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Where is the Happy Medium
https://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=60232		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  six-tunes [ Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Where is the Happy Medium
Hey Guys,
I am about to drive myself crazy trying to decide which way to go for my engine build up. I've read the build matrix over and over. And still can't come to a conclusion. I was initially going to go with Aggressive Ted's Torquer build, but I think I wan't a tad more. Now remember my little slant is trapped in an ELEPHANT (D150 Short Box) So she has alot to get rolling. After all this happens she will no longer be my daily, but more of a Go to Sunday Meetin truck. I want an idle that is noticeable, I want torque to get the beast moving, And the most streetable power as possible with still ok street manners. I am going to keep the A833 or 8 1/4 rear. So whose recipe should I try to follow?

Also I've found a running complete 1976 225 in a D100 for 350 bucks. Is that about the fair going rate these days? Does a 1976 have a forged crank? And do they have the pre smog head?

Thanks again guys.
Author:  slantzilla [ Tue Sep 27, 2016 8:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
76 could be either cast or forged. That was the changeover year.
Author:  DusterIdiot [ Tue Sep 27, 2016 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Well...
Quote:
Also I've found a running complete 1976 225 in a D100 for 350 bucks. Is that about the fair going rate these days? Does a 1976 have a forged crank? And do they have the pre smog head?
Yeah, that's about the average price nowadays...1976 can be either, it's first year for cast crank, and last year for forged crank... You will have to look at the rear of the head to see if it's a 447 head (has exhaust injection hole at the rear of the head), or the 600 head (no port)... Pre-1975 heads are more likely to not have the ports...(but you get the spark plug tubes)....

When selecting a build you have to watch it... the bigger the cam the more compression is needed to keep it happy... also it will shift the power band to a higher rpm... so then you have to install some drag ratio gears (like 3.91's...)... not a problem if you have the A-833OD if you want to keep your mileage, but that's more money to add to making everything work together correctly.

the Aggressive Ted/RV10 build, or a little more compression and using an RV15 cam are still good choices for a truck....
Author:  six-tunes [ Wed Sep 28, 2016 3:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
At what duration @.050 does the slant get the lopey aggressive idle that I want. Is it weird to build an engine around a camshaft? Or build and engine around a sound? :roll: I like the lopey, aggressive sounding slants. So I think I may base my build around a 9.0:1 ish compression ratio, stock stroke, and rod length, and find a cam to match that. I hear alot about this Oregon Cams place. Also the later smog head like is on my truck now, with that port blocked off is it basically the same, runner, and combustion chamber wise as the earlier heads?

Another hurdle I have is finding a Machine shop that has a clue about a slant 6. I've already been told by one that they don't have the torque plate to bore my 6er.
Author:  DusterIdiot [ Wed Sep 28, 2016 4:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Lol...
You can get lopey pretty easily on any slant six with a mechanical camshaft... just set the valve lash about .002-004 too tight... it will get lopey... (I did this on my comp cam 252 one day and it sounded cool, but didn't do much for perfomance or mileage.. LOLOLOL....
Author:  1974duster kev [ Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:28 am ]
Post subject: 
My old NA motor had a good lope with 220@50 erson 270 cam then switched to the erson 280 230@50 510lift both on 108lsa even more lope lol

Kev
Author:  DusterIdiot [ Thu Sep 29, 2016 4:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Yep...
Both of those cams were good cams to work with, and very streetable... but the down side to them is that you will need to run much higher compression, and with a truck even with better rear gearing, your clutch may not approve of the new found power (assuming that you also port the head, use OS valves and go for the 4 barrel and dutra duals to get the most of the street/strip performance angle).
Author:  Rick Covalt [ Thu Sep 29, 2016 4:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
At what duration @.050 does the slant get the lopey aggressive idle that I want. Is it weird to build an engine around a camshaft? Or build and engine around a sound? Rolling Eyes I like the lopey, aggressive sounding slants.
You should build your engine to be what you would like it to be. Everyone else will have opinions, and as long as you put a good combination of parts together to reach your goal, you are the only one who needs to be happy.

I will say this. A lopey idle can't be heard while your driving and you will spend 99% of your time driving, not idling. :lol: :lol

My truck has the Oregon 819 cam in it and it is not lopey, and idles fine even with the stock convertor. It is a 220 @ .050 just for reference. My truck runs great with headers, 4 barrel & big valves and still can get close to 22 MPG on the road with the right gears.

Put in the 3.91-4.10 or even 4.30 gears with the OD and you will be surprised at how much that one change will wake up your truck and get you moving.
Author:  DusterIdiot [ Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Yep...
Quote:
as you put a good combination on parts together to reach your goal,
That's the big secret to every build, all the parts have to work or it becomes a family feud of compromises and trying to make things work that aren't in their calibration or comfy zone....

Like I said, if you go with a big lumpy high duration short lobe separation cam, you will need to have all the other parts to make it work... bigger duration cams like this bleed down cylinder pressure so they need a bit more compression to keep it happy...and the engine will want to breathe to make best use of all that and the higher lift... luckily a manual transmission is very tolerant of all of this, so no stall convertor to worry about...but like I said... I've withered out a number of clutches on hard launches with a car that is 1000lbs lighter than a truck...so just keep that in mind, you will be shaking down the weak links in the vehicle with all the performance (U-joints also aren't fond of hi-po engine manual tranny combinations...)

Rick's combination is a very good one, but I can also understand wanting to have that sound all the V-8 guys have when they over cam their engine...(except for the one's that over cam it so badly the engine almost stalls out at idle while it's loping in a street car...those guys are in their own special class....)
Author:  six-tunes [ Thu Sep 29, 2016 6:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
Great advice guys, thank you! Can someone post a link to Oregon Cam's website. The one that I found on google doesn't have a list with specs of any grinds for our engines. Also my truck has a hydraulic, so I guess I will be going back with that. That Oregon 819, is it hyd?

On a side note, I know I've added at least 50 to this vids views. This is one sweet sounding half dozen. Nothing wrong with a guy wanting to pull up to a cruise in and have folks say, "WHAT IS THAT, a 340? NAW, maybe a 360? NO that can't be it either?"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzLqDrM96Qw
Author:  DusterIdiot [ Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Here you go....
http://www.oregoncamshaft.com/cam-specs.html


With the right rockers and rocker shaft and proper lifters, you can convert your engine to mechanical...the 819 is a mechanical flat tappet camshaft lobe.
Author:  Rick Covalt [ Fri Sep 30, 2016 3:06 am ]
Post subject: 
There are several cam links in the FAQ Engines section.

http://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=38446
Author:  six-tunes [ Fri Sep 30, 2016 9:42 am ]
Post subject: 
So I found a Complete 1977 D100 at the local salvage yard this morning. The engine has not had A THING removed. The air cleaner lid was off but everything else was there. I reached in the cab and put the trans in Neutral (yep its got an 833 too), went back around to the engine bay and reached down and grabbed the bottom hub/pulley and crossed my fingers that she would roll over. Yep it did with ease, then got a little tight, then that magic sound I was hoping for HISSSSSSSSSSSS! The guy I needed to talk to about a price wasn't there. I'm going to call him here in a little bit. I want to get the engine and trans complete if I can.

After I left the salvage yard, I went by another Machine Shop who has been in business for longer than I've been alive. Talking with him he said he could machine a six no sweat. But he also said that the slant didn't require the use of a torque plate for boring???
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