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 Post subject: Whats causing the pull?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 4:42 am 
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Location: CA
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I have to hold my wheel at 10 or 11 o'clock to keep the car on a straight path. I'm pretty sure its not the brakes, it did it with the 9" drums and currently with the KH discs. Tires are in decent shape....

Figure the only things left are steering box and alignment. Is there any way to distinguish which is causing the pull without taking it to an alignment machine? The car was aligned when the tires were put on, but that was a few years ago and I don't (better stated, can't) recall if it pulled then.

Also, I need new leafs as they are tired from age but although they are low, they still are pretty even, so I don't think this could be it.

It is not a small amount either... if I let the wheel go on a flat road and let the car drive itself, I'll be completely in the next lane within, oh 50-75 feet. I'm not an excellent judge of distance but I can tell you that if anything the stated number would probably be lower.

I read recent posts about adjusting the power steering box but I want to find out the root cause first because I don't want to compensate for a problem by having the box oversteer in one direction.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 6:15 am 
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Location: Texas
Car Model: 1964 Valiant convertible 225 automatic
The most common reason for a car to pull is tires developing a "set". Try swapping front to rear and see if there is a change.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 8:34 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Location: Hamilton the STEEL CITY, ON
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You should also examine all your steering components for wear. You could have a balljoint that's ready to pop off. You sure no one took it for a joyride and hit a curb?

The box could be off center too I guess, but you didnt mention any suspension work recently so Im assuming nothings been apart lately. Is there any play in the wheel?

You could also take some string and check for toe-in that way. Line up the drivers wheel so with the string tied off in the back of the car, it contacts the front and back of the front tire. You can pinch it between the back rim and the hubcap and draw it tight, the rear tire will align it to the front but make sure the string isnt touching the body anywhere. Then just draw it close to the back of the front tire, and see how close the string is to the front of the tire. Once the left front wheel has been positioned straight ahead, check the other side with the string. If either the front or the back of the right front tire touches the string first, the toe is off. Dont be too picky though, sometimes an alignment shop will toe the wheels in a tiny bit so the car tracks easier while rolling forward.

It sounds to me like something's either bent or worn out.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 9:15 pm 
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The front end was completely rebuilt 5 years ago before the previously mentioned alignmet was done. Replaced the lower balljoints a few weeks ago when I went to the KH brakes and everything still looked ok. There was no up and down play in the wheels so I don't think the upper joints are worn.

I'm the only one that drives the car. Never rammed it into a curb.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 10:09 pm 
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Location: Stony Mountain, Manitoba, Canada
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tires :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 10:49 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2003 9:54 pm
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Location: Canby, Oregon
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I'm thinking tires also. Make sure air pressure is at proper level. Either do what 64 Convert suggested or just swap side to side. Either way, it will either stop pulling, or pull the other way, if the tire or wheel is the culprit.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 11:23 pm 
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I'm thinking its your strut rod bushing(s) or your lower control arm bushing(s) or a combination of both. Been there, done that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2004 11:34 pm 
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Hmm sounds like I need to get the front end in the air again to swap tires and check some stuff out. Now only if the silly rain/frost/freezing weather would give itself up for a while.


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 Post subject: ?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:30 am 
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EFI Slant 6
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Incorrect (or uneven side to side) caster will affect braking. That would require an alignment. Make sure the strut rod bushings nuts have not backed off. You can check toe-in and toe-out, yourself.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:56 am 
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If the ball joints were replaced, the front end needs to be realinged

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2004 6:01 am 
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Well it was doing this before the disc swap so that shouldn't be an issue.

However, the lower ball joint to spindle bolts are shoulderd, as is the ball joint studs (the only thing I removed when upgrading to discs was the spindle and lower ball joint, everything else stayed intact). So once everything is torqued down I would imagine the alignment would be back to where it was before the replacment, or at least very close to it. The pull I am seeing in my opinion is past "just a little off".


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 Post subject: pulls
PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2004 4:58 pm 
It was last aligned 5 years ago when the front end was rebuilt?? GET IT ALIGNED! Did you change upper control arms with the disc brake swap?
The UCA is where the adjustments are made on this car. Make sure that they check and adj. front end height as a 1st step in the alignment, once they verify that all parts are tight. this can affect the alignment big time. I prove this to people every day on adjustable torsion bar cars and trucks. Take the readings as the car comes in, then adjust the ride height, and the readings go nuts. This is also something to keep in mind for those who want to lower their cars. A sloppy gearbox can cause a car to be wishy washy, but very rarely a pull. Toe will NOT cause a pull, although it may seem so since the tie rods also center the steering wheel. I can set your wheel anywhere you want, and still not wear the tires, and not pull, as long as "total toe" is OK. Toe centers itself while driving, regardless of how off center it appears on the alignment screen. This is where your steering wheel position comes into play. You have roughly the same weight on both sides of the car, all tires are going the same speed and direction, the same centrifugal forces, etc. so the car is NOT gonna go down the road with different toe settings on each side. You just have to steer to equalize the toe, this is NOT necessarily a pull. If you have a pull, either your caster or camber is set way different side to side, mismatched tires, (Both same brand and model, not just size)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:16 pm 
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I did not touch the UCA, or ball joint, or height adjustment when doing the disc conversion. Also, as stated, this "pull" was happening before the disc upgrade.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2004 8:39 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Location: Hamilton the STEEL CITY, ON
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I agree... I would get it aligned if all parts appear OK. I can get a front end done for about $40 CDN up here... its not all that bad.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2004 8:56 pm 
A good alignment is like going a good tuneup on the engine, the most logical 1st step before tearing into it to modify everything, even w/o any curbs, potholes, etc., 5 years of wear and tear is reason enuf to have the alignment at least checked. A big spread (difference) between the 2 sides is much like a shopping cart with a stuck wheel... it wants to go in circles.
Your alignment could be all within specs, BUT if one side is at the low end of the range and the other is at the top of the spec range, that would be enuf to pull. You could also set the entire front end out of range and have it drive fine, but eat tires, etc. if the 2 sides are close in relation to ech other. Here in the Midwest, road constructors put quite a bit of crown into our roads, and I often offset camber OR caster to compensate, BUT the other should be as close to dead even as it can be. I usually go for even camber, 1/2 degree offset on caster, (less on drivers side) within the range given for that particular car. If a car is gonna pull alignment wise, it will be towards the MOST camber, or the LEAST caster. Make sure that the front end height is checked and corrected 1st. Make sure that the tires are the same brand, and have similar wear, not 1 new and the one across worn out. Also same size and air pressure equal, too.


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