lines, it would be far less consistent than it's being right now with the high-low pedal issue. Gut tells me it's related to adjusting the brakes, but I've already gone through the whole install-shoes-drums-scrape-scrape just barely, now they don't at all and it's good and dusty inside. Don't want to adjust them again if I can help it.